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'Five taken hostage' in post office in Virginia, US

I am not sure they are any stranger than any other folk. They do tend to have more access to firearms though.
 
Crime happens everywhere. I just hope that this can be resolved without getting anyone killed.
 
ukangel said:
I am not sure they are any stranger than any other folk. They do tend to have more access to firearms though.
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Would that make your avatar an American, then?
 
Gardener said:
Would that make your avatar an American, then?
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Ukranian I think. The point I am trying to make here is that if your unbalanced you can do considerably more damage with a gun than you can with a knife or for that matter a spoon.
 
ukangel said:
Ukranian I think. The point I am trying to make here is that if your unbalanced you can do considerably more damage with a gun than you can with a knife or for that matter a spoon.
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That's debatable.
 
apdst said:
That's debatable.
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Its debateable that you cant do more damage with a gun than a knife. Imagine if the Columbine murderers had knives not guns might the result have been less bloodshed ?
 
ukangel said:
Its debateable that you cant do more damage with a gun than a knife. Imagine if the Columbine murderers had knives not guns might the result have been less bloodshed ?
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There may have been more bloodshed had they knives vice guns. At least the gun shots gave some kind of warning throughout the building. With a knife attack, no one would have known anything till it was too late.

IMO, the only difference between a knife and a gun, is skill level. Guns require less skill. A well trained knifesman could probably do more damage in as much time as Average Joe with a gun.
 
apdst said:
There may have been more bloodshed had they knives vice guns. At least the gun shots gave some kind of warning throughout the building. With a knife attack, no one would have known anything till it was too late.

IMO, the only difference between a knife and a gun, is skill level. Guns require less skill. A well trained knifesman could probably do more damage in as much time as Average Joe with a gun.
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And an expert shooter can do more harm to a crowd with a gun then a knifesman with a knife. When all skill level is equal a gun is just a more powerful weapon. This is why we see soldiers fighting with guns and not swords.

Of course that isn't a reason for people to not be able to carry guns. You could also make the argument that if half the people in that post office were carrying a gun the hostage situation would most likely have ended quickly (though most likely violently).

In a world where majority of people carry guns there will be more gun deaths in violent situations though I would assume less violent situations overall would occur.
 
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Gibberish said:
And an expert shooter can do more harm to a crowd with a gun then a knifesman with a knife. When all skill level is equal a gun is just a more powerful weapon. This is why we see soldiers fighting with guns and not swords.

Of course that isn't a reason for people to not be able to carry guns. You could also make the argument that if half the people in that post office were carrying a gun the hostage situation would most likely have ended quickly (though most likely violently).

In a world where majority of people carry guns there will be more gun deaths in violent situations though I would assume less violent situations overall would occur.
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And, everyone for hundreds of yards around is going to know that someone is shooting a gun, giving them plenty of warning so as to take cover, so there is no stealth. It's six of one and a half dozen of the other.

This is why we see soldiers fighting with guns and not swords.
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It takes less skill and training time to make a good rifleman than it does to make a good swordsman.
 
apdst said:
There may have been more bloodshed had they knives vice guns. At least the gun shots gave some kind of warning throughout the building. With a knife attack, no one would have known anything till it was too late.

IMO, the only difference between a knife and a gun, is skill level. Guns require less skill. A well trained knifesman could probably do more damage in as much time as Average Joe with a gun.
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This may be the stupidest thing I have ever read. I support gun rights, but I do not try to lie and misrepresent facts to support my opinion. Guns are exponentially more potent at killing people than knives. If a person comes into a classroom of 25 people with a knife, I guarantee that the combination of those people in the classroom will take them down. Knives are not even close to being as deadly as guns, any argument to the contrary is just stupid.
 
apdst said:
And, everyone for hundreds of yards around is going to know that someone is shooting a gun, giving them plenty of warning so as to take cover, so there is no stealth. It's six of one and a half dozen of the other.
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You don't need stealth with a gun. You point and shoot and can take out a number of people before anyone knows what going on and then have the ability to kill anyone in eye sight, no matter the distance and in some cases the barriers between.

It requires more skill and cunning for the knifeman's part to just do a percentage of the same damage a gunman can do.


apdst said:
It takes less skill and training time to make a good rifleman than it does to make a good swordsman.
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Of course. A good swordsman is also only effective in a limited amount of scenarios. Close combat and highly dense structural areas mostly.
 
Frodly said:
This may be the stupidest thing I have ever read. I support gun rights, but I do not try to lie and misrepresent facts to support my opinion. Guns are exponentially more potent at killing people than knives. If a person comes into a classroom of 25 people with a knife, I guarantee that the combination of those people in the classroom will take them down. Knives are not even close to being as deadly as guns, any argument to the contrary is just stupid.
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I believe I've already said it's my opinion and that it's depndent on the situation and I enver claimed that knives were more lethal than a firearm. I left room for doubt, both ways, so before you go off the deep end, try reading and comprehending what I wrote.

If a person comes into a classroom of 25 people with a knife, I guarantee that the combination of those people in the classroom will take them down.
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People aren't anymore willing to run into a knife than they are a firearm, so you can't guarantee that that would happen. You surely can't guarantee that they would take down the knifesman before he knifed 12 of those people.
 
Gibberish said:
You don't need stealth with a gun. You point and shoot and can take out a number of people before anyone knows what going on and then have the ability to kill anyone in eye sight, no matter the distance and in some cases the barriers between.
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Well, you don't exactly point and shoot. Ole boy at Ft. Hood fired a hundred rounds and only scored 13 kills.

It requires more skill and cunning for the knifeman's part to just do a percentage of the same damage a gunman can do.
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That's what I've already pointed out. The biggest difference between a gun and a knife is the skill level needed to do the same amount of damage.


To say that there's no way that a person skilled in knife fighting can't do as much damage as a gunman is erroneous.
 
apdst, please do gun rights advocates a favor and don't help us. It's embarrassing and sad how bad you are making us look right now.
 
Redress said:
apdst, please do gun rights advocates a favor and don't help us. It's embarrassing and sad how bad you are making us look right now.
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What were you saying in another thread about insults? Hmmm?
 
apdst said:
People aren't anymore willing to run into a knife than they are a firearm
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There are.....2 dozen knives in my kitchen. One gun in the basement. Yeah. No I think you're WAY more likely to run into a knife than you are to run into a gun.
 
Alfons said:
Look in Russia, such crimes are beeing happend everywhere on daily basis and full normal for natives.
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The more that the Moskaliiy kill themselves off the better the world will be for it. But then of course I am prejudice, and good at it !!
 
rathi said:
Crime happens everywhere. I just hope that this can be resolved without getting anyone killed.
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Look at the positive side of this the gentleman that is alleged to be holding the hostages is a disabled man therefore he is excersizing an equal opportunity for cripples to be criminals also. That just shows you that we are indeed the land of opportunity - cripples have rights and asperations also. lol :lol:
 
apdst said:
Well, you don't exactly point and shoot. Ole boy at Ft. Hood fired a hundred rounds and only scored 13 kills.
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Imagine how many he would have killed if he just had a knife.


apdst said:
To say that there's no way that a person skilled in knife fighting can't do as much damage as a gunman is erroneous.
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A skilled knifesman cannot do as much damage as a skilled gunsman in the same scenario (place and allotted time). The knifeman requires either close combat or to be carrying a few dozen knives.

A person can empty a clip faster and more accurately then a knifeman can throw the same amount of knives.
 
Gibberish said:
Imagine how many he would have killed if he just had a knife.
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Perhaps as many. Maybe more. Gunshot wounds aren't as likely to infect as knife wounds are.



A skilled knifesman cannot do as much damage as a skilled gunsman in the same scenario (place and allotted time). The knifeman requires either close combat or to be carrying a few dozen knives.
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I'll say again, it depends on the scenario. My original point, was that a gun isn't always more lethal than a knife.

In a scenario, such as a buncha school kids who have never had an ounce of traning in how to defend against such an attack and are paralyzed with fear, a knife attack...IMO...could possibly yield more casualties, plus follow on deaths from infection.

From my experience and in my opinion, I would be more afeared of a knifesman than a gun man. That's just me, your mileage may vary.
 
apdst said:
Perhaps as many. Maybe more. Gunshot wounds aren't as likely to infect as knife wounds are.
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You are aware of the amazing modern medical advancement known as antibiotics correct?


Are you seriously of the belief that if you were in an confined space with a dozen or more people, and some one came in stabbing people, that you would not attempt to fight back? Of course you would, and since a knife is a close range weapon, a group of people would almost certainly be successful in fighting the person off.
 
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