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Landmark commission hearing may determine future of ground zero mosque

At it's very roots, it's essential being, Islam is violently intolerant and incompatible with everyone who is not Muslim

Yeah if you assume that every single Muslim is a fundamentalist. With the same logic you could also paint the same picture about Christians.
 
Thanks for proving my point with your blind fear of Islam. :lol:

I'm just sayin', the truth that our leaders and news media refuse to say out loud.

We are in a war. Everyone who isn't a Muslim vs. everyone who is. Period. I don't give a **** how "moderate" the Muslims are or how assimilated, they are...

We are in a ****ING WAR. Believe it or not
 
I'm just sayin', the truth that our leaders and news media refuse to say out loud.

We are in a war. Everyone who isn't a Muslim vs. everyone who is. Period. I don't give a **** how "moderate" the Muslims are or how assimilated, they are...

We are in a ****ING WAR. Believe it or not

No you are at war with everyone who is Muslim. Not everyone. I know plenty of people that aren't at war with Muslims, but are at war with fanatics.
 
The Muslims are simply exploiting an available weakness. I can't fault them for that strategy. We do the same to our enemies. We try to determine their weaknesses and exploit them to our advantage. That's simply war and life in general.

You didn't answer either of my questions.

What about a bacon sammich joint?

Christ on a crutch -- while you're at it, why not wait for a gospel church congregation to build a new church, then snatch it and build a KFC on the site with a watermellon patch out back?
 
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Thanks for proving my point with your blind fear of Islam. :lol:

Lets make it REAL ****ing simple. If you have roaches coming into your house, you can't kill all the roaches in the world. What you can do is kill/drive out the ones that are in your house, remove food supplies that draw them in, and create a barrier around your house to discourage and prevent further incursion. You plug holes and generally, create a chemical barrier around the house.

The analogy carries over. You remove them from your country. You remove the attraction, i.e. immigration, jobs, benefits, etc., and you enforce your borders so they can't sneak in.
 
You just compared Muslims to roaches, and yet you want me to take you seriously?

Thanks for proving my point with your blind hatred of Islam. :lol:
 
No you are at war with everyone who is Muslim. Not everyone. I know plenty of people that aren't at war with Muslims, but are at war with fanatics.

Terrorism is not this issue and problem, soccerboy.... Infiltration/immigration/infection is the issue. Muslim immigration and breeding makes them the fastest growing demographic...like in Europe. As a result, the numbers are very clear and irrefutable, it is only a matter of time before they first exercise considerable political power as a block, and second, become the majority, in AMERICA

That isn't terrorism, it is the back door conquest of nations. What could not be accomplished by might of arms, can be through use of our own laws to exploit our weaknesses.
 
You just compared Muslims to roaches, and yet you want me to take you seriously?

Thanks for proving my point with your blind hatred of Islam. :lol:

You're not analyzing the situation from a rational point of view, with logic, you're colored by emotion. By those you love, admire, and an inability to look at the harsh reality because the conclusions are too terrible to contemplate.

You are too pussified :)
 
Is there any chance we can talk about the Mosque and not Christianity vs. Islam...

This community centre with a mosque in it has every legal right to be built. You may not like it. But you cannot legally stop it because you don't like it.
 
Sodomy, adultery, and premarital sex have all been criminalized in the US to various extents. It's been less than ten years since the sodomy laws were held to be unconstitutional.

They were seldom if ever enforced and by Lawrence V. Taylor 36 states had repealed the statutes or invalidated them through the state courts.

Adultery is still a criminal offense carrying a potential life sentence in some states.

Ya the right to sexual privacy was found by the SCOTUS in Lawrence V. Texas, so if anyone even was brought to court and convicted of adultery it would be overuled on appeal.

If you go back far enough, you'll find that the American colonies imposed the death penalty for witchcraft and blasphemy. All these laws were enacted by people who read the same Bible we read. They just interpreted it differently.

The point is that you don't have to go back far, in current mainstream Islam the only accepted views are that corporal punishment and/or capital punishment are the penalties for pre-marital sex, adultery, sodomy, and apostasy.
 
To remember the attack? They say their goal is reconciliation between non-Muslims and Muslims. This relationship was badly damaged by that attack, and the groundbreaking ceremony is trying to address that.

Give me a ****ing break, the largest proponent for this Mosque said that the U.S. brought 9-11 upon itself. Not only are they having the Mosque at ground zero but to rub everyone's nose in it they are holding the ground breaking ceremony on 9-11, and you people are honestly suggesting it is an attempt at reconciliation? How naive can you possibly be?
 
You're not analyzing the situation from a rational point of view, with logic, you're colored by emotion. By those you love, admire, and an inability to look at the harsh reality because the conclusions are too terrible to contemplate.

You are too pussified :)

You're not analyzing the situation from a rational point of view, with logic, you're colored by emotion. By those you fear, hate, and an inability to look at the harsh reality because the truth is so much harder to digest than the lie.

You are too funny. :lol:
 
Wait, so the actions of autocratic, corrupt governments reflect on a religion of 1.2 billion?

No the Ijma of the Ulama in all five schools of Islamic fiqh which have determined that apostasy, sodomy, adultery, and pre-marital sex are to be punished by death or lashings, reflects on Islam, that is not the fringe view, it is the ONLY accepted view in mainstream Islam. Are all Muslims violent? No. But that says absolutely nothing about Islam itself just as a pro-choice Catholic does not reflect on the pro-life position of the Catholic church.
 
Kind of reminds me of the cold war... :lol:

I know, right? Me too.

And it's the same arguments borne out of fear of the unknown and a twisted view of reality that is completely focused on the exceptions that make headlines, totally disregarding the normal and average harmless majority. I remember when people used to say that all Russians were savages bent on killing us all, and many posts in this thread remind me of that time. I'm willing to bet that not a single one of these people who rant and rail about Islam and Muslims have ever met a single Muslim in real life.
 
Maybe they got mugged by a big, burly, monobrow Muslim in a back alley, bludgeoned with a hefty Koran until they gave up their kids' milk money.

:lol:
 
You're not analyzing the situation from a rational point of view, with logic, you're colored by emotion. By those you fear, hate, and an inability to look at the harsh reality because the truth is so much harder to digest than the lie.

You are too funny. :lol:

Until people like you quit pandering to their "religious sensibilities" and acknowledge that it is not a religion of peace, it is just going to get worse.
 
I know, right? Me too.

And it's the same arguments borne out of fear of the unknown and a twisted view of reality that is completely focused on the exceptions that make headlines, totally disregarding the normal and average harmless majority. I remember when people used to say that all Russians were savages bent on killing us all, and many posts in this thread remind me of that time. I'm willing to bet that not a single one of these people who rant and rail about Islam and Muslims have ever met a single Muslim in real life.

Heres to all of our brothers and sisters who have given their lives against these ****ing pricks.

May you Rest In Peace.
 
Until people like you quit pandering to their "religious sensibilities" and acknowledge that it is not a religion of peace, it is just going to get worse.

Until people like you quit pandering to their blind fear and acknowledge that any religious institution which builds a significant amount of political power has the potential to turn that power towards violent ends, it is just going to get worse.

Christianity isn't any more or less a religion of peace than is Islam. Christianity's time in the sun has, for the most part, passed. That, more than any ideological reformation, is why modern Christianity appears to be more peaceful than modern Islam appears to be.
 
Christianity isn't any more or less a religion of peace than is Islam. Christianity's time in the sun has, for the most part, passed. That, more than any ideological reformation, is why modern Christianity appears to be more peaceful than modern Islam appears to be.
We're not talking about the past, we're talking about the present. How the religion was 500 or 1000 years ago is not too relevant to how it is today.

We live in the 21st century, not the middle ages.
 
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We're not talking about the past, we're talking about the present. How the religion was 500 or 1000 years ago is not too relevant to how it is today.

We live in the 21st century, not the middle ages.

History is always relevant.

Christianity has demonstrated its potential to be a violent religion when it had the political power to go along with the ambitions of its leadership.

In truth, today's Islam is significantly less dangerous than Christianity at its peak, primarily because it is decentralized.
 
History is always relevant.

Christianity has demonstrated its potential to be a violent religion when it had the political power to go along with the ambitions of its leadership.

In truth, today's Islam is significantly less dangerous than Christianity at its peak, primarily because it is decentralized.
You're neglecting that its peak was during the middle ages or 1500's, or however long ago when we thought the sun revolved around the earth and the earth was flat. We live in a civilized and developed world now. The far past is not relevant to today's actions.

I'm not defending Christianity in the past, in the crusades they were violent. But that is done now and it is not relevant to today. What we are looking at is how are the religions today.
 
You're neglecting that its peak was during the middle ages or 1500's, or however long ago when we thought the sun revolved around the earth and the earth was flat.

No, actually, I'm not neglecting any such thing. I sorta figured you would know that, so I didn't mention it. Sorta like how I didn't that the sky is blue.

We live in a civilized and developed world now. The far past is not relevant to today's actions.

Anybody who actually believes that is a complete fool.

History never stops being relevant when the subject is human nature and ambition.

I'm not defending Christianity in the past, in the crusades they were violent. But that is done now and it is not relevant to today. What we are looking at is how are the religions today.

Actually, what I'm looking at is what you get when you combine religious organizations with political power, regardless of when in human history the two came together.

The end result is always violence.
 
How does that excuse the severe lack of religious freedom in Muslim dominated countries? It doesn't.

And the differences between Sunni and Shia Muslims have NOTHING to do with Islam's stance on non believers, women or religious text that bare any point to the discussion here:

Shia Muslims believe that the Imam is sinless by nature, and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God. Therefore, Shia Muslims often venerate the Imams as saints and perform pilgrimages to their tombs and shrines in the hopes of divine intercession.

Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for a hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders, and certainly no basis for the veneration or intercession of saints. Sunni Muslims contend that leadership of the community is not a birthright, but a trust that is earned and which may be given or taken away by the people themselves.


What's the Difference Between Shia and Sunni Muslims?

I'm not trying to excuse it. I'm just saying it doesn't make them a danger to us. The differences you cite between Shia and Sunni sound similar to the differences between Catholics and Protestants. That doesn't mean Christians are evil or that they can't be reasonable.

texmaster said:
Yet not a single Muslim country has a majority of people in ANY poll where Bin Laden is considered evil.

There goes your theory.

And that would be exactly wrong. You'd be hard pressed to find a country where a majority support him.

texmaster said:
And you being the Bin Laden supporter ignore the fact that we pulled out of Saudi Arabia before the Afgan invasion and he still attacked nor were we in Iraq. Your excuses for Bin Laden's claims for justification are truely pathetic.

Wrong again. We started pulling out of Saudi Arabia in 2003, after 9/11, Afghanistan, Iraq I, and Iraq II.

texmaster said:
How about we read what Bin Laden told his followers about the real reason he attacked us.

In 2003 on the first day of the Muslim holy celebration of Eid al-Adha, the Feat of Sacrifice, he began a sermon:

"Praise be to Allah who revealed the verse of the Sword to his Servant and messenger in order to establish truth and abolish falsehood."

What does the verse of the Sword say?

Fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war)."

None of that contradicts his many statements that he attacked the Americans because of "their evil and injustice in the whole of the Islamic World, especially in Iraq and Palestine, and their occupation of the Land of the Two Holy Sanctuaries." Nor does your passage from the Koran, which has been quoted ad nauseam without context, contradict other passages that command Muslims to live in peace with their neighbors. It applies specifically to conditions of war, and war against pagans at that.

texmaster said:
Bin Laden's supporters like you who soak up his lies about his justification for attacking can always find an excuse to continue the murder of Americans.

You give Bin Laden his power. Terrorist supporters like you who justify attacks on Americans by believing what the terrorists claim in speeches to the West while ignoring the speeches they give to their own people which reveals the true justification for attacking the West.

If you think crimes committed by the American government would "justify" terrorist attacks on the American people, I feel sorry for you. I refuse to believe that they do. And if you think an American can't be patriotic while still acknowledging our country's mistakes, your sense of patriotism must be very fragile, indeed.
 
No, actually, I'm not neglecting any such thing. I sorta figured you would know that, so I didn't mention it. Sorta like how I didn't that the sky is blue.
Yeah, you're neglecting that part in your argument, which is why your argument is false, not neglecting that piece of information. Of course I wouldn't expect you to understand this, otherwise you would be able to properly respond to arguments.

Anybody who actually believes that is a complete fool.

History never stops being relevant when the subject is human nature and ambition.

Actually, anybody who believes otherwise is a fool. I take it you don't live in the civilized part of the world or you wish to go back to the Middle Ages?

The Middle Ages are not relevant to the actions of people today.

Actually, what I'm looking at is what you get when you combine religious organizations with political power, regardless of when in human history the two came together.

The end result is always violence.
How is this relevant to Islam, violence, and the 21st century? It's not. You're just stating the same irrelevant sentence over and over.
 
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