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North Korea vows nuclear response to U.S.-Seoul drills

kaya'08 said:
So what would make it any different to Iraq?
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NK might actually be a little tougher to conquer than Iraq was.

Might take two weeks. :mrgreen:
 
China is the only reason why NK has not yet been obliterated.
 
North Korea lacks the balls to do anything. They know if they even try it the USA will turn PyongYang into a large pothole in the surface of southeast asia.
 
TacticalEvilDan said:
Nuh-uh.

I don't want the US anywhere near that mess of a country.

If you think we have it bad in Afghanistan, just think of how bad we'd have it in a nation where we were directly responsible for the toppling of the national cult of personality.

No, thanks.
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American forces? No. Cruise missiles carrying a Themite Plazma load ... most definately.
 
Vader said:
North Korea lacks the balls to do anything. They know if they even try it the USA will turn PyongYang into a large pothole in the surface of southeast asia.
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I would like to know how the U.S. is going to effectuate the geographic displacement to move the DPRK to southeast Asia... will THAT many nukes be used? Then, does South Korea become an island? - which might actually make them happy, BTW.... :)
 
As a vassal state, they would most likely seek permission from China to attack the U.S. Do you really think China will say 'Yeah go ahead we got your back!' If they attack us China would most likely back off unless we attempt a reform on NK. They haven't the balls or the firepower to do any amount of damage to us.
 
LimeLight said:
As a vassal state, they would most likely seek permission from China to attack the U.S. Do you really think China will say 'Yeah go ahead we got your back!' If they attack us China would most likely back off unless we attempt a reform on NK. They haven't the balls or the firepower to do any amount of damage to us.
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Some people forget the lessons of history. 1950 mean anything to you? And then, China had nothing except human waves...
 
North Korea doesn't have the balls or firepower. Not china. Conditions are different today. I don't believe China would back North korea if they declared war on us.
 
LimeLight said:
North Korea doesn't have the balls or firepower. Not china. Conditions are different today. I don't believe China would back North korea if they declared war on us.
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Of course, if it looked like U.S. troops would approach the Yalu River, all bets are off... There is no way the Chinese would accept U.S. troops approaching a border anywhere near their heartland...
 
Vader said:
China deserves to be nuked.
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Bear in mind during nuclear explosions innocent people tend to die, unless of course, you have an inherit hatred of the Chinese race itself. :)
 
ludahai said:
Of course, if it looked like U.S. troops would approach the Yalu River, all bets are off... There is no way the Chinese would accept U.S. troops approaching a border anywhere near their heartland...
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Of course. But they would certainly understand a reasonable counter attack in the use of nuclear weaponry. I just don't think they are stupid enough or have reason to piggy back onto North Korea's back in a situation like that. The last thing we want is a war with China, and the last thing they want is a war with the U.S.
 
kaya'08 said:
Bear in mind during nuclear explosions innocent people tend to die, unless of course, you have an inherit hatred of the Chinese race itself. :)
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War sucks... not fair, but if that is what it takes to end the biggest threat to freedom in the world today (yes, even bigger than Obama), then so be it...

Seriously, nuking is a big strong, but there WILL be a war with China. The nature and specific spark is yet to be determined, but there WILL be one. Probably at least twenty years away, but there WILL be. One only has the see the hatred and rhetoric coming out of the Beijing regime to see the writing on the wall...
 
LimeLight said:
Of course. But they would certainly understand a reasonable counter attack in the use of nuclear weaponry. I just don't think they are stupid enough or have reason to piggy back onto North Korea's back in a situation like that. The last thing we want is a war with China, and the last thing they want is a war with the U.S.
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Oh, they want a war with the U.S. -- but they want it over the venue and time of their choosing -- and this ain't it...
 
ludahai said:
Oh, they want a war with the U.S. -- but they want it over the venue and time of their choosing -- and this ain't it...
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Agreed. Naturally that's the way you would want it. No one wants to be thrown into a war. Certainly not over the dumb decisions of your vassal. The result in current time 'if it did happen' would be simple counter attack and the reestablishing of current boundaries.
 
LimeLight said:
Just read an article.

U.S.-S. Korean War Drills Begin

Seems as if China has indeed thrown out their thoughts of the issue.
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usually in English, they are not very strong in their wording, pretending they like the idea of reconciliation, while they tend to get a little bit harder line in the Chinese language press. Of course, they are going against their own professed non-interference in the internal affairs of other states by opposing the joint exercises. Of course, this is another example of where their rhetoric in English and Chinese do not see eye to eye...
 
Although North Korea is heavily dependent on China for aid and support, its hardly a vassal state. China and North Korea have had strong disagreements several times in the past, most of which are recent over this nuclear issue, six-party talks, and the general actions of the DPRK. While the DPRK does serve a purpose to China, its important to figure out how valuable that purpose is to them. That is debatable, however what I believe is hardly debatable is that China would go nuclear to protect its North Korean ally. Recently due to their disagreements and US draw downs in Korea, both real and expected, North Korea has increasingly become more and more of a burden to China rather than an asset. One could draw a parallel between China and the DPRK and the views many Americans have towards Europe, that we've done so much for them over the last 50 years and constantly have their back but they don't repay us well.

China is not keen on taking over the world by military means, that is impractical and its likely going to be impossible to challenge the US on the seas for easily the next 100 years. And likewise given China's vast army and our relatively small one which is also deployed in two theaters AND considering China's vast territory its unlikely any large scale ground operations in China will successful either. Therefore China and the US are in a military stalemate before a war has even begun, they cannot strike out onto the oceans and we cannot strike into their land. One also has to remember that a war would greatly hinder China's #1 goal, that is to get rich. Warfare would obviously end most exports for China, which would be a huge hindrance on their economy and social stability as hundreds of millions are put out of work or the Yuan spirals into rapid inflation as China "employs" them all, perhaps both if they attempt a "middle of the road" solution. As for the US we'd lose access to a huge trading partner which would wreck havoc on our economy as well. China doesn't want to take over the world militarily, but perhaps economically.

So in conclusion, while North Korea serves a purposes as a "buffer zone" between the US and its allies and China the decreasing hostility between the US and China due in part to the increased economic interdependency makes that buffer zone less valuable every day.

An interesting question would be if perhaps North Korea has realized this changing dynamic and is seeking to wedge out its own "mini-sphere" more independent of China? Nuclear weapons are a good thing to have in that case as North Korea wants its own deterrent. Personally I dont think so because North Korea's has made any progress towards economic independence and in fact has done a number of things which have made it worse, if that was even possible, such as drastically devaluing its currency. But perhaps its North Korea thinking that its better to make enemies rather than friends for security purposes. Starvation is a means of control in a dictatorship, preserving which is the ultimate North Korea goal, but further alienating itself it protects itself against outside influence via economic improvement or contact with foreigners that would come from economic growth. And by hanging onto its nukes and, hopefully, settling down after carving out its little spot, which its current actions would be attempting to achieve, it can be poor enough to control its people, preserve its regime, and isolated and unfriendly enough for other nations to want to leave alone but not so afraid they'd be willing to attack a nuclear power.
 
Wiseone said:
An interesting question would be if perhaps North Korea has realized this changing dynamic and is seeking to wedge out its own "mini-sphere" more independent of China? Nuclear weapons are a good thing to have in that case as North Korea wants its own deterrent. Personally I dont think so because North Korea's has made any progress towards economic independence and in fact has done a number of things which have made it worse, if that was even possible, such as drastically devaluing its currency. But perhaps its North Korea thinking that its better to make enemies rather than friends for security purposes. Starvation is a means of control in a dictatorship, preserving which is the ultimate North Korea goal, but further alienating itself it protects itself against outside influence via economic improvement or contact with foreigners that would come from economic growth. And by hanging onto its nukes and, hopefully, settling down after carving out its little spot, which its current actions would be attempting to achieve, it can be poor enough to control its people, preserve its regime, and isolated and unfriendly enough for other nations to want to leave alone but not so afraid they'd be willing to attack a nuclear power.
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I believe that was their intent all along. Security purposes. They have spent a great portion of their wealth to the development of these weapons. Now that they have them, they can focus more on working towards independance. But using that reasoning you would think that they don't actually want war. If they're attempting to carve out their own spot, the last thing they want to do is throw away their security which has got them to this point so far.
 
Watch out for Japan. If North Korea keeps this **** up, Japan will change their Constitution and start going offensive, including the building of nukes. There's no doubt in my mind that they know how.
 
ludahai said:
War sucks... not fair, but if that is what it takes to end the biggest threat to freedom in the world today (yes, even bigger than Obama), then so be it...

Seriously, nuking is a big strong, but there WILL be a war with China. The nature and specific spark is yet to be determined, but there WILL be one. Probably at least twenty years away, but there WILL be. One only has the see the hatred and rhetoric coming out of the Beijing regime to see the writing on the wall...
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Yes war with China is basically inevitable to happen one day...

It will be a tough one for the U.S. because China is far more advanced than most Americans think. The American media does not propaganda the advances China has militarily.

If America waits too long to conflict it would be worse because China is passing America both economically and militarily and it is imminent that within 20 years China will be FAR more powerful than the U.S.....
 
A war split between the United States and China would be so unequivocally, so absurdly destructive for both countries. Both countries would lose, millions would die and almost certainly a third party nation would come out as the new super power. Failing to realize this obvious reality only pays tribute to the embarrassing truth that if you believe such things will happen within the horizon of your grand children's lifetimes then you are a stupid fool and abhorrently ignorant of global and domestic policies. Speaking of such things is the mere fantasy of cracked and brittle patriots looking to soak the tree of liberty with blood. You are a child looking at the chess board curiously amused with the falling and moving of pawns, sadly ignorant of important pieces and strategies lurking behind them.
 
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