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Obama to call for 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' repeal, adviser says

texmaster said:
Where did he say that?

Silence or I'll send my nephew's scout troop up there and take over your country.
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We already tried that in 1812. We failed.
 
soccerboy22 said:
Actually I think the moose would handle a boy scout group.
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Your ignorance of what Canadian armed forces are actually like is really unimpressive. Tell me, do you think they wear beaver hats in Afghanistan? I bet you've never even met a Canadian. Do you think they're like the French? Wait, don't answer that "soccerboy22". I bet you think they went over there with coats. Eh?
 
I love to see people totally misread a straightforward comment.
 
Hatuey said:
Your ignorance of what Canadian armed forces are actually like is really unimpressive. Tell me, do you think they wear beaver hats in Afghanistan? I bet you've never even met a Canadian. Do you think they're like the French? Wait, don't answer that "soccerboy22". I bet you think they went over there with coats. Eh?
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Actually my godparents are Canadian and I have been there many times. It was more of a joke. I will admit that I am not as familiar with the Canadian Armed forces and I am the the U.S., but I do know they are no joking matter. As a matter of fact when I was in Halifax two summer ago I had the pleasure of meeting some Canadian soldiers and I have nothing, but the highest respect for them.
 
Winnb said:
I don't know about all of that. I think Don't ask don't tell is a stupid policy.
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Yea, what does Colin Powell know about military policy?

Obama should just get rid of it. Once it's gone it's unlikely another President would bring it back.
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Maybe we should conduct a thorough analysis before we make radical alterations to our military. Just a thought...
 
braindrain said:
The biggest problem I have with this is that it will add up to a bunch more equal oppertunity and anti harrassment briefs that I have to go to instead of being out training. Anyone who has been in the Army in the last 15 years knows exactly what I am talking about. Civilians would never belive how much time is wasted in the Army doing this crap.
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It's just as bad in the Marines. I can't believe how many different "briefs" I had to sit through...
 
Ethereal said:
Yea, what does Colin Powell know about military policy?
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I wonder what some other military experts say on this. You know about the Rand Corp study for the Pentagon which stated that it DADT could be eliminated with no problems, as you and I have discussed that, so we will skip it, even though it is the most authoritative look at the subject. Lets go to Gen. John Shalikashvili, former chairman of the JCS:http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/02/opinion/02shalikashvili.html?_r=1

When I was chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, I supported the current policy because I believed that implementing a change in the rules at that time would have been too burdensome for our troops and commanders...

I now believe that if gay men and lesbians served openly in the United States military, they would not undermine the efficacy of the armed forces. Our military has been stretched thin by our deployments in the Middle East, and we must welcome the service of any American who is willing and able to do the job.
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Then we find out that there are alot more military "brass" in favor of it's repeal 104 retired military brass against 'don't ask-don't tell' - CNN.com

More than 100 retired U.S. military leaders -- including the former head of the Naval Academy -- have signed a statement calling for an end to the military's "don't ask-don't tell" policy, according to a California-based think tank that supports the movement.
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Then there is the famous Zogby poll of servicemembers who served in Iraq and/or Afghanistan: Zogby International

. According to the new Zogby data, however, nearly three in four troops (73%) say they are personally comfortable in the presence of gays and lesbians. Of the 20% who said they are uncomfortable around gays and lesbians, only 5% are "very" uncomfortable, while 15% are "somewhat" uncomfortable. Just two percent of troops said knowing that gays are not allowed to serve openly was an important reason in their decision to join the military.
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I have a world of respect for Colin Powell, but that does not mean I think he is always right, and in this case, I think he is dead wrong. I have not seen any evidence that repeal of DADT and allowing gays to serve in the military will lead to any problems. Further, as we already know, gays are in the military, and lets go back to that Zogby poll one more time:

Of those in combat units, 21% said they know for certain that someone in their unit is gay or lesbian, slightly less than for those in combat support units (25%) and combat service support units (22%). One in five troops (20%) in other units said they know for certain someone is gay or lesbian in their unit. Overall, nearly half (45%) say there are people in their unit they suspect are gay or lesbian, but they don't know for sure.
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Get that? Almost half already know some one they think is gay, and yet we still have the most effective military in the world, and all the morale and discipline problems that some predict just are not there.
 
Ethereal said:
Yea, what does Colin Powell know about military policy?



Maybe we should conduct a thorough analysis before we make radical alterations to our military. Just a thought...
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It's a silly, childish policy. If our military is so terrified of gay people openly serving (and they're already serving from the closet) then maybe we need stronger people in our military.

And if it weren't for our military ending segregation, another policy that people were terrified of ending, Colin Powell would have never reached the rank of General. He would have been a cook or a Supply Officer somewhere back behind the lines.
 
AgentM said:
Bush had better policy? "9/11, ****. Wait, now we can go into Iraq, we've got a totally awesome plan for how to deal with it! It's going to be great!" :roll:
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And Obama has a better plan?
 
Hatuey said:
Your ignorance of what Canadian armed forces are actually like is really unimpressive. Tell me, do you think they wear beaver hats in Afghanistan? I bet you've never even met a Canadian. Do you think they're like the French? Wait, don't answer that "soccerboy22". I bet you think they went over there with coats. Eh?
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Who cares what the Canadians wear? I live in America. Obama is the American President. He is the Chief Executive of America, not Canada.
 
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braindrain said:
The biggest problem I have with this is that it will add up to a bunch more equal oppertunity and anti harrassment briefs that I have to go to instead of being out training. Anyone who has been in the Army in the last 15 years knows exactly what I am talking about. Civilians would never belive how much time is wasted in the Army doing this crap.
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I've said that all along.

Have you given any thought to what you're going to do when soldiers demand seperate billets because they don't want to bunk with soldiers of a different sexual preference?

This isn't going to be anything other than a giant cluster ****.
 
Winnb said:
Yeah I think I agree. If the President REALLY wants to get rid of this policy he should just do it. He has the power and authority. No excuses, no waiting game, no blame game. Just do it.
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PBO hasn't done it, because he doesn't actually have the authority. If he did, there's no doubt in my mind that he would have already. I think he's afraid to tell his base that he just can't do it.
 
apdst said:
PBO hasn't done it, because he doesn't actually have the authority. If he did, there's no doubt in my mind that he would have already. I think he's afraid to tell his base that he just can't do it.
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He has the authority to right today stop any further discharges from DADT. In fact, the information on this is in this very thread.
 
apdst said:
I've said that all along.

Have you given any thought to what you're going to do when soldiers demand seperate billets because they don't want to bunk with soldiers of a different sexual preference?

This isn't going to be anything other than a giant cluster ****.
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Thats what officers are for. To tell them no.
 
megaprogman said:
Thats what officers are for. To tell them no.
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Actually, the numbers are here in this thread, and show already that this is not an issue. Officers are not needing to tell then no, it's just not neccessy.
 
Redress said:
He has the authority to right today stop any further discharges from DADT. In fact, the information on this is in this very thread.
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No, he doesn't. To do so, he would have to change the UCMJ and he doesn't have the authority to change a law with an executive order. Welcome to the real world.


You were in the Navy, you should know what the UCMJ says and I'm sure you can understand why PBO doesn't have the wuthority to change it, nor order certain parts to be ignored.
 
apdst said:
No, he doesn't. To do so, he would have to change the UCMJ and he doesn't have the authority to change a law with an executive order. Welcome to the real world.


You were in the Navy, you should know what the UCMJ says and I'm sure you can understand why PBO doesn't have the wuthority to change it, nor order certain parts to be ignored.
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Please read the thread, and the linked sources, then get back to me with your own evidence to back your claims.
 
"Don't ask, don't tell", was a smart way to deal with the gay problem, I see no reason to change that policy......;)
 
Redress said:
Please read the thread, and the linked sources, then get back to me with your own evidence to back your claims.
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Here's the only thing you need to know.

Article 125 - Sodomy

“(a) Any person subject to this chapter who engages in unnatural carnal copulation with another person of the same or opposite sex or with an animal is guilty of sodomy. Penetration, however slight, is sufficient
to complete the offense.

(b) Any person found guilty of sodomy shall by punished as a court-martial may direct.”
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Sodomy is a crime in the military, according to the UCMJ. The president doesn't have the authroity to order military officers to ignore the articles of the UCMJ. You should know this what with your service.

You spoke in another post of, "regulations", prohibiting gays from serving in the military. It's not DoD regulations that prevent it, it's the UCMJ that prevents it.

PBO can't change this law, just like he couldn't change the law making murder illegal. If he could, he would have already done it.
 
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