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Obama will not extend Bush tax cuts to wealthy

I can tell you first hand that hiring people is about the most expensive thing a business can do, so if you want people to get hired, increasing taxes to those that do the hiring is not a good idea.

By the way, these additional personal taxes will be recouped by the upper management folks by merely increasing responsibilities of a smaller workforce. Additional layoffs will ensue.

Therefore, by increasing taxes, you will shrink the workforce that is being taxed. Back to square one.

Stupid.
 
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Erod said:
I can tell you first hand that hiring people is about the most expensive thing a business can do, so if you want people to get hired, increasing taxes to those that do the hiring is not a good idea.

By the way, these additional personal taxes will be recouped by the upper management folks by merely increasing responsibilities of a smaller workforce. Addtional layoffs will ensue.

Therefore, by increasing taxes, you will shrink the workforce that are being taxed. Back to square one.

Stupid.
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great sig line btw
 
pbrauer said:
Those people create jobs in China, India....
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Small business people, who create more jobs than anyone, do not outsource to China and India.

And if your ilk would stop with the unions, frivilous lawsuits, and undeserved wage demands, outsourcing wouldn't be necessary for large corporations either.
 
Erod said:
Small business people, who create more jobs than anyone, do not outsource to China and India.
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So give the business a tax break...oh wait that is what is being proposed.
 
Erod said:
Small business people, who create more jobs than anyone, do not outsource to China and India.

And if your ilk would stop with the unions, frivilous lawsuits, and undeserved wage demands, outsourcing wouldn't be necessary for large corporations either.
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Unions are about 1/3 of what they were back in the '80s and union jobs are a good way to increase demand for products and services. One of the biggest problems today is that people must use credit in order to "keep up with the Jones'" and the Jones' are using credit as well. Pay workers well and they can buy the products you make - Henry Ford had it right so many years ago.

I don't buy the argument that corporations need to outsource jobs to other countries. I don't believe Adam Smith author of the Wealth of Nations would buy this either.
 
texmaster said:
Really. Are you in China or India working?

Enjoy your fail.
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Go into to any store and see how many items are made in China or rather see how many you find made in the U.S.A. It doesn't take too much intelligence to know where our jobs have gone.
 
pbrauer said:
Go into to any store and see how many items are made in China or rather see how many you find made in the U.S.A. It doesn't take too much intelligence to know where our jobs have gone.
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They are going in services, not manufacturing. It makes sense, we are a post-industrial nation.
 
I don't know if it's been mentioned here yet or not (haven't read through the thread), but despite how it's been presented, Peter Orzsag it's as thrilled with extended the Bush tax cuts as Republicans may think. He offered such as a compromise, not necessarily as the absolute solution to our nation's budget problems, as well as, how to get the economy going again. Read his op-ed from the NYTimes or go to this thread to discuss further.
 
drz-400 said:
They are going in services, not manufacturing. It makes sense, we are a post-industrial nation.
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But the only jobs that matter are manufacturing. Duh. :roll:
 
I don't know a whole lot about owning a business or accounting, so I'm hoping someone can answer this for me...

When someone owns a small business and the business makes a profit of say, $500,000 in one year, what is keeping the owner from paying them self $249,999.99 ( as their personal income and putting the other $250,000.01 into some kind of asset account? I'd think you would be able to pay yourself $249,999.99 and still be considered "middle class" according to Obama's tax plan. If I owned a business I'd likely only pay myself $50k to $100k anyways... the less money I pay myself the more I can put into the business and hopefully make the company more profitable and possibly be able to hire more people. I don't need a luxurious life to be happy. I'm not one to dictate what someone should be making... Just asking questions here.

But I am confused why people are so outraged about a 3-4.6% increase in taxes for a select few when often these same people talk so much about balancing the budget. Cutting government programs is not enough to close the budget gap... and cutting programs is unfortunately a slow process. If the Republicans take over, which I expect they will, I hope they keep their promise and start cutting and changing government programs we don't need at a faster pace than the Dems have been. I have serious doubts though...
 
Jucon said:
I don't know a whole lot about owning a business or accounting, so I'm hoping someone can answer this for me...

When someone owns a small business and the business makes a profit of say, $500,000 in one year, what is keeping the owner from paying them self $249,999.99 ( as their personal income and putting the other $250,000.01 into some kind of asset account? I'd think you would be able to pay yourself $249,999.99 and still be considered "middle class" according to Obama's tax plan. If I owned a business I'd likely only pay myself $50k to $100k anyways... the less money I pay myself the more I can put into the business and hopefully make the company more profitable and possibly be able to hire more people. I don't need a luxurious life to be happy. I'm not one to dictate what someone should be making... Just asking questions here.

But I am confused why people are so outraged about a 3-4.6% increase in taxes for a select few when often these same people talk so much about balancing the budget. Cutting government programs is not enough to close the budget gap... and cutting programs is unfortunately a slow process. If the Republicans take over, which I expect they will, I hope they keep their promise and start cutting and changing government programs we don't need at a faster pace than the Dems have been. I have serious doubts though...
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As to your first question, the answer is that for most small businesses the income of the company is considered income for the owner. So the two numbers are added together to get the same 500K.

On your second point for some it is a matter of equity. If you are going to get rid of the Bush tax cuts because we can't afford them, fine. But Obama is saying get rid of about 25% of the cuts and retain the other 75%. Others feel that at this stage of our economic recovery we can't afford to take any money out of the economy. Some will say that this will inhibit some small business owners from adding employees as they get to keep an ever decreasing amount of what they earn. Let's remember that this 4% is only one increase these people will be paying. In many states, which are also broke they have also raised the percent of income tax imposed on the highest earners.
Also remember that the health care bill calls for an additional 3.8% of certain income for upper income earners.

So Obama and company have done a nice job of isolating each increase and saying what's the big deal. Without having an hosest debate and putting all the increases together and explaining why that is the right way to go.

Hope this helps.
 
drz-400 said:
They are going in services, not manufacturing. It makes sense, we are a post-industrial nation.
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phattonez said:
But the only jobs that matter are manufacturing. Duh. :roll:
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So how does a country go about exporting services? The harsh truth is that we import more than we export and our balance of trade has been on the negative side since the late '90s and our country gets poorer and poorer.
 
pbrauer said:
So how does a country go about exporting services? The harsh truth is that we import more than we export and our balance of trade has been on the negative side since the late '90s and our country gets poorer and poorer.
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The U.S. has outsourced even service jobs. So stuff like tax returns, reading x-rays are done in places like India and sent back. The U.S. seems to have two choices:

Continue to let "free trade" rule. This has kept inflation low in the states for about 20 years. While costing us millions of middle class factory jobs, and increasingly other jobs that can be outsourced.

- Do what Obama promised in his campaign but has not acted on. That is turn free trade into fair trade. Balance our international trade aco****s. This has become harder as we now are so indebted to the countries we turned our manufacturing over to.
 
drz-400 said:
They are going in services, not manufacturing. It makes sense, we are a post-industrial nation.
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So you are saying America has become servants to the world?

Sorry, its hard to believe you can have a sustainable economy without making or creating something. A pure service economy does not work.
 
upsideguy said:
So you are saying America has become servants to the world?

Sorry, its hard to believe you can have a sustainable economy without making or creating something. A pure service economy does not work.
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We do have manufacturing but he is right, as time goes on more and more of the job market has shifted towards services. If we really wanted manufacturing we would lower minnimum wage significantly in order to compete with China but Americans will have no part in that.
 
drz-400 said:
They are going in services, not manufacturing. It makes sense, we are a post-industrial nation.
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So you are saying America has become the servants to the world?

Sorry, its hard to believe you can have a sustainable economy without making or creating something. A pure service economy does not work.
 
washunut said:
As to your first question, the answer is that for most small businesses the income of the company is considered income for the owner. So the two numbers are added together to get the same 500K.
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Well that's stupid. Sounds like something that should be changed. Then again it would be hard for a bank or government to know if the money in this "asset account" for a small business is being spent on personal things or things for the business. But me being an honest guy I think I should be able to set up something where I take out $50k from the profits for my personal yearly income and put the rest toward future purchases for my business. Is there no way to do this right now?
 
phattonez said:
So the point of a politics DISCUSSION board should be to SHUT UP and accept what happens?
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"God, grant me the serenity to accept the things that I cannot change."
 
Mickey Shane said:
"God, grant me the serenity to accept the things that I cannot change."
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You're really going to quote the serenity prayer? You're a hack, get over it. You're only saying it because it's a policy that you support. If republicans tried to cut taxes on the wealthy you'd be the first one complaining here. Remember that when the republicans try to pass a tax break for the rich when they win the House.
 
upsideguy said:
So you are saying America has become servants to the world?

Sorry, its hard to believe you can have a sustainable economy without making or creating something. A pure service economy does not work.
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If that's true then why do you pay your waiter, or your chef, or the guy who parks your car? Hmm, those services must be worth something then.
 
phattonez said:
If that's true then why do you pay your waiter, or your chef, or the guy who parks your car? Hmm, those services must be worth something then.
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They have low worth though it seems. I think the US needs to stick to technology, the tax cuts should be aimed at the biotech industry, America has always been the land of inovation and those jobs be readily available would serve to push better math and science education in this country.
 
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