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Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

Phoenix

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WASHINGTON, Dec. 19 (UPI) -- U.S. Sen. Ben Nelson, D-Neb., the lone Democratic senator holding out against a healthcare reform compromise, said Saturday he now backs the measure.

Asked by The Washington Post if he was prepared to support a final version of the bill unveiled by Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada, Nelson said, "Yeah."

"We're there," Sen. Kent Conrad. D-N.D., told the newspaper Saturday as he headed into a special meeting to announce the deal, which, with Nelson now on board, would clear the way for its final passage by Christmas, the newspaper said.

Higher Insurance Premiums for all!!!!
and to all a good ****ing!!!
Merry Christmas!!!
 
“Today is a major step forward for the American people. After a nearly century-long struggle we are on the cusp of making healthcare reform a reality in the United States of America.” — President Barack Obama¹

Huzzah!
 
Higher Insurance Premiums for all!!!!
and to all a good ****ing!!!
Merry Christmas!!!

Proof please? And please no unsubstantiated claims by the insurance companies. :lol:
 
“Today is a major step forward for the American people. After a nearly century-long struggle we are on the cusp of making healthcare reform a reality in the United States of America.” — President Barack Obama¹

Huzzah!

If Obama's leftist healthcare reform was something that the American people really wanted all these years, there wouldn't have ever been any considerable "struggle" to pass it.

The "struggle" has always been to cloak the desires of the power-mad central-planners as being something for the good of the people.
 
The Democrats have embraced “big tent” politics, so major initiatives are often quite challenging when not a single vote can be spared. At the end of the day (year?) progress has been achieved and we should be grateful for that.
 
If Obama's leftist healthcare reform was something that the American people really wanted all these years, there wouldn't have ever been any considerable "struggle" to pass it.

Wrong Bucko. Lots of special interest groups that have profits to lose from reform has a lot to do with the opposition. They have the funding and backing (congress critters getting money) for lots of misinformation which gets desseminated to the public, which some sadly are very easy to confuse due to laziness, partisanship, and just plain uninformed.

The "struggle" has always been to cloak the desires of the power-mad central-planners as being something for the good of the people.

What a panty load. :lol:
 
The Democrats have embraced “big tent” politics, so major initiatives are often quite challenging when not a single vote can be spared. At the end of the day (year?) progress has been achieved and we should be grateful for that.

So true Chappy. And great changes in this country have never been popular to all like freeing slaves, civil rights, desegregation, the list goes on and on. Usually the right thing is not easy either.
 
Proof please? And please no unsubstantiated claims by the insurance companies. :lol:

It's hard to provide since no one has seen the actual bill except Harry Reid and Co.
However from what I can see they don't have a public option, don't have a Medicare option and they are removing all the cost controls from the insurance companies. Things like they must cover preexisting conditions, no lifetime limits, and no (additional) cost to the insured preventative medicine. I don't see any other options for the Insurance companies except to raise rates to cover the additional expenses.
 
It's hard to provide since no one has seen the actual bill except Harry Reid and Co.

So you are just speculating then when you said, "Higher Insurance Premiums for all!!!!" ?:mrgreen:
 
Wrong Bucko. Lots of special interest groups that have profits to lose from reform has a lot to do with the opposition.

How dare you slander the American people, who came out in droves in opposition to this agenda, in such a way?

Is everybody who doesn't ape the Statist agenda a lackey for the insurance lobby now?

They have the funding and backing (congress critters getting money) for lots of misinformation which gets desseminated to the public, which some sadly are very easy to confuse due to laziness, partisanship, and just plain uninformed.

Like what?

My Senator - Bob Casey stated that he would vote for this reform-bill regardless of what was in it.

Wouldn't this bill have seen the light of day by now if the objective wasn't to confuse or mislead the public?



What a panty load. :lol:

It's right on the money, you bought it & are a clear & present threat to liberty
 
“If we don't do this, nobody argues with the fact that health care costs are going to consume the entire federal budget.” — President Barack Obama¹

“If we don't pass it, here's the guarantee: Your premiums will go up, your employers are going to load up more costs on you ... Potentially they're going to drop your coverage, because they just can't afford an increase of 25 percent, 30 percent in terms of the costs of providing health care to employees each and every year.” — President Barack Obama²

The clear and present danger to liberty is the status quo.
 
“If we don't do this, nobody argues with the fact that health care costs are going to consume the entire federal budget.” — President Barack Obama¹

“If we don't pass it, here's the guarantee: Your premiums will go up, your employers are going to load up more costs on you ... Potentially they're going to drop your coverage, because they just can't afford an increase of 25 percent, 30 percent in terms of the costs of providing health care to employees each and every year.” — President Barack Obama²

The clear and present danger to liberty is the status quo.

The claim that opposition to the Statists' healthcare objectives denotes a desire to maintain the status quo is a demonstrable straw-man.
 
So true Chappy. And great changes in this country have never been popular to all like freeing slaves, civil rights, desegregation, the list goes on and on. Usually the right thing is not easy either.

What a strawman.
Freeing slaves and civil rights are about honoring a person right to their labor.
This health care is about taking away people's right to their labor.
 
“If we don't do this, nobody argues with the fact that health care costs are going to consume the entire federal budget.” — President Barack Obama¹

“If we don't pass it, here's the guarantee: Your premiums will go up, your employers are going to load up more costs on you ... Potentially they're going to drop your coverage, because they just can't afford an increase of 25 percent, 30 percent in terms of the costs of providing health care to employees each and every year.” — President Barack Obama²

The clear and present danger to liberty is the status quo.

If he lets it consume the entire federal budget he's a bigger idiot that I initially thought.

So can you provide me any cost control measures this bill is going to provide?
 
So you are just speculating then when you said, "Higher Insurance Premiums for all!!!!" ?:mrgreen:

Sure, I am making a statement based on the information that I have available.
May be when this get posted on the internet, as promised, we'll get to see what's in it.
 
The claim that opposition to the Statists' healthcare objectives denotes a desire to maintain the status quo is a demonstrable straw-man.

If he lets it consume the entire federal budget he's a bigger idiot that I initially thought. …

And yet the opposition to this bill provided no alternatives, just obstruction: sounds like an endorsement of the status quo to me.
 
And yet the opposition to this bill provided no alternatives, just obstruction: sounds like an endorsement of the status quo to me.

That's patently false.

Thousands of people are killed in car accidents in this country each and everyone should generally agree that something should be done to reduce that number.

If there was a movement in congress to ban cars to reduce the number of fatal auto accidents each year, would you be consistent and say that anyone opposed to the banning of automobiles were just endorsing the status quo?
 
So true Chappy. And great changes in this country have never been popular to all like freeing slaves, civil rights, desegregation, the list goes on and on. Usually the right thing is not easy either.

Um, have you ever heard of a "representative democracy"? Representatives are elected to represent the will of the people.
 
How dare you slander the American people, who came out in droves in opposition to this agenda, in such a way?

Not really. You mean the fabricated claims of the attendance at the "Tea party" that was orchestrated by the right wing FAUX news or the misinformed and purposely disruptive few at the town hall meetings? I loved your obviously well informed woman that chanted she didn't want the government to get it's hands on Medicare. Hey lady! Medicare is the government! :doh And then there was the genius that asked Barny Frank a Jew why he was supporting a "Nazi policy?" I'm sorry I refuse to insult the American people and try and sell the sham that this is MOST of the people. If it is we are in deep trouble.

Some of you people keep telling the rest of us that MOST PEOPLE are against health care reform just because you are not for it. Just saying it's so doesn't make it so.
 
What a strawman.
Freeing slaves and civil rights are about honoring a person right to their labor.
This health care is about taking away people's right to their labor.

Your opinion. One could argue on the other side of the fence, health care reform is about freeing people up to enjoy life, liberty, and happiness vs. the worry about losing everything you worked for all your life due to a catastrophic illness, or even having affordable health care in the first place. I really have to wonder if those of you that are opposed to health care reform have had any experience with the cost of heath care. I seriously doubt it.

You can say or believe what you want about Obama but we can't continue on the path of the status quo regarding health care. With costs projected to triple in ten years noone will be able to afford it, and the insurances companies will first refuse to pay and then declare bankruptcy. If you think our recession is bad now, you ain't seen nothing yet when the health care industry collapses.
 
The claim that opposition to the Statists' healthcare objectives denotes a desire to maintain the status quo is a demonstrable straw-man.

How ridiculous of an argument. The status quo is exactly what some want and make no bones about saying so. How it can't be part of this debate and inappropriately be called a straw-man is absurd. Do you even know what a straw-man is?
 
Not really. You mean the fabricated claims of the attendance at the "Tea party" that was orchestrated by the right wing FAUX news or the misinformed and purposely disruptive few at the town hall meetings? I loved your obviously well informed woman that chanted she didn't want the government to get it's hands on Medicare. Hey lady! Medicare is the government! :doh And then there was the genius that asked Barny Frank a Jew why he was supporting a "Nazi policy?" I'm sorry I refuse to insult the American people and try and sell the sham that this is MOST of the people. If it is we are in deep trouble.

Some of you people keep telling the rest of us that MOST PEOPLE are against health care reform just because you are not for it. Just saying it's so doesn't make it so.

Again, more straw men. Being opposed to this Statist wish list =/= being opposed to real healthcare reform.

Tort reform to reign in the trial lawyers alone would lead to lower healthcare costs due to all of the unnecessary test that doctors would be free to forgo and not charge insurance for.

If the opposition party floated a bill with only tort-reform, would your opposition to such a bill be wanting to maintain the status quo?
 
How ridiculous of an argument. The status quo is exactly what some want and make no bones about saying so. How it can't be part of this debate and inappropriately be called a straw-man is absurd. Do you even know what a straw-man is?



A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position.


You misrepresent the opposition to the Statists' objectives via the healthcare takeover as being an opposition to healthcare reform.

It's the textbook definition of what a straw man is...
 
… If there was a movement in congress to ban cars to reduce the number of fatal auto accidents each year, would you be consistent and say that anyone opposed to the banning of automobiles were just endorsing the status quo?

Talk about straw men.

I would be consistent in opposing the banning of automobiles which is an extreme, counterproductive and unrealistic solution and in doing so, offering alternative solutions for improving auto safety and reducing accidents by such things as endorsing crumple zone mandates, passive restraint mandates, restrictions on the sale of particularly dangerous vehicles, allocations of money towards improving roads, etc., etc.

But, in the face of a clear hazard to our society, such as that posed by the health care crisis today, to offer nothing towards its resolution, indeed, to delay, distract and dismiss all possible efforts to address that hazard is to be irresponsible in the extreme. It is an endorsement to suffer the consequences of that hazard, which in the case of the health care crisis means the early deaths of tens of thousands of Americans each year.

Today, the Democratic Party is moving forward with a plan to begin the process of addressing the health care crisis and we all should be grateful for that.

“Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.” — Sir Winston Churchill, November 1942​
 
Talk about straw men.

It's quite a good comparison really.

I would be consistent in opposing the banning of automobiles which is an extreme, counterproductive and unrealistic solution and in doing so, offering alternative solutions for improving auto safety and reducing accidents by such things as endorsing crumple zone mandates, passive restraint mandates, restrictions on the sale of particularly dangerous vehicles, allocations of money towards improving roads, etc., etc.

Imposing strict Government restrictions on free competition is equally as counterproductive & unrealistic to lower costs and expand coverage, although you seem to have bought it.

But, in the face of a clear hazard to our society, such as that posed by the health care crisis is today, to offer nothing towards its resolution, indeed, to delay, distract and dismiss all possible efforts to address that hazard is to be irresponsible in the extreme. It is an endorsement to suffer the consequences of that hazard, which in the case of the health care crisis means the early deaths of tens of thousands of Americans each year.

Explain to me clearly & immediately how this healthcare reform bill is going to save anyone's life?


Today, the Democratic Party is moving forward with a plan to begin the process of addressing the health care crisis and we all should be grateful for that.

Today the Democratic party is moving forward with a plan for state-ownership of the individual cloaked as being an effort to reform healthcare. We will rue this day.

“Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.” — Sir Winston Churchill, November 1942​

"Since the general civilization of mankind,
I believe there are more instances of the abridgment of freedoms
of the people by gradual and silent encroachment of those in power
than by violent and sudden usurpations." ~ James Madison, June 1788
 
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