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G.O.P. Newcomers Set Out to Undo Obama Victories

CaptainCourtesy said:
So tell me, Conservative. If I find one successful business person who is liberal, will you concede that your first comment, above, was nothing more than a ridiculous hyperpartisan claim that has no basis in reality?
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Of course there are plenty of liberal business people. They sure must live a dichotomy of reality between self loathing over being successful in business, and holding the mantra that business is greed. No wonder they are always so angry.


j-mac
 
Of course, kick the can down the road... not a solution, a shirking of responsibility
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The Congress is given the responsibility to promote the general welfare of the people but not allowed to define the specific condition that the people deserve. The intent of the Constitution was for the states and local governments to provide what ever their citizens needed in the form of welfare and for the rest of their citizens to take care of themselves.

In the 60s my home town in central Texas didn’t have a welfare office. My cousins - 7 boys and 5 girls - who lived there – because their father was too lazy to work in the west Texas oil field - - WARNING – - liberals may not want to read further - - WORKED and lived off of the land. They raised their own vegetables and caned them. They hunted the local country side for rabbits, squirrels, deer – not many deer near town in those days - . They harvested pecans from the trees on the near by creek. They picked wild berries. They worked as a group picking cotton and doing other farm work. Their dad laid around a bait shop selling minnows that the boys caught out of the creek.

Now, every one of those boy have great work ethics. One of them owns the house that my dad sold them when we moved the second time. And he owns all of the land around the old house.

But when the county bureaucrats learned that they could get government to give to poor people they created poor people to give it to. They built a little low cost apartment complex and invited the pregnant girls that were live with their mothers to move in for free and get free food for the baby. The girls liked not having their mothers trying to keep them from getting pregnant again and they did get pregnant again. Some of them are still trapped in those run down building and we see the same thing all over the country.

Those poor girls would have had a chance to make something of themselves if they had not been given a live of dependence.

I have two brothers – one is a millionaire and the other is living in a thirty year old trail house out in the woods. The second brother was going to build a nice house out there in the woods but he never got around to it. The first brother started four companies and three of them failed – costing me a lot of money – but he never stopped working day and night to succeed. When the second brother’s wife asked me for money I reminded her that I had caught her and my brother an occupation that was in great demand. But it meant going back to work in the oil field. They have three grown boys who share their work ethic so they too need jobs. As of last week the second brother has gone back to work in the oil field and is thinking that it might be a good idea to train the boys to do the same type of work. It pays $200 a day and the current boom will last for years. It is an easy job, but you do have to be out there on the rig to get the money.

Sorry I got off on self reliance. Our country has to get back to work or we will fade into the darkness. The idea that we can drill of oil where ever the oil is, is insane.
 
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upsideguy said:
Of course when you click on the actual details (.pdf files) your get "The system cannot find the file specified. " That pretty much sums up the Republican position... there is none.

* Number one: let families and businesses buy health insurance across state lines

And you get the same results you got when you allowed credit card companies to set up shop in the states with the lowest regulations


* Number two: allow individuals, small businesses, and trade associations to pool together and acquire health insurance at lower prices, the same way large corporations and labor unions do.

OK.... can't argue with that..

* Number three: give states the tools to create their own innovative reforms that lower health care costs.

Of course, kick the can down the road... not a solution, a shirking of responsibility


* Number four: end junk lawsuits that contribute to higher health care costs by increasing the number of tests and procedures that physicians sometimes order not because they think it's good medicine, but because they are afraid of being sued.

OK... fine for point #20... but emphasizes the shallowness of the republican thought on the matter given that malpractice insurance is less than 1/2 of 1% of total cost. If the 4th plank of your platform deals with the trivial expense, well that is pretty superficial. We certainly need superficial solutions to serious problems (but then the Reps are so good at the superficial)...
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HMMM....sorry, I got to it before but can't now.
I found it here, but it's not easy for me to read.



Republicans Release Their Own Health Care System Reform Bill - Kaiser Health News
 
zimmer said:
And it will be bi-partisan! (Notice the NYT journOlists refrain from mentioning that bit?)

How about the Senate? Will we see bi-partisanship there? Or more bull-ship? ROTFLOL.
Readying the noose for 2012.
Beautiful.



Decisive, historic victories are game changing. I wonder... how many Dems that voted for the stink bomb called ObamaKare will vote to repeal it?

Any guesses?

.
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I do not mean to sound like a skeptic or a cynic but unless Obama and Biden die in a plane crash and there is a majority of people in both the house and senate that do not like what Obama has done then all these promises made are garbage and those new republicans know this because Obama will use his veto power. At most they are going to introduce some bills while Obama is in office and while they do not have a veto proof majority so they can claim they tried. After they use the issues to get into more power they will ignore it and use that one or two times when Obama was president to claim that they tried to do something about it and it didn't work.
 
Im sitting here watching cspan. they are talking about the repeal and replace bill. What I find interesting is why the democrats that are speaking seem to be terrified that this simple yes or no vote ever go to the floor, even though we all know (at least I think we do) that while it may pass the house, it wont pass the senate and never even get to the president. Republicans are basically putting up the yes or no vote because its what they were elected on, its what they promised, even though most of them dont expect it to pass both houses. Its more of a ... we said we would do it, and we did, im sorry it didnt pass. My question ..or curiosity... is this. If this is the case, which by all accounts it seems to be, why are democrats so freaked out about a simple yes or no vote? They seem to be really scared of this vote.
My question is this... Do you think that more democrats in the senate than are being admitted to will be voting to repeal and replace and that there is actually a chance it could pass both houses????
 
Deuce said:
I hope they also plan to allow hospitals to turn away ER patients who can't afford to pay. You know, since paying for the healthcare of others is so terrible for us. If we're not going to do it efficiently, maybe we should stop doing it.
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People really should think their positions trough. You're right of course. But too many are both unwilling to turn people away, but refuse to actually address the issue.
 
j-mac said:
Of course there are plenty of liberal business people. They sure must live a dichotomy of reality between self loathing over being successful in business, and holding the mantra that business is greed. No wonder they are always so angry.


j-mac
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Only if you see life though the lense of a mindless sterotype.
 
j-mac said:
Of course there are plenty of liberal business people. They sure must live a dichotomy of reality between self loathing over being successful in business, and holding the mantra that business is greed. No wonder they are always so angry.


j-mac
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I really don't think Ben & Jerry of Ben & Jerry's Ice Cream fame are self loathing. They actually seem quite happy IMHO.
 
Conservative said:
So I take it you support Obamacare? You have told us what you don't like about the GOP Plan, are there things you don't like about Obamacare? Why is it the Federal Government's responsibility to provide for personal responsibility issues?

Do you realize that the high ER costs are paid by the states and local communities and that a large part of those costs are illegal alien costs? Why should the people of your state pay the costs in my state?
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Yes, there are a great many things I do not like about Obamacare. I think he wimped out and produced such a water-downed compromised deal that it probably doesn't achieve the objective. That said, when it comes to national heathcare, I am very liberal. I believe our healthcare system is a substantial failure (highest cost system in the world producing very mediocre results and not available to all). I am for a single-payer system off the Canadian model...... So have fun with that.....
 
upsideguy said:
Yes, there are a great many things I do not like about Obamacare. I think he wimped out and produced such a water-downed compromised deal that it probably doesn't achieve the objective. That said, when it comes to national heathcare, I am very liberal. I believe our healthcare system is a substantial failure (highest cost system in the world producing very mediocre results and not available to all). I am for a single-payer system off the Canadian model...... So have fun with that.....
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What experience do you have with our current healthcare system and how has it hurt you or your family? Name for me one govt. run program that cost what it was supposed to cost, did what it was supposed to do, solved a problem, and went away? What was the original estimate of medicare and what did it cost? How much waste, fraud, and abuse are in that single payer system?
 
Shred this 2400 hundred + page monstrosity, put in a good single payer plan and we could get on with the job of decreasing our debt and creating some jobs.:2wave:
 
donc said:
Shred this 2400 hundred + page monstrosity, put in a good single payer plan and we could get on with the job of decreasing our debt and creating some jobs.:2wave:
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Why do you have such faith in a single payer system cutting costs. Can you give me any example of a single payer system being cost effective and providing excellent care and service? Like everything else in the liberal world rhetoric trumps substance. A single payer system sounds good but there is no history of it working. Why will it work now? 300 million people on a single payer system and that is going to be cost effective?
 
upsideguy said:
when it comes to national heathcare, I am very liberal. I am for a single-payer system off the Canadian model
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why do you presume anyone cares about your particular druthers, narcissus?

without links, you're only more hot air

meanwhile, claire mccaskill moves off the mandate

McCaskill moves away from mandate - David Catanese - POLITICO.com

ultra lib rockefeller regularly rips the epa

John Rockefeller takes aim at EPA - Darren Samuelsohn - POLITICO.com

the white house wednesday whiffed once again on those dastardly death panels (the nyt's story sunday about congressman blumenauer's email to his mates, celebrating but beseeching silence, brought evidently just too much heat)

Politics trump policy on 'death panels' - Brett Coughlin - POLITICO.com

fil reform is falling fast

Democrats' filibuster plan in jeopardy - Scott Wong and Manu Raju - POLITICO.com

and oblivious obama's new chief of staff is maladection to the left

Liberals scoff at Daley's new job | POLITICO 44

the chicago scion, ultimate wall street insider, opposed the public option and elizabeth warren (most of you clickers and submitters don't even know who she is---LOL!) and, as former fannie official daley is a living, breathing bullseye for industrious darrell issa

or so say the likes of moveon and journolist founder ezra klein

seeya in parliament, progressives
 
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donc said:
Shred this 2400 hundred + page monstrosity, put in a good single payer plan and we could get on with the job of decreasing our debt and creating some jobs.:2wave:
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So, explain to us how government run healthcare is going to decrease the debt?
 
Conservative said:
Why do you have such faith in a single payer system cutting costs. Can you give me any example of a single payer system being cost effective and providing excellent care and service? Like everything else in the liberal world rhetoric trumps substance. A single payer system sounds good but there is no history of it working. Why will it work now? 300 million people on a single payer system and that is going to be cost effective?
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If I had free health or HC I paid through the ass in taxes, I'd go to the doctor with every little sniffle. I'm sure others would do the same.
 
Conservative said:
Why do you have such faith in a single payer system cutting costs. Can you give me any example of a single payer system being cost effective and providing excellent care and service? Like everything else in the liberal world rhetoric trumps substance. A single payer system sounds good but there is no history of it working. Why will it work now? 300 million people on a single payer system and that is going to be cost effective?
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Why should I answer your question, when you won’t answer a question that is asked of you? You haven’t answered the Capt s question that he asks you in post #99 yet. :roll:

Which was.
<So tell me, Conservative. If I find one successful business person who is liberal, will you concede that your first comment, above, was nothing more than a ridiculous hyperpartisan claim that has no basis in reality? >
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The Prof said:
oblivious obama's rationale for radically reforming 1/6 of the us economy was to reduce er costs by availing everyone of regular appointments

in massachusetts the reverse is occurring

ER visits, costs in Mass. climb - The Boston Globe
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I swear, liberals are incapable of thinking. When you put more people into a system that already has a doctor shortage where do they think people are going to go when they get sick? If you cannot get a doctor's appointment what do liberals expect? Not surprisng, another liberal program that is a disaster. Imagine a single payer system? There are a lot of liberal idiots out there that have no problem spending someone else''s money.
 
donc said:
Why should I answer your question, when you won’t answer a question that is asked of you? You haven’t answered the Capt s question that he asks you in post #99 yet. :roll:

Which was.
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So what you are saying is that you don't have an answer to the question. You made the statement that you support a single payer system. Now back up that support with actual historical data that supports your point that a single payer system will reduce costs. Like all liberal social programs they cost more than intended. Medicare is a perfect example of a program whose cost estimates have skyrocketed over projections. Failing to answer a direct question about your statement says a lot about you.
 
The number of voters who identify themselves as Democrats has plunged to its lowest point in over two decades, according to Gallup polling.

Just 31 percent of those surveyed said they were Democrats, the analysis of numerous Gallup political polls conducted last year found.

That ties the lowest level of Democratic affiliation since the polling firm began compiling annual data in 1988. It also shows a substantial drop from just two years ago, when President Barack Obama was in the midst of his bid for the White House and 36 percent of Americans said they were Democrats.

The analysis revealed that 38 percent of Americans identify themselves as independents, tying the high from 1994, when Bill Clinton was at the halfway point of his first term and Republicans regained a majority in the House of Representatives.

Twenty-nine percent of Americans identified themselves as Republicans in 2010, a figure that has risen only slightly.
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Poll: 31% of Americans say they're Democrats - Jennifer Epstein - POLITICO.com

dems at an ALL TIME LOW, per our polity's most prestigious pollster

down FIVE PERCENT since obnoxious obama's assumption

how many of those 38% independents, do you think, DRINK TEA?

tsunami tuesday tells the tally

greatest house turnover since 1938, the year after the eponymous roosevelt recession of 1937

most state reps and legislatures in modern american history

ten gubs and six senators

almost complete control of INITIATIVE now in the nicotine stained hands of the bright orange dude who cries

the president and his dissipated party relegated to REACTION

party on, progressives, keep up the good work

remember, always, washington knows best

and thanks!
 
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QUOTE Conservative

Failing to answer a direct question about your statement says a lot about you.
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Yet you failed to answer this. :lamo


Which was.

<So tell me, Conservative. If I find one successful business person who is liberal, will you concede that your first comment, above, was nothing more than a ridiculous hyperpartisan claim that has no basis in reality? >
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donc said:
Yet you failed to answer this. :lamo


Which was.
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And you failed to answer a direct question asked of you. Why do you care whether or not I answer another poster's question? Are you a relative? Don't blame you from running from the question which just goes to show you cannot defend your position on the single payer system. Sounds good but is a total disaster to administer and hardly cost effective.
 
Conservative said:
And you failed to answer a direct question asked of you. Why do you care whether or not I answer another poster's question? Are you a relative? Don't blame you from running from the question which just goes to show you cannot defend your position on the single payer system. Sounds good but is a total disaster to administer and hardly cost effective.
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I’ve shown you in more than one thread that the VA delivers healthcare at a cost that is much less than any private sector can deliver it at. Why should I repeat myself yet again?
 
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