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Oil rises above $90 amid US crude supply drop

If I recall correct a Princeton economics prof with a singular focus on the great deppression

Perhaps not the cause of it (Greenspan certainly did not pay attention to that aspect) but with more of one directed towards fighting the great depression

His Nickname of Helicopter Ben is due to a statement that deflation is a far worse fate for an economy then is inflation and that in order to fight deflation he would if he had to drop money from helicopters.

The country was destroyed already in reality ( the tech bubble and the housing bubble did that) Bernanke will effect how destructive the effects are and who is destroyed ( and too what degree)
 
The Prof said:
today: Obama says little he can do about high oil prices | Chicago Breaking Business

leadership, anyone?
Click to expand...

suggestions? ideas?
blaming the leaders won't bring oil prices down...
Carter displayed real leadership on energy issues in his day, and the GOP tore up his plan as soon as they could.
Same thing could happen today....

I look forward to the debates coming up in the next election cycle. I bet the same stupid rhetoric will be coming from both sides.
Politicians should be looking to actual scientists for ideas....
 
Gas prices in the USA are still low compared to many other countries....
the truly poor don't complain much since they don't have cars.
The rich don't care what it costs.
The middle class are the ones complaining, but will they carpool? nope.....
The HOV lanes in the Phoenix area are rarely crowded. If they could catch and ticket all those driving in HOV lanes illegaly, they could make a substantial dent in the states deficit....
 
j-mac said:
Well, bravo for you! That must make you feel very superior to everyone around you eh? :roll:

Listen, this is America, if you want to force me to ride a bus, or rely on someone else's punctuality, and motivation to get to work on time then you can. I like many others out there don't punch a time clock at some drone job where Johnny, Billy, and Jim from the block all work at the same place, and same time.

I deliver bread, and milk to warehouses for distribution 500 to 600 miles one way, and leave, or get to work, as well as get back at different hours of the day/night. Not to mention what this is doing to the prices of those goods that you HAVE TO BUY. I am truly happy for you that you can afford it, and that you worked in a time when the American dream was such that these things were a reality for you. Times have changed.



And who the hell do you think you are to judge, or tell me what I should, can, or will drive? This is a self imposed shortage of petroleum that we could solve very easily by opening up the permitting process, and obtaining our own resources instead of giving a country like Brazil billions to drill it, and sell it back to us.

j-mac
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you should read your posts a few times before submitting....
 
Wait, did you say MORE tax on gas? I don't know where you're pumping from, but the gas tax here in North Carolina is already $0.3055. Sorry if I don't exactly agree with this idea.

What we should do is lessen the EPA requirements on different blends. Prices would drop immediately.
 
UtahBill said:
Gas prices in the USA are still low compared to many other countries....
the truly poor don't complain much since they don't have cars.
The rich don't care what it costs.
The middle class are the ones complaining, but will they carpool?
Click to expand...

such a cavalier dismissiveness, it appears the people's advocatate doesn't know em

in other words, more power to you

in just the last few months:

Oil Jumps 2% in a Day - Bloomberg

gold, oil soar as inflation fears mount

Oil Rises to 30-Month High - Bloomberg

Oil climbs to highest since 2008 - Yahoo! Finance

Two-thirds of oil and gas leases in Gulf inactive - Yahoo! News

Economist warns of double dip recession if oil hits $140

Post Carbon - Obama administration reimposes offshore oil drilling ban

Obama bans eastern Gulf drilling for 7 years - CNN

Judge rules against White House on drilling ban | Reuters

Judge blocks deepwater drilling ban; Obama to appeal | McClatchy

Obama Will Appeal Judge's Ruling Against Drilling Moratorium

Bill Clinton: Drilling delays 'ridiculous' - Darren Goode - POLITICO.com

Food and gas prices on the rise

Gas Prices Show 7th Consecutive Weekly Increase, but It's Not Just About the Middle East - ABC News

Oil's surge felt by drivers, fliers and shoppers - Yahoo! Finance

gasoline prices keep rising - Yahoo! News

March consumer sentiment lowest in over a year | Reuters

Gas prices up 33 cents in two weeks - CNN.com

AAA: gas nat'l avg $3.75

Gasoline up 100% under Obama - Washington Times

Obama says little short-term help for gas prices

Wholesale prices up 1.6 pct. on steep rise in food - Yahoo! Finance

Food Commodities Rise Seen Swamping Consumers With Inflation - Bloomberg

Get ready to be 'swamped' by food inflation

Food Inflation Hidden in Smaller Bags

Corn prices at highest level since summer '08 - Boston.com

Corn Prices Jump to 33-Month High on Shrinking U.S. Supply - Bloomberg

Push for green biofuels 'has put food prices up by massive 75%

Clinton: Too much ethanol could lead to food riots - Yahoo! News

Global food scare widens

World Bank: Food prices at "dangerous levels" - Yahoo! News

World food prices hit record high: UN agency

Clothing Prices to Rise 10% by Spring

Inflation Rate Rises: Food, Clothing And Alcohol | Business | Sky News

Bernanke says commodity prices driving up inflation

High oil and commodity prices likely to push up inflation | Business | The Guardian

Consumer morale stagnates in March | Reuters

Consumer confidence falls sharply in March - MarketWatch

Fed Buying Bonds by Trillions

Fed to Buy $600 Billion of Treasurys - WSJ.com

Fed members raise specter of higher interest rates - Forbes.com

Fed Likely to Raise Rates

Fed Official: Funds rate should hit 2.5% in year - MarketWatch

Minneapolis Fed Sees Higher Rates by Year End - WSJ.com

Toxic Dollar

Traders Short Dollar as Currency Loses Attraction
 
The Prof said:
today: Obama says little he can do about high oil prices | Chicago Breaking Business
Click to expand...

President Obama is not the only President to use that excuse. Almost certainly, he won't be the last. Since the near-oil crisis of 1967 and the twin crises of the 1970s, the U.S. had ample time to launch an ambitious effort to reduce its dependency on oil. Instead, whenever the price declined, the crisis was forgotten. The 2008 oil price spike was also largely forgotten when the price of crude fell to near $33/barrel during the financial crisis. Technically, little can be done today, but that is only due to a bipartisan lack of foresight that has continued to the current administration and, if the past is representative, will likely continue beyond it. Until the price of crude reaches painful levels and remains there (persistent demand imbalance), it is not likely that the U.S. will become serious about addressing its energy-related vulnerabilities.
 
UtahBill said:
suggestions? ideas?
blaming the leaders won't bring oil prices down...
Carter displayed real leadership on energy issues in his day, and the GOP tore up his plan as soon as they could.
Same thing could happen today....

I look forward to the debates coming up in the next election cycle. I bet the same stupid rhetoric will be coming from both sides.
Politicians should be looking to actual scientists for ideas....
Click to expand...

Not sure if you really are asking for potential solutions, but I will give it a go just in case. Let's first start with why corporations are reluctant to make huge long term investments in alternative energy. Oil is a commodity like corn or cottn etc. In the U.S. we have subsidies for farmers putting a floor on the price they will receive when they grow their crops. So they have some certainty within limits on how little they can get paid. It is still a tough business as it relies on all sorts of unknowable things like weather etc, but they do have that floor.

Oil on the other hand has been left to the open market. A market controlled largely by countries with relatively small populations and huge supplies of this stuff. So for various reasons the price may skyrocket for a while as it did in 2007/8 can't remember to 147 a barrel then plumment to 35 a barrel several months later. No reasonable corporation will spend tens of billions on an investment that may take 5-10 years to complete with that set of variables.

All that being said, unless the congress can decide to put a floor on oil prices I can't see how private funding can fix this problem. Another way to put a floor under oil, is to put a heavy tax on it like they do in Europe. Nor surprising that they drive smaller cars, use more nuclear than we do, build much more wind etc and drill in the North Sea which seems to be much more of a challenge than the gulf of Mexico.

People on the right will complain about price controls and taxes, peopleon the left will complain about regressive taxes, plus they don't even like alternative sources of energy. Wind kills many birds, nuclear is unsafe ( though no one has ever died in the U.S. because of it to my knowledge). So here we are, nowhere.

This president and congress being as partisan as tey are offer little hope for a rational solution that would mean some give and take from both sides.

Let the debate begin!
 
produce energy in this country

great jobs
 
The Prof said:
produce energy in this country

great jobs
Click to expand...

Who? All oil rigs are drilling or spoken for. You do know oil is a global market, don't you? US oil companies drill all over the world.
 
washunut said:
Not sure if you really are asking for potential solutions, but I will give it a go just in case. Let's first start with why corporations are reluctant to make huge long term investments in alternative energy. Oil is a commodity like corn or cottn etc. In the U.S. we have subsidies for farmers putting a floor on the price they will receive when they grow their crops. So they have some certainty within limits on how little they can get paid. It is still a tough business as it relies on all sorts of unknowable things like weather etc, but they do have that floor.

Oil on the other hand has been left to the open market. A market controlled largely by countries with relatively small populations and huge supplies of this stuff. So for various reasons the price may skyrocket for a while as it did in 2007/8 can't remember to 147 a barrel then plumment to 35 a barrel several months later. No reasonable corporation will spend tens of billions on an investment that may take 5-10 years to complete with that set of variables.

All that being said, unless the congress can decide to put a floor on oil prices I can't see how private funding can fix this problem. Another way to put a floor under oil, is to put a heavy tax on it like they do in Europe. Nor surprising that they drive smaller cars, use more nuclear than we do, build much more wind etc and drill in the North Sea which seems to be much more of a challenge than the gulf of Mexico.

People on the right will complain about price controls and taxes, peopleon the left will complain about regressive taxes, plus they don't even like alternative sources of energy. Wind kills many birds, nuclear is unsafe ( though no one has ever died in the U.S. because of it to my knowledge). So here we are, nowhere.

This president and congress being as partisan as tey are offer little hope for a rational solution that would mean some give and take from both sides.

Let the debate begin!
Click to expand...

You are making a very common mistake...the issue is OIL as a transportation fuel (its major use) and viable alternatives to it. Electricity has almost nothing to do with the issue. We have ample supplies of electricity and it is easy to "conserve" in the event we have a temporary shortage, just have rolling blackouts.
Oil, as a transportation fuel, has ONE alternative, natural gas. Pickens has proposed that we convert our trucking industry to NG, a good idea, that will release a good percentage of diesel to be used on our trains, which make very efficient use of diesel.
But NG is also a home heating fuel, and an electricity generating fuel. This winter showed a problem with NG in states that usually have mild winters, NG plants shut down because the supply pressure dropped from higher than normal use by home heating users.
The NG infrastructure is still in its infancy. It isn't available everywhere like gasoline and diesel.
All that said, the big issue is gasoline for the common consumer. We are going to buy it, whatever the price is.
 
The Prof said:
produce energy in this country

great jobs
Click to expand...
the issue is oil....
We can't produce oil, we can only drill for it....and we can't drill enough at the rate we are consuming it...
 
UtahBill said:
You are making a very common mistake...the issue is OIL as a transportation fuel (its major use) and viable alternatives to it. Electricity has almost nothing to do with the issue. We have ample supplies of electricity and it is easy to "conserve" in the event we have a temporary shortage, just have rolling blackouts.
Oil, as a transportation fuel, has ONE alternative, natural gas. Pickens has proposed that we convert our trucking industry to NG, a good idea, that will release a good percentage of diesel to be used on our trains, which make very efficient use of diesel.
But NG is also a home heating fuel, and an electricity generating fuel. This winter showed a problem with NG in states that usually have mild winters, NG plants shut down because the supply pressure dropped from higher than normal use by home heating users.
The NG infrastructure is still in its infancy. It isn't available everywhere like gasoline and diesel.
All that said, the big issue is gasoline for the common consumer. We are going to buy it, whatever the price is.
Click to expand...

My mistake was showing one example of a problem and hoping folks could tie it to others. For example you mention NG which is an alernative to oil for transportation. In order for that to be used effectively but a few key things are that engines on existing trucks would have to be converted to use NG vs oil. Without knowing what the price of oil will be next month,next year etc many will not make that investment. Then you have to set up filling stations around the country, again a very expensive investment. Can't be done without some level of certainty that people willmove to nat gas., then of course toy need more pipeline, more drilling of gas wells.

Please think through the issue before responding if you care to continue.
 
UtahBill said:
the issue is oil....
We can't produce oil, we can only drill for it....and we can't drill enough at the rate we are consuming it...
Click to expand...

Some people refuse to see that it has been 40 years since we could drill as much oil as we consume.
 
washunut said:
My mistake was showing one example of a problem and hoping folks could tie it to others. For example you mention NG which is an alernative to oil for transportation. In order for that to be used effectively but a few key things are that engines on existing trucks would have to be converted to use NG vs oil. Without knowing what the price of oil will be next month,next year etc many will not make that investment. Then you have to set up filling stations around the country, again a very expensive investment. Can't be done without some level of certainty that people willmove to nat gas., then of course toy need more pipeline, more drilling of gas wells.

Please think through the issue before responding if you care to continue.
Click to expand...
Just because I don't mention something in a post doesn't mean I don't know about it...besides, filling stations are part of the "infrastucture" I mentioned.
NG cannot be safely used by amateurs. You don't want grandma filling her own NG tank. Propane sellers won't let you fill your own BBQ/Grill tank.
Gaseous fuels are dangerous, which is why it makes sense to limit use to professional drivers who can be trained. Gasoline is a liquid fuel, and won't burn easily, it takes a lot of vaporizaton to get it to ignite. NG has to be compressed to be shipped via truck, a considerable expense. NG pipelines will only be built where there is a large demand for it. Most major cities already have a pipeline that was built when NG was used primarily for heating homes. Many, if not most, existing pipelines are old, and in need of replacement. There is a huge pipeline being built now that runs thru Cache Valley, upper Utah, where we spend our summer months. It will send Wyoming gas to the west coast.
I coubt that any business worries about the price of oil next month or next year to the extent that they will shut down or limit current operations. It is part of the price of doing business, and they will just pass on the expense to their customers.
Conversion of trucks is an issue, but the trucking industry can do it. Local trucking where NG is already available would be the easiest place to start. Long haul trucks would have to stick with diesel where the infrastructure doens't exist..

The PRICE of oil is the smaller part of the issue, the availibility of it is what we should be worried about the most.
 
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