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US bans offshore drilling as Deepwater Horizon slick hits land

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U.S. Said to Allow Drilling Without Needed Permits - NYTimes.com

The minerals agency since January 2009 has approved at least three huge lease sales, 103 seismic blasting projects and 346 drilling plans. Agency records also show that permission for those projects and plans was granted without getting the permits required under federal law.

In a letter from September 2009, obtained by The New York Times, NOAA accused the minerals agency of a pattern of understating the likelihood and potential consequences of a major spill in the gulf and understating the frequency of spills that have already occurred there.

Managers at the agency have routinely overruled staff scientists whose findings highlight the environmental risks of drilling, according to a half-dozen current or former agency scientists.

Those approvals, federal records show, include one for the well drilled by the Deepwater Horizon rig, which exploded on April 20, killing 11 workers and resulting in thousands of barrels of oil spilling into the gulf each day.

the presidency's a bitch

so's the grey lady
 

Oh noes1!1 you found me out :shock:

Urban Dictionary: evil conservative

evil-con-logo.gif



***
I said new information, not redundant information. Your links are just saying the same thing over and over which I've already responded to, so I'll sit back and wait until there's something NEW.
 
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Oh noes1!1 you found me out :shock:

Urban Dictionary: evil conservative

evil-con-logo.gif



***
I said new information, not redundant information. Your links are just saying the same thing over and over which I've already responded to, so I'll sit back and wait until there's something NEW.

Getting the size of the spill correct is new. Of course you may be set on the 5000 bbl/day figure for good.
 
No drilling in America means continued reliance upon backwards regimes and a continued burden to "protect" the stability of the Middle East even as they breed the very scum who blame us for all that is wrong with their world.

Figure it out dumbasses.
 
BBC News - BP says latest scheme to halt US oil leak working well

Oh man, I'm so sorry guys, it looks like they're getting the situation under control. Oh well, so much for 3x/8x Exxon Valdez. Maybe next time we'll have something valid for you get all worked up over.

Jerry, it's people like you who try to make every issue a right versus left thang that makes it so hard for both sides to work together when it's a really important issue, like this is. Contrary to the right wing's talking points, that you seem to march to, nobody wants this oil spill to get worse. The quicker it gets controlled and shut down the better. Nobody wins if this gets worse.
 
ap and the times put up right wing talking points?

LOL!
 
Jerry, it's people like you who...

Seriously, I didn't read more than that.

It's "people like me" who stand up to serve and defend the country, so I don't give a **** what some anon's opinion of me is.

If you have anything of substance to bring to the thread, especially something of technical significances (as opposed to political significance), please let me know. Otherwise, we have a Basement, you can take it there.
 
Seriously, I didn't read more than that.

It's "people like me" who stand up to serve and defend the country, so I don't give a **** what some anon's opinion of me is.

A little touchy on the obvious, ehh? :2wave: What in the hell does being in the military have to do with being outed as a partisan? All of your "opinions" of this spill have been that it's no big deal, that the left is making a mountain out of a molehill. "People like you" who use their service as an excuse to browbeat anyone who exposes your true colors are a waste of time discussing anything with.

If you have anything of substance to bring to the thread, especially something of technical significances (as opposed to political significance), please let me know. Otherwise, we have a Basement, you can take it there.

I brought substance and showed your article to be partisan because it didn't print all the facts. I wasn't trying to make points, just showing another opinion. It was you who had to slink down and go the rightee, personal attack route, as usual. I'm sorry you don't like, and can't take, the truth. If you're going to dish it out you should learn to take it too.
 
A little touchy on the obvious, ehh? :2wave: What in the hell does being in the military have to do with being outed as a partisan? All of your "opinions" of this spill have been that it's no big deal, that the left is making a mountain out of a molehill. "People like you" who use their service as an excuse to browbeat anyone who exposes your true colors are a waste of time discussing anything with.



I brought substance and showed your article to be partisan because it didn't print all the facts. I wasn't trying to make points, just showing another opinion. It was you who had to slink down and go the rightee, personal attack route, as usual. I'm sorry you don't like, and can't take, the truth. If you're going to dish it out you should learn to take it too.

My service grounds my identity and confidence in myself. I'm sorry that intimidates you into reacting when someone doesn't give a **** about your opinion of them.

As for my article, I got home from drill, logged to see what the world was up to, clicked on the "Latest Headlines" button at the top of FireFox and found something which was news to me. If it's biased, that's fine, I didn't write it so I have nothing to worry about. I read every other article sourced on this thread so it's not like I have a limited scope of news consumption relative to your own. My interest in the story is technical, not political, so from my perspective biased sources which give more technical information are of more value than unbiased sources which only discuss opinion or policy.

So what if this spill is currently bigger than the Exxon Valdez? So the **** what?

I'm not trying to be crass what I ask that. With the current estimate of oil being spilled, this spill is just now showing as a blip compared to other spills much larger, AND you never heard anything about those spills because a politician didn't need political will to make policy.

Blow-outs happen all the ****ing time. All the ****ing time. Obviously this blow out was hosting a faulty BOP, and **** got spilled. When this thread started we were talking 5K barrels per day. Seriously that's nothing. 5K is nothing and you folks were crying like it was the end of the world. If this thread had started with either accurate numbers of a leveled response to the very low number of 5K, maybe my contributions would have been angled differently.

So the left pissed it's pants over 5K per day, only to later realize it's over 10x that. Frankly I'm surprised the Left didn't commit mass suicide over the news.

At least this time it's not America's fault. Valdez was a drunk American skipper, if I recall correctly. Deepwater was Europeam owned rig leased to a European company.
 
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Seriously, I didn't read more than that.

It's "people like me" who stand up to serve and defend the country, so I don't give a **** what some anon's opinion of me is.
.

Brag much?
 
Jerry, it's people like you who try to make every issue a right versus left thang that makes it so hard for both sides to work together when it's a really important issue, like this is. Contrary to the right wing's talking points, that you seem to march to, nobody wants this oil spill to get worse. The quicker it gets controlled and shut down the better. Nobody wins if this gets worse.




You got to be kidding? You can't seriously believe you aren't a partisan hack, you calling ANYONE a partisan is irony personified. Seriously, are you seriously suggesting you are objective when it comes to left right politics?

:lamo
 
Brag much?

Opps, you quoted the wrong the post. It's cool, everyone makes mistakes.

This is the one you wanted:

No but I think you are.

So, yeah, just got back from drill, we totally SMOKED the other detachments in the competition. I mean we didn't just win, we PWN'd, we ****ing owned their asses in every event. Land-nav, DnC, general knowledge, medical, and I got the best time dismantling/reassembling the M16 with a passing functions check.....we were baddass.

So while I was out being a winner with the Guard this weekend, did the world end?

But no seriously, did they lower the top-hat or insert that tube yet? Any news of any sort?

...technical news, not 'some politician/op-ed/talking-head said ABC' or 'some tree-huger said ZOMG Oh noes!1!!'....anything at least pretending to be semi-intelligent?
 
Opps, you quoted the wrong the post. It's cool, everyone makes mistakes.

This is the one you wanted:

No, I quoted the right post.
 
My service grounds my identity and confidence in myself. I'm sorry that intimidates you into reacting when someone doesn't give a **** about your opinion of them.

Hey pal, get over yourself. Neither you nor your service “intimidates” anybody. Hell, I didn’t even know you were in the service. You were the one who brought your service into the discussion to give you some kind of excuse for your trivializing and politicizing this disaster, another right wing tactic. Why do some of you guys think that once your partisan bull**** is exposed that your “service to your country” is going to excuse your behavior?

As for my article, I got home from drill,

Oh, are you in the “service”? Ooooohhhh….. We better give your posts more credit then, or give you more leeway with your personal attacks,ehh? :roll:

logged to see what the world was up to, clicked on the "Latest Headlines" button at the top of FireFox and found something which was news to me. If it's biased, that's fine, I didn't write it so I have nothing to worry about. I read every other article sourced on this thread so it's not like I have a limited scope of news consumption relative to your own.

If “your scope” was “not limited”, and you are indeed informed of info that debunks your silly positions here, then it’s obvious your opinion is not to be given much credit. Don’t act like you don’t have a dog in this fight. Any excuse to attack Obama, or the left, works fine for you… even when your position is proven to be wrong or have holes in it.

My interest in the story is technical, not political,

Bull****. It’s another excuse to attack Obama and try to make fun of people who care about our environment, as IF they are all leftees. :doh

so from my perspective biased sources which give more technical information are of more value than unbiased sources which only discuss opinion or policy.

Technical information? Such as?

So what if this spill is currently bigger than the Exxon Valdez? So the ****
what?

I'm not trying to be crass what I ask that.

Sure you are. You revel in riling up folks, who you wrongly assume are mostly on the left, who actually live down there and will be personally affected by it. Some of those people are even on your side of the political fence. THEY get it. This oil leak is not political. It is reality. But, to you, it is just another reason to make fun of something that you think will give you a free shot at Obama. Pathetic. There comes a time when the sword of politics should be laid down to fight a common enemy. You are a symbol of what’s wrong with politics these days.

This spill is nothing compared to other spills much larger, AND you never heard anything about those spills because a politician didn't need political will to make policy.

This has the potential to have a much bigger impact than the Valdez did, even if it doesn’t get bigger than it. And it’s obvious you don’t care about any of the implications of that.

Blow-outs happen all the ****ing time. All the ****ing time. Obviously this blow
out was hosting a faulty BOP, and **** got spilled. When this thread started we
were talking 5K barrels per day. Seriously that's nothing. 5K is nothing…

Except that, if the leak doesn’t get plugged, or controlled, then the leak will surpass the Exxon Valdez in about 52 days. The Valdez was a major disaster and it happened in an unpopulated area. This leak is in the #1 fishing area in the U.S. THAT would make it a pretty big ****ing deal.

And now we know, from one of the survivors from the rig, that BP was the one responsible for breaking that BOP. And BP KNEW it was broke! It should be interesting to hear your retort to that. Somehow it's probably Obama's fault, I'm sure.

… and you folks were crying like it was the end of the world. If this thread had started with either accurate numbers of a leveled response to the very low number of 5K,
maybe my contributions would have been angled differently.

How so? At the time, those numbers were accepted by most people to be accurate.

So the left pissed it's pants over 5K per day, only to later realize it's over
10x that. Frankly I'm surprised the Left didn't commit mass suicide over the
news.

psst::: There are a lot of Republicans on our southern shores who are “pissing their pants” over this and it has nothing to do with politics. It has to do with their lives!

At least this time it's not America's fault. Valdez was a drunk American
skipper, if I recall correctly. Deepwater was European owned rig leased to a
European company.

Actually, it IS America’s fault. And it goes back to your heroes Bush and Cheeney. They started gutting the oil regs, allowing companies like BP to basically act in our waters like they do in other countries where there are no regs. True enough that our own MMS is to blame for this too. But, considering it’s full of Cheeney puppets it comes as no surprise how they’ve acted.
 
You got to be kidding? You can't seriously believe you aren't a partisan hack, you calling ANYONE a partisan is irony personified. Seriously, are you seriously suggesting you are objective when it comes to left right politics?

The truth is that you aren't open minded enough to tell the difference. People on here try to talk to you with an "open mind" all the time, to no avail. They are usually surprised when you 1) call them "partisan", when they're simply being "open minded", and then you 2) attack them personally. Oi vey! :lol:
 
Hey pal, get over yourself. Neither you nor your service “intimidates” anybody.

Then why the hell are you so intimidated? It's not like I'm a special forces war vet...calm the **** down man.

Oh, are you in the “service”? Ooooohhhh….. We better give your posts more credit then, or give you more leeway with your personal attacks,ehh? :roll:

See that's what I'm talkin about. Just take a second, breath, get something to drink, take a moment.





Feel better?
Good.

I was just relying the events. I got home, plugged back into the world, gave the first quick update I saw that wasn't all about "...blah blah blah policy blah blah blah school trip to see the oil..."

If “your scope” was “not limited”, and you are indeed informed of info that debunks your silly positions here, then it’s obvious your opinion is not to be given much credit. Don’t act like you don’t have a dog in this fight. Any excuse to attack Obama, or the left, works fine for you… even when your position is proven to be wrong or have holes in it.

The astute member will note that I haven't insulted President Obama since 02FEB10, and that's no matter of coincidence ;)

Bull****. It’s another excuse to attack Obama and try to make fun of people who care about our environment, as IF they are all leftees. :doh

Well ok you got me there, I do like making fun of alarmists.

Sure you are. You revel in riling up folks, who you wrongly assume are mostly on the left, who actually live down there and will be personally affected by it. Some of those people are even on your side of the political fence. THEY get it. This oil leak is not political. It is reality. But, to you, it is just another reason to make fun of something that you think will give you a free shot at Obama. Pathetic. There comes a time when the sword of politics should be laid down to fight a common enemy. You are a symbol of what’s wrong with politics these days.

.........:coffeepap.......


This has the potential to have a much bigger impact than the Valdez did, even if it doesn’t get bigger than it. And it’s obvious you don’t care about any of the implications of that.

Well, I already told you as much, soooooo.......

Except that, if the leak doesn’t get plugged, or controlled, then the leak will surpass the Exxon Valdez in about 52 days. The Valdez was a major disaster and it happened in an unpopulated area. This leak is in the #1 fishing area in the U.S. THAT would make it a pretty big ****ing deal.

Yeah now they have a pipe in it and beginning to siphon off the oil.

And now we know, from one of the survivors from the rig, that BP was the one responsible for breaking that BOP. And BP KNEW it was broke! It should be interesting to hear your retort to that. Somehow it's probably Obama's fault, I'm sure.

Holy ****!! A Leftie FINELY mentioned the survivors!! It's only been...what...nearly a month...are you sure you won't get in trouble? Better talk about the cute lil fluffy animals before Mikel Moore makes a documentary about you.

How so? At the time, those numbers were accepted by most people to be accurate.

Oh like post 82. Folks freaking out at the 5K mark.

Actually, it IS America’s fault. And it goes back to your heroes Bush and Cheeney. They started gutting the oil regs, allowing companies like BP to basically act in our waters like they do in other countries where there are no regs. True enough that our own MMS is to blame for this too. But, considering it’s full of Cheeney puppets it comes as no surprise how they’ve acted.

Nop, sorry, Obama owns everything after 6 months in office. He's the man at the top, he holds the office, he has the authoritah, he has the responsibility.

Alright, now to clean this up and work on responding to your technical interest.
 
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Technical information? Such as?

I loves me some science and problem solving. I love it. I like learning about how oil drilling works, the different classes of rigs, what a "BOP" is and the 2 different types....all that.

A mile down there's a big leak, equipment failed to automatically activate, then failed again to respond to manual activation. How the **** do you get this under control? Use a "dome"? WTF is a "dome"..makes Google search. It failed? Why? Methane hydrates? WTF is that......Google search. They're going to try a "top-hat", WTF is a "top-hat"....Google search.

I can't wait for the History Channel to make the Mega Disasters episode for the spill. I ****ing love that ****. Gimmy some History Channel, some Modern Marvels, some MythBusters...mmm delicious!!
 
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The truth is that you aren't open minded enough to tell the difference. People on here try to talk to you with an "open mind" all the time, to no avail. They are usually surprised when you 1) call them "partisan", when they're simply being "open minded", and then you 2) attack them personally. Oi vey! :lol:




Please by all means keep these jewels of ironic comedic brilliance coming. I'm rolling on the floor laughing at this.... :lamo
 
A show of hands: Who knows the difference between heavy crude and light-sweet crude?

Here's a hint: Valdez spilled one type, Deepwater spilled another.

Bonus question worth +1 internetz: Assuming identical weather conditions, volume of ocean water, tidal forces and geographical location, how does a spill of heavy crude impact the environment differently than an equal volume of light-sweet crude?


***
Here's a free-bi for my alarmist friends: Valdez did not spill it's entire contents. It only spilled 10.9Mil gallons of it's 53Mil gallon cargo.

If we're only going to discuss volume of oil spilled and not account for any other variable, the Valdez is small potatoes compared to other spills.

It was the location of the spill, not the volume of oil spilled, which created environmental problems.
 
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A show of hands: Who knows the difference between heavy crude and light-sweet crude?

Everyone does. So? This isn't light crude even though it has a low sulfer content. Are you still in denial and trying to trivialize this spill even though it will cause greater damage than the Exxon Valdez?

"The current spill "is kind of a worst-case scenario," Tunnell said.

What makes this spill relentless and most similar to Ixtoc 1 is that it's an active well that keeps flowing. The Exxon Valdez was a tanker with a limited supply of oil. The rig 40 miles from the Gulf Coast may leak for months before a relief well can be drilled to stop the flow, Kinner said.

And LSU's Overton said: "I'm not very optimistic that they'll be drilling a relief well in three months."

Type of oil also a problem
The type of oil involved is also a major problem. While most of the oil drilled off Louisiana is a lighter crude, this isn't. It's a heavier blend because it comes from deep under the ocean surface, Overton said.

"If I had to pick a bad oil, I'd put this right up there. The only thing that's not bad about this is that it doesn't have a lot of sulfur in it and the high sulfur really smells bad."

The first analysis of oil spill samples showed it contains asphalt-like substances that make a major sticky mess, he said. This is because the oil is older than most oil in the region and is very dense.

This oil also emulsifies well, Overton said. Emulsification is when oil and water mix thoroughly together, like a shampoo, which is mostly water, said Penn State engineering professor Anil Kulkarni.

It "makes a thick gooey chocolate mousse type of mix," Kulkarni said.

And once it becomes that kind of mix, it no longer evaporates as quickly as regular oil, doesn't rinse off as easily, can't be eaten by oil-munching microbes as easily, and doesn't burn as well, experts said.

That type of mixture essentially removes all the best oil clean-up weapons, Overton and others said.

Under better circumstances, with calmer winds and water, the oil might have a chance of rising without immediately emulsifying, but that's not happening here, Kulkarni said. It's pretty much mixed by the time it gets to the surface"


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36878803/ns/technology_and_science-science/
 
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