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Pentagon asking Congress to hold back on generous increases in troop pay

Farmers get big ass subsidies, too.

The Swiss have a very strong military. In fact, every male citizen in Swizterland is a member of the armed forces. Wanna pick another country?

And the farm subsidies have led to $.90 cheeseburgers; fattening sodas; unnaturally-fed cows, pigs, and chickens spreading hormones to our children that they shouldn't be consuming; and to Monsanto controlling 90% of all the soybeans and 80% of all the corn in the nation.

And Switzerland doesn't have a military in the same way that we do. Only about 5% are professional soliders. Every male under 50 (in certain cases) is considered an active-duty soldier under conscript laws; but since they don't fight any wars, they basically never actually on duty in the same way an enlisted man/woman here would be.
 
And the farm subsidies have led to $.90 cheeseburgers; fattening sodas; unnaturally-fed cows, pigs, and chickens spreading hormones to our children that they shouldn't be consuming; and to Monsanto controlling 90% of all the soybeans and 80% of all the corn in the nation.

And Switzerland doesn't have a military in the same way that we do. Only about 5% are professional soliders. Every male under 50 (in certain cases) is considered an active-duty soldier under conscript laws; but since they don't fight any wars, they basically never actually on duty in the same way an enlisted man/woman here would be.

re Monsanto

Not for long. As most of their GM seeds are "round up" ready crops, the fact that glyphosate resistant weeds are becoming a problem will see Monsanto's dominate position in the market will weaken.
 
The military is only an investment for the private sector that develops weapons. Tax payers don't see returns on military capital during the war. It's just a black hole of money that keeps getting used up, or haven't you been paying attention to the war spending acts in congress?

Throwing money and lives away: that's what congress is good at.

It's not a manufacturing industry, it's more of a service industry. It costs money, and provides us a service, giving us more security and being an extension of foreign policy.
 
So you can't defend your argument?
What are you going to do next, wrap yourself in an American flag and play some Lee Greenwood?

I don't need to defend my argument. It stand on it's own merits.





At the same time, most small farmers don't get this huge amount of praise for providing one of the requirements of life.
Most don't get those big ass subsidies.

Ever hear of Farm Aid? All farmers qualify for some sorta free money, or other.
 
I find it interesting that folks who support pay raises for the military are the same folks who do not support pay raises for teachers. In as much as our servicemen and women do jobs that protect our country, teachers do jobs that support our children. Both of these jobs are about as important as they come.

And, for the record, I support pay raises for both professions.

I support teacher pay raises. What I don't support, are substandard teachers who can't be fired, because of civil service, or union protection.
 
I support teacher pay raises. What I don't support, are substandard teachers who can't be fired, because of civil service, or union protection.

I can agree with that.
 
I don't need to defend my argument. It stand on it's own merits.

I disagree and have provided logical reasoning of why I think it doesn't.

Ever hear of Farm Aid? All farmers qualify for some sorta free money, or other.

Yep I do know of this but there are many fields which have little to no subsidy and yet they provide a valuable service every day from every member of said group.

They aren't worshiped as heroes, even though it can be argued that they do something more valuable than what the military provides.
 
on the contrary; the military (and the police) are what allow free market items like farms to exist and do business with any kind of chance at success. try farming for a career when others are free to come and take your produce at gunpoint.
 
on the contrary; the military (and the police) are what allow free market items like farms to exist and do business with any kind of chance at success. try farming for a career when others are free to come and take your produce at gunpoint.

Without farms, police and military cannot exist at all.
Farms could exist without state authorities and have existed without them in the past.

They rely more on farmers and economic producers than the producers rely on them.
 
Without farms, police and military cannot exist at all.

:shrug: the two are interdependent. you can't have agriculture without security, and you can't afford a standing military or police force without agriculture.

however, to argue that "farm subsidies = the existence of farms" is ludicrous. food prices would drop without those price supports.
 
:shrug: the two are interdependent. you can't have agriculture without security, and you can't afford a standing military or police force without agriculture.

The point is that people like to push up the military as some golden child, while there are millions of other people, who work harder and sacrifice more for less pay.
They don't get the same respect as an enlisted person.

however, to argue that "farm subsidies = the existence of farms" is ludicrous. food prices would drop without those price supports.

They should drop, I never argued that subsidies keep farms alive.
They mostly benefit big agribusiness.
 
The point is that people like to push up the military as some golden child, while there are millions of other people, who work harder and sacrifice more for less pay.
They don't get the same respect as an enlisted person.

They should drop, I never argued that subsidies keep farms alive.
They mostly benefit big agribusiness.

that's fair enough. my point is simply that these people already make half or less than half of the Federal Gubments' civilian workforce; and perhaps that workforce should see cuts before they do.
 
that's fair enough. my point is simply that these people already make half or less than half of the Federal Gubments' civilian workforce; and perhaps that workforce should see cuts before they do.

The proposal is not a cut in pay, but less of an increase in pay. They are still getting more money
 
that's fair enough. my point is simply that these people already make half or less than half of the Federal Gubments' civilian workforce; and perhaps that workforce should see cuts before they do.

I have no problem with that.

A lot of federal civilian jobs exist solely to keep the illusion of full employment.
In times of deflation, the feds should be cutting or freezing pay and benefits.
 
OK, leave base pay where it is, but raise combat pay and other forms of hazardous duty pay a lot depending on type.
The troops in the middle east should be compensated more than the clerk types back in the pentagon.
 
OK, leave base pay where it is, but raise combat pay and other forms of hazardous duty pay a lot depending on type.
The troops in the middle east should be compensated more than the clerk types back in the pentagon.

Why?

If they were concerned about the fact it is a dangerous job and they were not being compensated enough for that level of danger they should not have signed up. They shoiuld have become a clerk in an office if they were concerned about the danger
 
Why?

If they were concerned about the fact it is a dangerous job and they were not being compensated enough for that level of danger they should not have signed up. They shoiuld have become a clerk in an office if they were concerned about the danger

I am guessing you never served in the military? It isn't like you get to pick and choose your specialty, or duty stations......
Some do, but most don't....
 
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