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Dutch politician on trial on hate speech charges

Gardener said:
j-mac, you and others really need to refine some of the terms you toss about like you do. It isn't a liberal characteristic to limit free speech -- it is the characteristic of an authoritarian. In the case of European authoritarians, it is a leftist authoritarianism for the most part, but the essential element here is the authoritarianism, not liberalism. These leftists are NOT liberals.
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Ok, I'll buy that....

j-mac
 
Gardener said:
I supported what the Dixie Chicks had to say, and the attitudes of those here who would limit them remind me very much of your own authoritarian attitudes, except from a different direction.
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Wait a minute, at this point the Chicks only limitation was that their own fans stopped buying their albums, and going to their shows....How is that authoritarian?


j-mac
 
Your Star said:
This sucks, but this could never happen in America because we have nifty first amendment thing. Isn't it awesome!
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Yeah, that'll come in handy when they cut your head off on the internet.
 
j-mac said:
Wait a minute, at this point the Chicks only limitation was that their own fans stopped buying their albums, and going to their shows....How is that authoritarian?


j-mac
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I believe what Gardener is reffering to.

And I'll take a shot in the dark here...

That during the Bush administration, many people who went against the President were called Traitors, even terrorist sympathizers.

People who claimed it was un-American to go against Bush, the ones who were burning copies of Dixie Chicks albums, threatening to kill them. The ones who claim the Dixie Chicks were the ones who were un-American, while failing to allow the Dixie Chicks to say what they wanted to say, without disagreeing politely.

I really wonder what you'd say if it was a Full On Conservative country stars albums being burned by liberals...
 
Jetboogieman said:
I believe what Gardener is reffering to.

And I'll take a shot in the dark here...

That during the Bush administration, many people who went against the President were called Traitors, even terrorist sympathizers.
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Traitors? Well, in some cases like the NYT giving up vital information that could place American troops in harm, maybe. Terrorist Sympathizers? Absolutely. Still goes on today.

People who claimed it was un-American to go against Bush, the ones who were burning copies of Dixie Chicks albums, threatening to kill them. The ones who claim the Dixie Chicks were the ones who were un-American, while failing to allow the Dixie Chicks to say what they wanted to say, without disagreeing politely.
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Rhetoric especially when it has a ring of truth always hurts. But it is still rhetoric none the less.

I really wonder what you'd say if it was a Full On Conservative country stars albums being burned by liberals...
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Well, I am a rock listener, however, as tasteless as it is to burn things, it is a form of protest, and so be it. I'd welcome it to expose who you libs are.

j-mac
 
PeteEU said:
Does not exist anywhere and never has... "free speech" is and always has been an illusion.
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Oh, I know. But compared to the free speech laws individual citizens enjoy in the US, ours are a joke. No one gets arrested for denying the Holocaust, saying racist things or burning or desecrating holy books over there. Not that I think those are good things, I just don't think they should be outlawed.
 
Gardener said:
What various European governments do to you to limit free speech almost pales in comparison to what Europeans do to each other. The social pressures applied to make sure everybody is in lock step in regards to the Emperors new clothes looks to be quite overwhelming since just about anybody who dares comment that he is actually naked gets vilified so.
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Well, in all fairness, I see that happening in the US as well. Certain unpopular ideas or offensive words some people have the guts to say out loud pretty much guarantees them social suicide.
 
Does anyone think that the New York based Center for Constitutional Rights will ever take the case of someone saying harsh things towards Muslims (???) They have a long history in these selective matters and have represented the old blind Egyptian Sheikh and the killer of Meir Kahane in 1990
 
Ned Racine said:
Does anyone think that the New York based Center for Constitutional Rights will ever take the case of someone saying harsh things towards Muslims (???) They have a long history in these selective matters and have represented the old blind Egyptian Sheikh and the killer of Meir Kahane in 1990
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CCR is about as radical an institution as you can get here in America.

j-mac
 
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