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Health Care Bill has passed

chosendudenyc said:
It’s inhumane to use racial epithets to anyone in America and un-American as well, to use this tool of hate against members of congress.
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It takes very little effort for crazed liberals to PLANT someone in the rally to yell those things. They did in the McCain crowds during the presidential campaign; why wouldn't they do it yesterday.

I love how CNN and MSNBC automatically assume it was a tea partier and immediately paint the whole conservative movement with the same brush.

Moveon.org and those types LOVE to pull these kinds of stunts.
 
LiveUninhibited said:
I wonder what proportion of them actually understand the bill.
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Sadly, Probably the same amount in congress who voted for this pig....



Wheel chair tax


Special quotas for minorities in med school





I have a small business, I don't supply health care. I pay them an allowance to go towards whatever they want, understanding, they get this extra bump in thier paychecks for them to get thier own health care. they all love it....


It will suck for them when it goes away and they have to take crappier health care AND less money. :shrug:
 
rivrrat said:
I seriously move around too much. But it looks like I'll be in this area for a couple of years, so it shouldn't be an issue for the next couple of elections.


I agree with you about the social conservatives. I really do. They disgust me. However, the things they would like try to shove through could be more easily repealed and far less expensive than what the libtards just did to the country. What they just did will take years to fix.
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I was moving between jobs for 10 years. IT industry. I have decided I am living here and I'll work what's available. I have much greater peace of mind.

I want a pro-business environment. I am all for new hire tax breaks, apprenticeships, school co-ops, tax breaks for installations, whatever it takes to bring business around.

I really am damned if I vote Democratic, who are not pro-business, and damned if I don't voting Republican because of social conservatives. Perhaps you are right that it is easy to overcome social conservative law, but that would require progressives get into power and pass their economic BS.

I hope that my party, the Whigs, gains ground since I am that balance. I think many independents are too.
 
This bill, while not perfect, is a good place to start. Unfortunately, due to the Party of No and a handful of bluedog Democrats, there were things that could have made this bill a lot better, that had to be left out.
However, this Country moves slowly and this is a good start. We need to have a good public option or even better a single payer system. But we'll take what we can get.
A good day for the people of America.
 
reefedjib said:
I was moving between jobs for 10 years. IT industry. I have decided I am living here and I'll work what's available. I have much greater peace of mind.

I want a pro-business environment. I am all for new hire tax breaks, apprenticeships, school co-ops, tax breaks for installations, whatever it takes to bring business around.

I really am damned if I vote Democratic, who are not pro-business, and damned if I don't voting Republican because of social conservatives. Perhaps you are right that it is easy to overcome social conservative law, but that would require progressives get into power and pass their economic BS.

I hope that my party, the Whigs, gains ground since I am that balance. I think many independents are too.
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Obviously, if I have a choice other than the social conservatives or the libtards, I will vote for that option. I would have loved if the Libertarian party had an *actual* libertarian running for office against Obama. I would have voted for them. But alas, they did not.

I feel your pain in not having a true representative to vote for.
 
Toothpicvic said:
Read up on James Madison's "Tyranny of the Majority" viewpoints?
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Agreed, majority rule can also be bad but that doesn't change the fact that this minority driven legislation isn't also bad.


I don't. If anyone has a problem with the bill, then they have themselves to thank for voting the congressional officials who voted in favor of it into office
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.

They were voted in to reduce healthcare costs and not necessarily to create UHC or NHC.

I never heard any alternative plans from the right, just cries of "socialism", "death panels", "statism", "elitism" etc etc etc. If there were any alternate proposals, then they got lost in between all of the fearmongering.
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TORT reform has been on the congressional agenda for some time now. The left has been blocking that presumeably from all the $$ the Dems get from lawyers. I think I heard Texas is having success with their state run TORT reform.
 
Eskimo said:
TORT reform has been on the congressional agenda for some time now. The left has been blocking that presumeably from all the $$ the Dems get from lawyers. I think I heard Texas is having success with their state run TORT reform.
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"Tort reform" amounts to less than 1% of the costs of healthcare. You can have all the reform you want and it isn't going to have any effect on healthcare costs. It is nothing more than a GOP strawman to make them look like they have an idea.
 
disneydude said:
"Tort reform" amounts to less than 1% of the costs of healthcare. You can have all the reform you want and it isn't going to have any effect on healthcare costs. It is nothing more than a GOP strawman to make them look like they have an idea.
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True, but it makes a good sound bite. And the fact that where tort reform has been passed, the results have mirrored that reality don't stop or hinder the good sound bite effect such language has. We live in a quick fix world, and all a conman has to do is repeat a sound bite long enough, and a good number of people will accept the lie.
 
disneydude said:
"Tort reform" amounts to less than 1% of the costs of healthcare. You can have all the reform you want and it isn't going to have any effect on healthcare costs. It is nothing more than a GOP strawman to make them look like they have an idea.
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Link? ....
 
disneydude said:
"Tort reform" amounts to less than 1% of the costs of healthcare. You can have all the reform you want and it isn't going to have any effect on healthcare costs. It is nothing more than a GOP strawman to make them look like they have an idea.
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LOL

Total BS.
 
disneydude said:
"Tort reform" amounts to less than 1% of the costs of healthcare. You can have all the reform you want and it isn't going to have any effect on healthcare costs. It is nothing more than a GOP strawman to make them look like they have an idea.
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And yet the CBO says tort reform would save $54 billion
 
rivrrat said:
And yet the CBO says tort reform would save $54 billion
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Which would actually be about 0.5 % of US health care spending. Link is earlier this thread.
 
Health care is what? 16% of the total US economy? You can do the math.;)
 
Boo Radley said:
We like the CBO now? :confused::doh;)
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I don't give a flying **** about the CBO. I'd just LOVE for some person who kept touting the CBO's accuracy come on and claim they're wrong when the CBO states numbers they don't agree with.
 
rivrrat said:
I don't give a flying **** about the CBO. I'd just LOVE for some person who kept touting the CBO's accuracy come on and claim they're wrong when the CBO states numbers they don't agree with.
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Nope. You have it wrong. I don't recall arguing 100% accuracy, but that their numbers are accepted. Like I said before, my weather man is often inaccurate, but he gives me the best prediction of the weather coming. Beats just guessing or talking ****. ;)
 
rivrrat said:
However, the things they would like try to shove through could be more easily repealed and far less expensive than what the libtards just did to the country. What they just did will take years to fix.
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It will never really be fixed. The "fix" will mostly consist of printing more money.
 
Reverend_Hellh0und said:
I saw that. it was opinion, not raw data. :srhug:
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I suppose if you consider math to be opinion, then yes it is. If you figure that with 54 billion savings, and the total health care cost, you can figure the percentages, then not so much opinion.
 
Redress said:
I suppose if you consider math to be opinion, then yes it is. If you figure that with 54 billion savings, and the total health care cost, you can figure the percentages, then not so much opinion.
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The study is based on a survey – believed to be the first of its kind – that was completed by more than 900 physicians in Massachusetts. It asked about their use of seven tests and procedures: plain film X-rays, CT scans, magnetic resonance imaging, ultrasounds, laboratory testing, specialty referrals and consultations, and hospital admissions.

About 83 percent reported practicing defensive medicine, with an average of between 18 percent and 28 percent of tests, procedures, referrals, and consultations and 13 percent of hospitalizations ordered for defensive reasons.

Such practices were estimated to cost a minimum of $1.4 billion per year in Massachusetts.
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UConn Advance - February 23, 2009 - Study shows defensive medicine widespread

Since Massachusetts has about 2% of the US population, total spent on defensive medicine to combat malpractice suits in the entire country would be well over 54 billion dollars. This study does not count the cost of malpractice insurance, lawyer's fees, court costs, etc.
 
Redress said:
I suppose if you consider math to be opinion, then yes it is. If you figure that with 54 billion savings, and the total health care cost, you can figure the percentages, then not so much opinion.
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See Gill's reply
 
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