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Obama to introduce another business tax cut

Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

I think I'll take the Harvard economy professors word over yours apdst.

I'd take the word of someone that pays the taxes and lives the life over a Professor whose never had to run a business. What makes sense in Acedemia generally doesn't translate to the real world.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

I'd take the word of someone that pays the taxes and lives the life over a Professor whose never had to run a business. What makes sense in Acedemia generally doesn't translate to the real world.

Every single source out there, including various econ professors, financial reporters, congressional staffers and tax experts, says that the proposal will work one way. On the other side we have apdst, who simply says "oh, this is how it works" and provides nothing to back it up.
 
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Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Here's the facts guys, this tax break is NOT a new idea. Its been in affect one way or another since 2002, Obama is only making it bigger and faster, a trend that has been in affect since 2003. From the WSJ:
History of the tax break:
2002: Allowed 30% write-off for three years.
2003: Rate rises to 50%
2008: Small businesses allowed to write off value of investment up to $250,000. 50% allowed for larger companies.
2009: Both extended a year
2010: Both under consideration in Congress.
Source: Tax Policy Center
Obama to Push Tax Break for Business Investment - WSJ.com

As for the Bush tax cuts, they aren't that big to begin with and compared to the entire economy of the US and the world in this recession it's a drop in the bucket. Here's the figures from the same WSJ article.
Mr. Obama and many congressional Democrats want to eliminate the current 33% and 35% rates for higher earners, and return them to pre-Bush levels of 36% and 39.6%.
3% and 4.6% are not game changers.

And as for those evil doer Harvard economists, the kind that have been on economic advisery boards for the government and private think tanks, here's one that brings up a real concern with this idea. But another economist, N. Gregory Mankiw, of Harvard University, and another former CEA chairman under President Bush, questioned whether the Obama proposal would have a big impact. Businesses can already take out a bank loan at extremely low interest rates to pay for new investments in plants and equipment, but they are not doing so, he said. It's unclear why they would make those investments for a tax break.

I guess as long as they agree with your opinion than academia isn't so bad? Also the proposals for the 50 Billion infastructure fund and this tax break will be in seperate bills, so Republicans or anyone else can vote for one and not for the other, without being forced into anything.

Now that was all from ONE WSJ article, ain't reading, understanding and fact checking great? I mean it won't cut into your opinion sharing time that much.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

I think I'll take the Harvard economy professors word over yours apdst.

Of course you would. For two reasons: 1) You don't like the facts that I'm presenting to you and 2) you probably live in the same fantasy world that he does.

Why would you listen to an ecomomics professor when learning how to run a business? Think about it for a minute.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Every single source out there, including various econ professors, financial reporters, congressional staffers and tax experts, says that the proposal will work one way. On the other side we have apdst, who simply says "oh, this is how it works" and provides nothing to back it up.

How many businesses do you own? I have four.

So, excuse me when I don't get all pumped up over this brand new tax cut created by The Messiah.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

How many businesses do you own? I have four.

So, excuse me when I don't get all pumped up over this brand new tax cut created by The Messiah.

If you are literally just arbitrarily assigning a useful life of one year to all of your depreciable equipment and expensing them you are intentionally lowering your income taxes and you had better hope you never get audited. The IRS has a table (I believe rightinNYC posted) you can use for the useful life of your equipment/assets and you can depreciate them using a number of methods (modified accelerated cost recovery/straightline). The tax cut changes this. This is for taxes. Your own personal books can look different, but this is how you report it to the IRS.
 
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Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Every single source out there, including various econ professors, financial reporters, congressional staffers and tax experts, says that the proposal will work one way. On the other side we have apdst, who simply says "oh, this is how it works" and provides nothing to back it up.

I was making a general statement Right, and as a General Rule, I trust the folks that live it, vs those that study it.

Sorry if I cam across any other way, was not my intent.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

How many businesses do you own? I have four.

So, excuse me when I don't get all pumped up over this brand new tax cut created by The Messiah.

Believe it or not, just because you are a business owner, I mean if you are since you're tense suddenly turned from singular to plural outta nowhere but whatever, doesn't give you some magical insight into the economy. I'm pretty damn sure there exists in this world an individual who also owns a business and is probably stoked outta his mind about this idea from Obama.

As a business owner you are just as prone to ignorance and error as any other person.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

How many businesses do you own? I have four.

So, excuse me when I don't get all pumped up over this brand new tax cut created by The Messiah.

And I coach a soccer team, so that means I know more about the rules than FIFA, sportswriters, and referees. LOGIC.

You yourself have mentioned that you were audited multiple times and got in trouble with the IRS for various things. I don't understand why you think that helps your case, as it's evidence that you don't understand the tax code as well as you think you do.
 
A tax, "cut", applies to all businesses. A tax credit only applies to businesses that qualify for that particular tax credit. You're smarte than me, so you should already know this.

So you're saying a $50billion tax cut is better for the economy than a $50 billion tax credit because it's spread out to more businesses? Why wouldn't a targeted credit be helpful to stimulate a particularly desirable industry or to help a particularly struggling industry?
 
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Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Believe it or not, just because you are a business owner, I mean if you are since you're tense suddenly turned from singular to plural outta nowhere but whatever, doesn't give you some magical insight into the economy. I'm pretty damn sure there exists in this world an individual who also owns a business and is probably stoked outta his mind about this idea from Obama.

As a business owner you are just as prone to ignorance and error as any other person.

No doubt, there are businesses that will benefit from this tax credit. More than likely, all green businsses and no one else. However, this is being billed as some sorta savior for businesses, across the country, which it's not. If Obama was serious about helping businsses with taxes, he would inact an across the board tax cut for all businesses.

If you are literally just arbitrarily assigning a useful life of one year to all of your depreciable equipment and expensing them you are intentionally lowering your income taxes and you had better hope you never get audited. The IRS has a table (I believe rightinNYC posted) you can use for the useful life of your equipment/assets and you can depreciate them using a number of methods (modified accelerated cost recovery/straightline). The tax cut changes this. This is for taxes. Your own personal books can look different, but this is how you report it to the IRS.

Who said anything about, "useful life"? I'm talking depreciating the value of a piece of equipment for a maximum of 6 years and a minimum of 1. I own an oilfield winch truck that was built in 1985. I paid cash for it and wrote it off. Having done that, I can't depreciate the truck. Equipment depreciation offsets the money a business pays on equipment notes; notes that are tax deductable.
 
So you're saying a $50billion tax cut is better for the economy than a $50 billion tax credit because it's spread out to more businesses? Why wouldn't a targeted credit be helpful to stimulate a particularly desirable industry or to help a particularly struggling industry?

Most industries are struggling, now. Why not try and help as many as possible, rather than just a chosen few? You idea makes zero sense.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

And I coach a soccer team, so that means I know more about the rules than FIFA, sportswriters, and referees. LOGIC.

You yourself have mentioned that you were audited multiple times and got in trouble with the IRS for various things. I don't understand why you think that helps your case, as it's evidence that you don't understand the tax code as well as you think you do.

I got audited, twice. I didn't, "git-n-trouble", I only took some deductions that that particular auditer--in his descression--didn't think were legit deductions. I had to write him a check for about $2,500. That doesn't equate to being in trouble.

I understand the tax code, as it applies to my businesses.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

No doubt, there are businesses that will benefit from this tax credit. More than likely, all green businsses and no one else. However, this is being billed as some sorta savior for businesses, across the country, which it's not. If Obama was serious about helping businsses with taxes, he would inact an across the board tax cut for all businesses.

Well it is just a proposal and idea floating around right now, so there's all kind of time for change, but there's been nothing so far about it being just for 'green' businesses. And having listened to Obama's speech where he announced this plan, it wasn't all drumed up to a savior for the economy.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Who said anything about, "useful life"? I'm talking depreciating the value of a piece of equipment for a maximum of 6 years and a minimum of 1. I own an oilfield winch truck that was built in 1985. I paid cash for it and wrote it off. Having done that, I can't depreciate the truck. Equipment depreciation offsets the money a business pays on equipment notes; notes that are tax deductable.

How do you depreciate something without using an estimate of the assets useful life?
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Obama is desperate and is facing the fact that november is going to be ugly. he is trying to buy as many votes as possible with the public treasury.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Obama is desperate and is facing the fact that november is going to be ugly. he is trying to buy as many votes as possible with the public treasury.

Tax cuts don't cost anything remember! :rofl
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Obama is desperate and is facing the fact that november is going to be ugly. he is trying to buy as many votes as possible with the public treasury.

We need to get back to Chicago politics. Where it only cost about $20 per vote. That is a lot more efficient than Obama throwing around billions to interest groups and union to get some votes.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Well it is just a proposal and idea floating around right now, so there's all kind of time for change, but there's been nothing so far about it being just for 'green' businesses. And having listened to Obama's speech where he announced this plan, it wasn't all drumed up to a savior for the economy.

Then, why do it?
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

How do you depreciate something without using an estimate of the assets useful life?

Because, you can only depreciate a piece of equipment for 6 years. I'm running equipment that is 25 years old. If you depreciated equipment, based on it's useful life, then trucking companies could depreciate trucks for decades. Value and useful life are two different animals.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Because, you can only depreciate a piece of equipment for 6 years. I'm running equipment that is 25 years old. If you depreciated equipment, based on it's useful life, then trucking companies could depreciate trucks for decades. Value and useful life are two different animals.

If only the IRS offered depreciation schedules to help standardize this.

Publication 946 (2009), How To Depreciate Property
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

Double post..........
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

You got me. There are 44,000 pages in the US tax code and you're familiar with them all. I'm going to have to yell calf rope on this, my friend.

I'm not, actually. However, I am capable of reading the words in front of me and understanding that you're completely wrong.

Given that this is the 6th or 7th topic where you've obstinantly refused to admit your error even when the evidence is right in front of your face, I'll stop wasting my breath. I'll let you have the last snarky comment about how I'm just an ivory tower whippersnapper who doesn't understand how the real world works.
 
Re: Obama to introhttp://www.debatepolitics.com/newreplyduce another business tax cut

I'd take the word of someone that pays the taxes and lives the life over a Professor whose never had to run a business. What makes sense in Acedemia generally doesn't translate to the real world.

yes ignore what the man who has spent most his life studying economics and now teaches at one of the best institutions in the world says and go with a dude on a message board who says he knows he is right because he runs a business despite the list of links NYC supplied clearly going against what apdst was saying. (sigh)
 
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