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Doctor tells Obama supporters: Go elsewhere for health care

Lord Tammerlain said:
Something is wrong with the list in your link

The high and the median income is the same, something that is not possible,

The median income is $145600 and the high income is $145600

Meaning your calculation would be wrong as well

It appears that that site does not calculate the high income if it is over 145600 and just defaults to that figure


Which means trying to calculate the mean from that site is impossible as it is not providing the information that would be required to do so
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I think the high was simply anything plus that. That's all I can figure out.
 
USA-1 said:
It's all relative. It is 4 times what the average person makes.
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No it is not all relative, when you consider that medical malpractice is about 40k+ a year. Of course, I wouldn't expect an anti-business bias to allow one to know how they actually work.
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
And conservatives are a hypocritical lot

Especially when rich people use their money for things they want to buy they call them elitist

Buying good food and the conservatives scream elitist

Getting an expensive hair cut, elitist

Buying an expensive foreign car elitist

The dont mind people having money, they just dont want people to use it for enjoyment
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that tends to come from rich liberals

rich republicans don't despise others from becoming rich

rich dems run on bashing the rich in order to become even richer through political power while doing everything possible to keep dem voters mired in poverty and dependence
 
USA-1 said:
It's all relative. It is 4 times what the average person makes.
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and doctors are far more than 4 times educated than the average person and certainly work much much harder.

People in the top 5% of the population ought to be making far more
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
Which does mean your mean o $85000 is most likely very wrong
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Let's not get ahead of ourselves. the skew is not going to be far past that, the high is probably just a very small sample group and couldn't be quantified, either that or the numbers may not be as stable, in other words the swing could be all over the map. But if those two factors are true then the mean would be extremely close to accurate if not dead bang on.
 
LaMidRighter said:
No it is not all relative, when you consider that medical malpractice is about 40k+ a year. Of course, I wouldn't expect an anti-business bias to allow one to know how they actually work.
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Well my health insurance costs 15K a year. Could it be the insurance companies are the problem?
Do you know why malpractice insurance is so high? It's to make up for lost revenue from investments.
http://makethemaccountable.com/myth/RisingCostOfMedicalMalpracticeInsurance.htm
Rising doctors' premiums not due to lawsuit awards - The Boston Globe
 
USA-1 said:
Well my health insurance costs 15K a year. Could it be the insurance companies are the problem?
Do you know why malpractice insurance is so high? It's to make up for lost revenue from investments.

Rising doctors' premiums not due to lawsuit awards - The Boston Globe
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You think it's going to get cheaper with this bill? If so you are fooling yourself, congratulations we just inherited every PEC in the country. YAY! Oh happy day!:roll: This is the point the doctor is trying to make, Obamacare screwed everyone.

EDIT-The BG is worthless for financial news, Wallstreet Report, MarketWatch, and the Wallstreet Journal would have been better.
 
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LaMidRighter said:
You think it's going to get cheaper with this bill? If so you are fooling yourself, congratulations we just inherited every PEC in the country. YAY! Oh happy day!:roll: This is the point the doctor is trying to make, Obamacare screwed everyone.
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No I don't. I don't know if this bill is going to do any good or not. I think it would have been nice if the republicans had made their changes when they had the chance and then the democrats wouldn't have felt the need to make such huge changes. Obamas plan become reality because the republicans did nothing.
It's too bad Nixon's healthcare plan wasn't enacted . By now we would know if it was a success or not.
I know you guys would rather nothing be done and let things get worse but the democrats saw the need for reform and acted on it.
 
USA-1 said:
No I don't. I don't know if this bill is going to do any good or not. I think it would have been nice if the republicans had made their changes when they had the chance and then the democrats wouldn't have felt the need to make such huge changes. Obamas plan become reality because the republicans did nothing.
It's too bad Nixon's healthcare plan wasn't enacted . By now we would know if it was a success or not.
I know you guys would rather nothing be done and let things get worse but the democrats saw the need for reform and acted on it.
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Ah, so this is one gigantic, "gubment good binnis bad" speech. Gotcha, you should have stopped when you admitted that you don't know whether this will work or not, it will not work, I am an insurance professional, the way it's written is horrid.
 
LaMidRighter said:
Ah, so this is one gigantic, "gubment good binnis bad" speech. Gotcha, you should have stopped when you admitted that you don't know whether this will work or not, it will not work, I am an insurance professional, the way it's written is horrid.
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Did you read it?
 
rathi said:
What a scumbug. He swore an oath, and yet he puts pathetic partisan politics above his profession. The only saving grace is that he is screwing himself by losing out on reasonable customers. He is more than welcome to bash Obama all he likes, but it is shameful to go so far.
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It is you and almost all Liberal that are all about Partisan Politics and can't stand the thought of anyone not liking the PHONY Obama I don't Really Care about Your Health Plan that is not about Health at all.

It's about destruction of the economy and control. Anyone who can't see it for what it is must have issues related to reading comprehension or worse.

The cost to everyone is going to skyrocket if not stopped.

Those who stand for nothing fall for anything, It's the Liberal way.
 
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LaMidRighter said:
Let's not get ahead of ourselves. the skew is not going to be far past that, the high is probably just a very small sample group and couldn't be quantified, either that or the numbers may not be as stable, in other words the swing could be all over the map. But if those two factors are true then the mean would be extremely close to accurate if not dead bang on.
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On the link you provided ANY income be it the low, median or high that would be above $145600 is defaulted back to $145600

The true median might be $200 000 and it will list $145600, the high might be $300 000 and it will default to $145600. Which means using any the lists that have the $145600 listed is going to provide inaccurate results

As the family and general Practition that you listed initially has the

$145600 for the median and the high, it is logical to assume the median is greater then the $145600 and the high is also higher then the $145600. Making the mean you calculated incorrect as you do not have the actual values to be able to calculate a mean
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
On the link you provided ANY income be it the low, median or high that would be above $145600 is defaulted back to $145600

The true median might be $200 000 and it will list $145600, the high might be $300 000 and it will default to $145600. Which means using any the lists that have the $145600 listed is going to provide inaccurate results

As the family and general Practition that you listed initially has the

$145600 for the median and the high, it is logical to assume the median is greater then the $145600 and the high is also higher then the $145600. Making the mean you calculated incorrect as you do not have the actual values to be able to calculate a mean
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I don't know how you are reading these numbers but that is not what I get from it at all. The overall point of this threa though is this bill was ****, this administration is ****, and this congress is **** in the doctors opinion, so he's letting those responsible know how he feels about getting screwed.
 
LaMidRighter said:
In progress right now. So far so bad.
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Can you point out some page numbers that are really bad? Seriously.
I have heard a lot of people say it is horrible but they can't tell me specifically what's so horrible about it.
 
LaMidRighter said:
I don't know how you are reading these numbers but that is not what I get from it at all. The overall point of this threa though is this bill was ****, this administration is ****, and this congress is **** in the doctors opinion, so he's letting those responsible know how he feels about getting screwed.
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Then you need help in understanding stats

Take a look at some other professions on that link. Notice that for some other medical careers the median is $145600 and the high is $145600.

Not one career listed has a median greater then $145600 or a high greater then $145600

If it listed the salaries of the NBA the low would be $145600, the median would be $145600, and the high would be $145600.

Any figure above $145600 is defaulted to that value.

It is not that complicated to understand
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
Something is wrong with the list in your link

The high and the median income is the same, something that is not possible,

The median income is $145600 and the high income is $145600

Meaning your calculation would be wrong as well

It appears that that site does not calculate the high income if it is over 145600 and just defaults to that figure


Which means trying to calculate the mean from that site is impossible as it is not providing the information that would be required to do so
Click to expand...

As you correctly noted, the "high" (which the site defines as the threshold for which 90% are earning below that figure) and "median" (where 50% earn above and 50% earn below the figure) cannot be the same.

In any case, the mean figure for family and general practioners was $161,490 in the latest Bureau of Labor Statistics data (page 12).
 
Politics101 said:
Doesn't it scare you a bit to think about what type of new mandates Obama and the Democrats might implement, in order to 'fix the glitch', so that doctors cannot turn people down? I think that's when Doctors will be told where to live, based on regional need for medical doctors... socialism is gonna be so much fun!!!
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I suspect what we will have is a system where the best and most qualified doctors work as private professionals for people with means, and the rest will work in the government system. The care WILL suffer...anyone that thinks it wont is simply blind, blissfully or intentionally ignorant, or maybe both.

I really wish people that advocate for the universal health care thats coming (and make no mistake-thats where this is headed) had the opportunity to live for few years in the medicare/medicaid system.

And of course this doesnt even begin to touch the deficit situation. California has massivie soicial spending and it has put their state into a 50 billion dollar hole. The bailouts for California have not come with an expectation that they fix the system so they can continue to be just as fiscally irresponsible as before. Massachusettes also requires huge federal bailouts for its healthcare system. Rather than learn from thos mistakes we are rushing headlong into a federal system. If Obama is right and Medicare gets abused to the tune of 80 billion a year, try to imagine what levels of fraud will hit when the government, the same clowns that have already spent us 13.5 trillion into debt, are in charge of ALL healthcare.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
Money is an incentive to do more and better, it has always been that way.
That is why some doctors work what I consider to be ridiculous hours, they want more money.
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That is not always the case. Some work ridiculous hours because they care about their patients and/or love their job. Money is not the primary factor.
 
LaMidRighter said:
You don't know much about medicine or commerce do you? I don't work my ass off for your sake or enjoyment, or even to be the best professional I can be, I do it for money. Doctor's quality goes up because there is money in being the best, and caring about their patients is also a close a factor, but if you think they'll do it at a loss you're kidding yourself.
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I disagree with you. I don't think anyone would necessarily do it at a loss, but you are talking about a profession of helpers. The mindset and personality of people who do this kind of work places the health and happiness in a very high regard. There are plenty of folks in this field, that I know of, who CHOSE to make less money than they could because of how much they care about their patients. Not everyone, of course, but a lot. For many, money is NOT the primary mover, and it is NOT the primary motivator for excellence. For some, there are other things more important.
 
TurtleDude said:
Lets examine your loaded terms and bias

1) "milked money from the system"

marxist speak for people who worked hard and worked smart

2) worry about doctors too much

No, I worry about freedom and our constitution too much
3) the "richest people in town"

the scummy attorneys who sue doctors make more

you seem to be one of those bitter cubicle bunnies who is mad at those who make more than you are. ITs a strange combination of populist nonsense and socialist nonsense.

But you prove my point

most of the support for the obamanonsense comes from those who want the legislation to Punish people
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project much
those "scummy" attorneys
earlier in this thread today you stated that you are an attorney:
TurtleDude said:
all law involves contract

I am a civil and constitutional rights trial attorney as well as handling employment discrimination and labor issues.

The "general welfare" and necessary and proper is not a specific delegation of power. If it were then congress could do anything it wanted and the tenth amendment would have no meaning because, by definition, congress will always "find" that its legislation is "necessary and proper" or "for the general welfare"

However, in the last 15 years the tenth amendment--totally ignored by the FDR administration to the point that even conservative jurists accepted its shunning as precedent--has become a bit more prominent as the USSC struck down parts of the Brady Bill in Prinz and in Lopez threw out a law that penalized having a gun within a certain distance of a school as violations of the tenth amendment.
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bet you are a joy to have within your bar

color me dubious
 
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