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New Obama plans: 'spend our way out' of downturn

The point is it is supposed to go back to the treasury.

Okay. But it's off-topic from my original point, which was that it made a profit, just as the poster said it was supposed to do.

They tried to spend their way out in the great depression but that did not work WW2 got us out of the depression. It did not work then and will not work now.

Actually, it's more complicated than that, and the world is very different now.
 
The president can veto spending bills. The President allows spending

The claim was that the President is "bribing Congress" with spending. So bills he vetoes is irrelevant. He can't spend a dime, or veto a dime, without Congress appropriating the money first. Saying he is "bribing Congress" is silly.
 
Okay. But it's off-topic from my original point, which was that it made a profit, just as the poster said it was supposed to do.



Actually, it's more complicated than that, and the world is very different now.

There is no profit and it will not be used to pay back the treasury like the bill said it would.
 
I never said the stimulus worked.

;)

Because it's my money.

Yeah, you don't give a damn about anything but yourself, even if you come out worse in the long run.

Sure, everyone wants tax cuts. This thread is about the economy and how best to help it, not the fact that nobody likes to pay taxes. That's a given.
 
the nation must continue to 'spend our way out of this recession' until more Americans are back at work.
I agree with that. We sure can't save our way to a robust economic expansion.

Without giving a price tag, Obama proposed a package of new spending for highway, bridge and other infrastructure projects, deeper tax breaks for small businesses and tax incentives to encourage people to make their homes more energy efficient."

"Obama did not say how much his proposals would cost, although congressional Democrats are eyeing a $70 billion package to help create jobs and to provide aid to hard-pressed state and local governments. Administration aides suggested that the part of the package dealing with roads, bridges and other infrastructure could total about $50 billion."
Sounds good to me.

Seems that this means the package from last winter is a failure. We have already spent too much money, it is not working.

Nonpartisan analyses agree: current GDP, total employment figures would be worse without Recovery Act. According to impartial, nonpartisan analyses of key economic indicators since the first quarter of 2009 conducted by several companies specializing in macroeconomic forecasting, the stimulus package boosted both the gross domestic product (GDP) and total employment figures relative to how those metrics would have fared in the absence of that legislation.


Contradicting broad economic consensus, right-wing media use jobs summit to declare stimulus has failed | Media Matters for America
 
Yeah, you don't give a damn about anything but yourself...

Wanting a tax cut = not giving a damn about anything but myself.

Strange logic you have there.

Sure, everyone wants tax cuts. This thread is about the economy and how best to help it, not the fact that nobody likes to pay taxes. That's a given.

Tax cuts do help the economy.
 
obama's the man suddenly talking about tax cuts

LOL!

barack obama is so stupid...

(how stupid is he?!)...

he actually believes that holding a december jobs summit will make americans think he's doing something about their one and only overwhelming concern

instead of leading normal people to conclude---what the heck has he been doing the last 11 months?
 
I agree with that. We sure can't save our way to a robust economic expansion.

Sounds good to me.



Nonpartisan analyses agree: current GDP, total employment figures would be worse without Recovery Act. According to impartial, nonpartisan analyses of key economic indicators since the first quarter of 2009 conducted by several companies specializing in macroeconomic forecasting, the stimulus package boosted both the gross domestic product (GDP) and total employment figures relative to how those metrics would have fared in the absence of that legislation.


Contradicting broad economic consensus, right-wing media use jobs summit to declare stimulus has failed | Media Matters for America

Raising taxes will mean less money to expand business.
 
Okay. But it's off-topic from my original point, which was that it made a profit, just as the poster said it was supposed to do.



Actually, it's more complicated than that, and the world is very different now.

Yes, the most important difference is that we know governments can spend their way out of a paper bag, let alone a recession.
 
And tax cuts don't?



True. But it's too late. We're in the short term now, in a crisis, and we have to think that way. I don't like it either.
The government has too much of our money already. You act like it's the duty of the govt to spend as much as possible. You got that all wrong.
 
The government has too much of our money already. You act like it's the duty of the govt to spend as much as possible. You got that all wrong.

Never said any of that. Read my post again.
 
;)



Yeah, you don't give a damn about anything but yourself, even if you come out worse in the long run.

Sure, everyone wants tax cuts. This thread is about the economy and how best to help it, not the fact that nobody likes to pay taxes. That's a given.

And tax cuts are how best to improve the economy. That's a given.
 
And tax cuts are how best to improve the economy. That's a given.

No, that's wrong. Tax cuts have much less effect on short-term consumer spending than a stimulus. Tax cuts help the wealthy, who don't need to spend the money anyway. They may invest it, but we need spending right now. Tax cuts may be good in the long term (or not), but not in a crisis.
 
OP - I'm in late.

Being given extra money to spend only hurts you, eventually.
It might help for a small while - a few thousand doesn't go far these days, honestly - but when it's gone you're still down on your luck.

It's like giving a pacifier to a baby - it'll keep her quiet for a while but it's not a fix to the perpetual issue of hunger.
 
So Question..

If you do not spend your way out of a downturn then what can you do?
 
In order for someone's hiked spending ot be extremely beneficial they MUST have a constant flow of increased money to spend.

This is why poor are still poor even if they receive a 5,000 tax return - they have to have a continual source of money for them to get out of 'being poor'

So - people need to be EMPLOYED to save theirselves from the red.

If stimulous plans worked then we'd be OUT of trouble, now, and we're far from that, honestly. So what's wrong? What's wrong is that the problem for everyone's economic crunch is STILL THERE - lack of money isn't the issue. It's the lack of a job and the existing dependency on credit.

The credit-dependency is like suckling on a teet that eventually will go dry - as we're witnessing. Credit spending has decreased for the last 9 months . . .thankfully.

It's a house of cards that can't stand forever. . .especially when the bottom is pulled out from under it.
 
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WHY does this have to be done with taxpayer funds?

WHY NOT encourage spending from private funding?

Retirees like me and the wife have plenty of money, and we are spending it on our house, finishing the basement is about half done, will be done by summer....and we are considering buying a car soon.

But every dollar taken out of our IRA accounts gets taxed at a higher rate than we were paying when we put the money into the accounts.
And yet Warren Buffet pays only 15% capital gains taxes.....:shock:

There are trillions of dollars tied up in retiree accounts that could be tapped to help stimulate the economy...give them a temporary tax break to motivate them to draw out the funds and spend them, and jobs will be created....
 
WHY does this have to be done with taxpayer funds?

WHY NOT encourage spending from private funding?
Many people don't have money in private funding - OR - have plenty in private funding and intend to use it in the future and are doing fine without it, they don't need extra spending done . . . this is me.

Retirees like me and the wife have plenty of money, and we are spending it on our house, finishing the basement is about half done, will be done by summer....and we are considering buying a car soon.

But every dollar taken out of our IRA accounts gets taxed at a higher rate than we were paying when we put the money into the accounts.
And yet Warren Buffet pays only 15% capital gains taxes.....:shock:

There are trillions of dollars tied up in retiree accounts that could be tapped to help stimulate the economy...give them a temporary tax break to motivate them to draw out the funds and spend them, and jobs will be created....

I approve, though, if people want to spend their money - let them.
 
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