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Bernard Madoff beat up in USA Prison

apdst said:
The tougher we make it prison, the less people will won't to go and they will think twice before breaking the law.

That doesn't seem to be working at all.

apdst said:
personally, I think prison isn't hard enough. I think we need to create an even more dangerous and scary environment that there already is.

Don't like it? Don't break the law. It's that simple.

Psychology has been discovering that punitive treatments like abusing people and the like don't do much to stop someone from doing bad things long term.

I used to believe the same as you but changed my stance when i read about this, you have two choices kill them or rehabilitate them with positive reinforcement and of things like token economies.
 
That doesn't seem to be working at all.

That's because prisons aren't being made harder, they're being made easier.



Psychology has been discovering that punitive treatments like abusing people and the like don't do much to stop someone from doing bad things long term.

100 years ago, people didn't commit crimes like they do now. One reason, was that they were afraid of going to prison. Fewer people are actually afraid to go to prison.

I used to believe the same as you but changed my stance when i read about this, you have two choices kill them or rehabilitate them with positive reinforcement and of things like token economies.


How long have we been attempting to, "rehabilitate", convicts in this country and what's the success rate?

For alot of criminals and would be criminals, serving in prison is a right of passage, a badge of honor, romantic even. Of more prisoners were killed, mamed, or came home slobbering in their plate at the dinner table, much of the romance of going to prison would go away.
 
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That's because prisons aren't being made harder, they're being made easier.

There has been no real change either way.




100 years ago, people didn't commit crimes like they do now. One reason, was that they were afraid of going to prison. Fewer people are actually afraid to go to prison.

Sure they did, it's not like bad people just came about at the turn of the century.



How long have we been attempting to, "rehabilitate", convicts in this country and what's the success rate?

For alot of criminals and would be criminals, serving in prison is a right of passage, a badge of honor, romantic even. Of more prisoners were killed, mamed, or came home slobbering in their plate at the dinner table, much of the romance of going to prison would go away.

Practically never.

That's why I said either kill them or rehabilitate them but don't use negative reinforcement, it doesn't work.
 
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Wait till they play the soap dish game with him in the shower.---He has much to consider.:mrgreen:
 
There has been no real change either way.

That's not true. It's illegal for a gaurd to kick the **** out of a prisoner, now. 40 years ago a gaurd could turn a prisoner into a vegitable and no one cared. Prisoners have rights now. Remember Attica?






Sure they did, it's not like bad people just came about at the turn of the century.

The crime rate 100 years ago was lower than it is now. IMO, part of the reason for that, was that people were more afraid to go to prison than they are now.





Practically never.


Pratically never rehabilitate them, or never succeed?
 
100 years ago, people didn't commit crimes like they do now. One reason, was that they were afraid of going to prison. Fewer people are actually afraid to go to prison.

100 years ago people were not being tossed into prison things like pot heroin cocain etc.
 
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Who cares if he's an evil piece of ****?

He's still a human being and deserves to be treated like one.

Agreed.

But on my things to do list, making sure BM is treated like a human being is way the **** down on the lowest end. :mrgreen:
 
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That's not true. It's illegal for a gaurd to kick the **** out of a prisoner, now. 40 years ago a gaurd could turn a prisoner into a vegitable and no one cared. Prisoners have rights now. Remember Attica?

Does every criminal deserve to be kicked the **** out of?
Do you not see how this can be applied unevenly?

The crime rate 100 years ago was lower than it is now. IMO, part of the reason for that, was that people were more afraid to go to prison than they are now.

When you make more things illegal the crime rate is bound to go up.





Pratically never rehabilitate them, or never succeed?

They don't do anything to rehabilitate them.
Isolating someone is not rehabilitation, changing behavior is.
 
And, that's because of the decisions they made.

Not always. Some people really can't being not poor. But I don't expect a "very conservative" person to understand.

Back on topic: Bernard Madoff wasn't beaten up so I am guessing the title of the thread should change?:2wave:
 
100 years ago, people didn't commit crimes like they do now. One reason, was that they were afraid of going to prison. Fewer people are actually afraid to go to prison.
No they weren't afraid of going into prison. People did commit the crimes that happened now and actually violent crimes were actually much more popular back then. Think about it. The police didn't have the methods to successfully find a criminal so if the chance of you getting away with murder now is over 90%, the chance of you getting away with murder back then is over 99%.

How long have we been attempting to, "rehabilitate", convicts in this country and what's the success rate?

For alot of criminals and would be criminals, serving in prison is a right of passage, a badge of honor, romantic even. Of more prisoners were killed, mamed, or came home slobbering in their plate at the dinner table, much of the romance of going to prison would go away.

I agree, prison isn't working for rehabilitating most criminals. It is why the death penalty should be much more common.
 
They don't do anything to rehabilitate them.
Isolating someone is not rehabilitation, changing behavior is.

You can't change those type of people. They are indoctrinated to their personal belief system and its a shame because it is to do harm to you. That's why there is prison, those that are in deserve to be in there, and there are many still out who belong in prison too.
 
You can't change those type of people. They are indoctrinated to their personal belief system and its a shame because it is to do harm to you. That's why there is prison, those that are in deserve to be in there, and there are many still out who belong in prison too.

Then they should be killed, isolation and physical abuse does not rehabilitate people.

Releasing felons with no life or job skills with a scarlet letter, guarantees that they will commit crimes again.
 
That's not true. It's illegal for a gaurd to kick the **** out of a prisoner, now. 40 years ago a gaurd could turn a prisoner into a vegitable and no one cared. Prisoners have rights now. Remember Attica?

Prisoners getting beat up in jail was not was Attica was about. It was about people being treated like animals. Forcing them to live in the most disgusting of conditions, wanton racism in the correctional system, removal of basic civil rights(free practice of religion Al Jundi v. Masundi). No. You're wrong. Jail is supposed to encourage people to not commit crimes. Creating horrible conditions to live in does not do that.

Incarceration_rates_worldwide.gif


Canada's entire criminal rate and jail rate is MUCH lower than that of the U.S. and somehow their recidivism is also lower. This is because the entire focus of their correctional facilities has been shifted from simply punishing people to rehabilitating them. Trust me on this one. Making jail harder for criminals only makes better criminals.
 
***** For what it's worth here - probably 20% of the people locked up in Federal & State Prisons are a Physical threat to no one. They are Petty Thieves, Substance abusers & Mental defectives. This ratio will stand if not increase in future years unless like California Bankruptcy is coming soon.
 
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Laissez-faire depends on people who wantonly disregard the law? What a strange idea you have there...

Laissez-faire depends on, as you put it, the most self-centered people, who wouldn't lift a finger to help anyone but themselves.
 
Laissez-faire depends on, as you put it, the most self-centered people, who wouldn't lift a finger to help anyone but themselves.

It also depends on the rule of law.
 
100 years ago people were not being tossed into prison things like pot heroin cocain etc.

Cocaine was made illegal in 1914. Do, nearly 100 years ago, the crime rate was lower than it is now. IMO, it's because people were afraid of going to prison, because prison was a very dangerous and scary place. That fear doesn't exist any longer, or at least not to the same extent. It needs to return.


Does every criminal deserve to be kicked the **** out of?
Do you not see how this can be applied unevenly?

Prison isn't about bing treated fairly. If a person doesn't like it, he should avoid being sent to prison. How hard is that?



When you make more things illegal the crime rate is bound to go up.

I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I believe there are fewer prisonable (is that a word? Who care?) offenses then than there are now. It's safe to say that, just because there are no more Jim Crow laws that imprison blacks for standing on the wrong side of the street.

As I pointed out, cocaine has been illega for nearly 100 years. Illegal liquir took the place of illegal drugs back then. The opposite is true now. And before you say it, liquir wasn't illegal in 1914.


Not always. Some people really can't being not poor. But I don't expect a "very conservative" person to understand.

Back on topic: Bernard Madoff wasn't beaten up so I am guessing the title of the thread should change?:2wave:

99% of the time, people's station in life is bcause of their own concious decisions. I have 9 brothers and sisters. My dad was an mechanic and my mom was a secretary. Save the po' man's hero crap.




Prisoners getting beat up in jail was not was Attica was about. It was about people being treated like animals. Forcing them to live in the most disgusting of conditions, wanton racism in the correctional system, removal of basic civil rights(free practice of religion Al Jundi v. Masundi). No. You're wrong. Jail is supposed to encourage people to not commit crimes. Creating horrible conditions to live in does not do that.

If they didn't like it, they should have worked harder to stay out of prison. There are concequences to our actions. You break the law, you go to prison and prison sucks. Fear encourages people to do amazing things. Making prison a tea party isn't going to encourage people to stay out of prison.
 
Incarceration_rates_worldwide.gif


Canada's entire criminal rate and jail rate is MUCH lower than that of the U.S. and somehow their recidivism is also lower. This is because the entire focus of their correctional facilities has been shifted from simply punishing people to rehabilitating them. Trust me on this one. Making jail harder for criminals only makes better criminals.


You're talking about two totally demographics. You're comparing apples to oranges.
 
99% of the time, people's station in life is bcause of their own concious decisions. I have 9 brothers and sisters. My dad was an mechanic and my mom was a secretary. Save the po' man's hero crap.

Well they would have ended up doing a perfect job if you weren't conservative. :lol:
 
You just couldn't resist taking a personal shot, could you? Typical Libbo. I reported it, but i doubt anything will be done. Oh, well.

Im not even a libbo, by the way does libbo stand for the labia of a women's *****? Because I am CERTAINLY NOT THAT though I often have dreams of being down there.:lol:
 
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***** A little Basic Christianity may be in order here OR I presume that most have never been locked up even briefly (?) Think about it.
Why do you think compassion should be showed to Madoff?
 
Your comment, along with the comments of others, is obviously intended to make the victims in this case look like the bad guys. I dont know if it's because you hate people with money, or what.

Um, no, my comment was obviously intended to bring a whiff of reality back to the discussion. That you didn't see it that way speaks ill of you, not me.

I doubt seriously that there are very many prison populations that aren't made up of a majority of animals.

Okay, so you either don't know much about the prison system, or you don't know much about prisoners. Fair enough.
 
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