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Obama's aunt granted asylum

Ockham said:
So it seems as though Mr. Obama is the asshole you proport him NOT to be after all. Given she was rejected and Obama claims he didn't know she was even in the United States until 2008 --- sounds as if he didn't know, didn't care or both.

So I'll say again - let's release the hearing information and let the cards fall where they may. If it's all on the up and up and Obama didn't interfere - the system worked and all is well.
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If her life was in danger and he didn't help her when he could have, then yes... he's a total ****ing asshole.

If however, he did assist her in getting asylum, I have no issue with it.

And the thought that "if it hurts no one" all's fair is a fairly ****ed up world view on your part. Laws are made to be followed and kept - undue influence by a politician including the President is troublesome and in some cases illegal. It's not okay - either laws apply to all or none. This isn't the mafia or some good old boy club where one scratches another's back and the other gives a reach around.
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Meh. I don't have respect for a law just because it's a law. Some laws are ****ing retarded.

And in this country, people can, will, and always have been given help by people they know. Nothing wrong with that.
 
Moon said:
Honestly, I'm much more interested in consistency. I'd be willing to bet if it was Bush or some other Republican involved in a similar situation, a lot on the left would be screeching cronyism, abuse of power, etc. etc. And you know what? They could be right. I think this thing smells just a tad, regardless of who did it.

If he influenced the decision of the immigration court in any way, then that's wrong, just like it would be if it was someone from the other side of the aisle.
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Something like this already happened with Bush, when it came out he got out of going to war because of Cronyism. And yeah, some on the left stupidly bitched and complained about how unfair it was that his daddies friends allowed him to get out of the war...and conservatives and republicans defended it.

I don't have to think of some magical hypothetical, a similar situation (Well, similar to what's being ASSUMED by some here as if its fact) has occured and a similar reaction didn't come about.

If immigration courts allow for family members to speak on behalf of those seeking asylum he did nothing wrong IF he did that, which at this time as its JUST breaking we don't know. If he didn't even speak to anyone about it but they happened to do it because they found out she was related to him he did nothing wrong.

Yes, if Obama broke any laws or forced someone into this that's wrong. To my understanding thus far that has not happened.

All the people demanding answers, literally within a day or so of this breaking, is ridiculous. We have conservatives bitching and moaning that he's flying to Europe to speak on behalf of a U.S. city for the Olympics because its wasting time (even though nothing says he couldn't be working during the majority of that time) and yet we want him to waste time looking into this situation, releasing information about this, giving press conferences to answer questions on this, etc. Seriously, the consistancy here is non-existance...its just a giant steaming pile of hyper partisan crap that for the most part has no purpose save for trying to score political points cause the guys got a (D) next to his name.
 
Zyphlin said:
How absolutely low and ridiculous.

So for months upon months now Rush Limbaugh and others have lambasted and joked, to the roaring approving laughter of fans, how Obama says we should be our "brother's keeper" but that his brother lives in a shack and is in a bad part of the world and why doesn't old Obama be his brother's keeper and help his family member out and get HIM out of poverty.

So then we have someone related to Obama granted asylum here. We don't know the facts, yet people are already jumping the gun with suggestions, implications, and assumptions that this was all done based on Obama. However, even assuming that's the case, isn't that just doing what Rush and others have essentially been lambasting him for NOT doing with his brother?

So lets see here...

If he doesn't help his distant family that don't live here he's being a hypocrite for talking about people needing to be their "brother's keeper" and is worthy of ridicule for not using his resources to help his family out.

If someone in his distant family actually does make it into America though, we're to assume and imply immedietely that its because of Obama, and if it is the case that it was because of Obama we should lambast and attack him for using his resources to help his family out.

For the love of christ, this is why hyper partisans always look foolish, because they give up any attempt at individual integrity or insight in exchange for continual attempts at scoring political points. Its actions and attitudes like presented here that make real, legitimate, honest, adult political discourse so difficult in this country.

His aunt is here. We have no facts of how close he is to his aunt, we have no facts whether he helped her get over here, we don't even know whether it'd be unethical if he DID help her get there. Once we get more information, then maybe we can figure something out.
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Got it..... it's alright for Barry's Illegal Alien Aunt to sneak into the country, live off the public purse, refuse to leave when told to, but let's get that law breaking Mexican out of the country?

Hypocrite much?

Post 42

http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaking-news/72739-student-s-arrest-tests-immigration-policy-3.html

Or is that Barry can do no wrong?
 
Crunch said:
Got it..... it's alright for Barry's Illegal Alien Aunt to sneak into the country, live off the public purse, refuse to leave when told to, but let's get that law breaking Mexican out of the country?
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Yes, I think she should follow the rule of law.

Our rule of law allows for judges to make rulings in regards to asylum in cases where someone is fleeing for their life from their home country.

There is a grave and huge difference between someone breaking the laws, repeatedly, and being deported with no legal leeway to keep them here, and someone that came here illegally...yet made themselves known (through the asylum attempt the first time)...and is now still here because the law, a judge, decided to hear the case and rule in her favor.

If the judge ruled against her, then hell yes, deport her ass.

Unlike you apparently, I do not cherry pick when I follow the law. We have asylum rules and standards for a specific reason and if she falls within them then she's within the boundaries of the law. If she didn't I'd absolutely be in favor of her deportation.

But thanks for reaching, it was entertaining to watch. Next time, perhaps check the premise of your statement and your argument may look less ignorant. Your premise is that somehow I'm an Obama sycophant and think he can "do no wrong". Your premise is flawed, and frankly stupid, and thus why your pathetic attempt at playing "Gotcha" failed. The illegal immigrant in the post you linked to has no legal standing to remain in this country...this woman does.
 
Halliburton gets one of the largest no-bid contracts awarded to any company by the U.S. government while its former CEO is sitting Vice President and nobody on the right blinks an eye.

Obama's aunt may or may not have been allowed to stay because Obama pulled some strings and it's cronyism and an 'abuse of the public trust'.

Americans really do deserve the government we have.
 
jallman said:
You know what? Whatever.

It's his aunt and it's a little old lady in a wheelchair who is seeking asylum from a country that is torn by violence. So what if she's the president's aunt? There's got to be some perks for having the single most stressful job in the world...if he pulls a couple diplomatic strings to get her through the process, by all means, I would, too.
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There are people living all over the world in countries "torn by violence".... are we then to move them all here and afford them public housing.... food...power.... a new car..... wide screen TV....

Get my drift?

BTW..... the clan she comes from is the largest in Kenya. When do they arrive?

How about the rest of his family?

If we are going to toss the law out for the President, where do you draw the line?

Fraud?

Theft? and how much?

How about we just give him a full pass and include murder?

You see, either the laws of this country are to be obeyed or all laws are undermined and we will eventually end up a 3rd world Banana Republic where your life isn't worth 2 cents.

So what do you want, law and order, or anarchy?
 
Crunch said:
There are people living all over the world in countries "torn by violence".... are we then to move them all here and afford them public housing.... food...power.... a new car..... wide screen TV....
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None of them are related to the President so I don't much care.
Get my drift?
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Hyperbole is not your friend.

BTW..... the clan she comes from is the largest in Kenya. When do they arrive?
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Obama is related to her. Not the clan. Slippery slope fallacy.

How about the rest of his family?
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What about them? None of them have asked for asylum to the U.S. to my knowledge.
If we are going to toss the law out for the President, where do you draw the line?
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Do you have evidence that the law was tossed out for the President? I'll appreciate it. Court transcripts, her case file etc would be appreciated in making your case.

Fraud?

Theft? and how much?

How about we just give him a full pass and include murder?
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Slippery slope arguments are silly.

You see, either the laws of this country are to be obeyed or all laws are undermined and we will eventually end up a 3rd world Banana Republic where your life isn't worth 2 cents.

So what do you want, law and order, or anarchy?
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When you can provide any evidence that the law was twisted because she was related to Obama - I welcome it - conjecture is not helping you right now. You sound desperate with all the slippery slope fallacies.
 
Zyphlin said:
Yes, I think she should follow the rule of law.

Our rule of law allows for judges to make rulings in regards to asylum in cases where someone is fleeing for their life from their home country.

There is a grave and huge difference between someone breaking the laws, repeatedly, and being deported with no legal leeway to keep them here, and someone that came here illegally...yet made themselves known (through the asylum attempt the first time)...and is now still here because the law, a judge, decided to hear the case and rule in her favor.

If the judge ruled against her, then hell yes, deport her ass.

Unlike you apparently, I do not cherry pick when I follow the law. We have asylum rules and standards for a specific reason and if she falls within them then she's within the boundaries of the law. If she didn't I'd absolutely be in favor of her deportation.

But thanks for reaching, it was entertaining to watch. Next time, perhaps check the premise of your statement and your argument may look less ignorant. Your premise is that somehow I'm an Obama sycophant and think he can "do no wrong". Your premise is flawed, and frankly stupid, and thus why your pathetic attempt at playing "Gotcha" failed. The illegal immigrant in the post you linked to has no legal standing to remain in this country...this woman does.
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The Judge did rule against her... she stayed. Barry got elected, she gets to stay.

She did break the law.... she was an ILLEGAL ALIEN..... she disobeyed a deportation order. I don’t know and don’t care if she illegally stole public housing , it’s still wrong.

Your pathetic hypocrisy is duly noted.... don't ever lecture anyone else about their hypocrisy or hyper partisanship.... you are no better than the worst here.
 
This is obviously a result of the influence of Obama since he has become President. She was turned down before and nothing has changed. We cannot give asylum to everyone on the planet who lives in a country without our freedoms and claiming they are being discriminated against. This woman is not able to fend for herself and is a burden on the society as a whole. She has been living here illegally since the expiration of her visa and her original hearing where she was ordered out. She should be sent back and forced to wait at the back of the line of all Kenyans who have applied for naturalized US citizenship after paying a fine for her scoff law behavior and returning all public assistance $ she has used so far. Maybe Obama will pay her fines and debts. He obviously has an interest in her staying here or she would be gone.
 
Crunch said:
The Judge did rule against her... she stayed. Barry got elected, she gets to stay.
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Correlation doesn't equal causation. There is absolutely no proof as of yet that Obama pulled any strings or did anything illegal or unethical to get the judge to grant her asylum. Should that be shown my view may change. Based on the information we actually HAVE, and not crazy assumptions by hyper partisans that only give a damn about scoring political points, she's here legally now and through no wrong doing on the part of Obama.

She did break the law.... she was an ILLEGAL ALIEN..... she disobeyed a deportation order. I don’t know and don’t care if she illegally stole public housing , it’s still wrong.
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Yes, and she's wrong for all of that. That said, currently...today...a Judge, a person of U.S. Law, has ruled her asylum is granted and thus she's legally allowed to be here. I support the rule of law. As such, I would've supported her deportation up until the point where the law now says she's legally allowed to be here. Just like I'm for the deportation of the person in the thread you linked, but if suddenly amnesty was declared then well, I'd no longer be saying they need to be deported.

Your pathetic hypocrisy is duly noted.... don't ever lecture anyone else about their hypocrisy or hyper partisanship.... you are no better than the worst here.
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There is no hypocrisy here. You've demonstrated nothing. In one case the person isn't legally allowed to be here, in the other they are...end of story. Keep beating up your strawman, its entertaining.

Also, might want to look up partisanship. If you're going to lambast me for being partisan, I'm partisan to the right...which is hardly where Obama is. For you to use this to claim I'm somehow a hyper partisan you'd have to show one, how I'm partisan to the side that Obama is politically in the first place, and two, how I'm forgoing reason, logic, and principles in the name of mindlessly following my ideological side at all costs.

Considering I'm a conservative, and have never voted Democrat, and routinely criticize Obama, and voted for McCain/Palin rather than him, you're going to be really hard pressed to say I'm Partisan to the left.

Stop talking, you're making your argument look worse and worse.
 
I always knew Zyphlin was a closet lefty.
 
That's me, one step away from Karl Marx :roll:
 
ah...

so THIS is the topic APPROVED!

LOL!
 
Crunch said:
There are people living all over the world in countries "torn by violence".... are we then to move them all here and afford them public housing.... food...power.... a new car..... wide screen TV....
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OK, well you show me where Obama's aunt is beign "afforded" all those things by the public treasury and then I might muster up the energy to care.

Get my drift?

BTW..... the clan she comes from is the largest in Kenya. When do they arrive?
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When the rest of the clan starts arriving because of his intervention on their behalves, then I might muster up the energy to care.

How about the rest of his family?
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If it's his family I am never going to muster up the energy to care. Family values are something that I actually respect.

If we are going to toss the law out for the President, where do you draw the line?
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Show me where the law was tossed out for him and I might muster up the energy to care.

Fraud?

Theft? and how much?

How about we just give him a full pass and include murder?
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Your appeal to the absurd isn't going to work.

You see, either the laws of this country are to be obeyed or all laws are undermined and we will eventually end up a 3rd world Banana Republic where your life isn't worth 2 cents.

So what do you want, law and order, or anarchy?
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Well if you are actually afraid that the most powerful man in the world pulling a couple strings to get his wheelchair bound elderly aunt into his own country under his protection is going to turn the US into a 3rd world Banana Republic, I don't think there's much opportunity for rational discussion here anymore.

I just can't get all up in arms over this. Sorry. In fact, it's ****ing ridiculous and transparent as a ploy to tarnish the man when there's so much more rational and productive disagreement to have with him.

So, again, my position on this is a big, fat WHATEVER.
 
Agent Ferris said:
Good point why has my property that he and his government have taken from me at gunpoint go to pay for his private jet?
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What even are you talking about.


Agent Ferris said:
And while we're at it why does he get to steal from me to pay your salary?
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Well I pay taxes, therefore I pay my own salary. My taxes also go towards programs across the country, which aid civilians. How much of my taxes go into welfare?

Of course, if you strictly pay my salary, then you just pay for the priviledge of having others fight your battles for you.
 
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