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Italian court convicts Amanda Knox of murder

Maybe I should cross off the old US of A off my list too then. After an innocent man who is very dear to someone I love was sent to prison for a crime he did not commit, his name will probably be on the sex offenders list for a few more years AFTER he gets out and his young life is pretty much destroyed along with that of his wife. All for the "crime" of mistakenly downloading kiddie porn on Lime Wire when all he wanted was regular porn. Possession alone was enough to send him to jail for 10 years, even if he never meant to possess any of that stuff.

Please clean up your own backyard before you go pointing fingers elsewhere. You're jailing innocents too and letting real criminals off for good behavior every day.

It's a shame that we have a system that will err under the guise of "Being Fair" to save 1 innocent man in 9 guilty ones, and will convict an innocent man on ridiculous grounds all in the name of "blind Justice". I've got a friend in the same predicament. Police bullied a confession out of him, nearly arrested me for standing up for him, and all on the word of his G/F's daughter's little spoiled brat child. why? He told this 14 year old she couldn't have a BEER that she TOOK from his fridge without permission, and she claims he touched her inappropriately.

Justice...she weeps.
 
It's a shame that we have a system that will err under the guise of "Being Fair" to save 1 innocent man in 9 guilty ones, and will convict an innocent man on ridiculous grounds all in the name of "blind Justice". I've got a friend in the same predicament. Police bullied a confession out of him, nearly arrested me for standing up for him, and all on the word of his G/F's daughter's little spoiled brat child. why? He told this 14 year old she couldn't have a BEER that she TOOK from his fridge without permission, and she claims he touched her inappropriately.

Justice...she weeps.

puh-lease she is full of ****
appealing to emotion with no basis in fact
she is probably harboring that Hollywood pedophile
 
puh-lease she is full of ****
appealing to emotion with no basis in fact
she is probably harboring that Hollywood pedophile

Coming from someone who was wrongfully accused on a number of occassions and having 1 1/2 semesters left to get my associates and the rest of my certifications for my Criminal Justice degree, I can tell you it's not all stereotypes. Very few stereotypes about Law Enforcement, the Courts, and the Correctional System hold any water.

All of the 'safeguards' we put to make sure justice is done often let off the bad guys with minimal punishment while the innocent man can expect to take the brunt of the law because of an accident or bad timing. And if in fact that guy had accidentally downloaded kiddie porn (which btw people set up Porn Bombs on PURPOSE), it would have been easy to prove that he had only downloaded anything ONCE if the Prosecution done its job and SOUGHT JUSTICE (Yeah, it's not SUPPOSED to pursue a conviction, that's what politics have turned it into) and the Defense for most, if it isn't a private lawyer, is some public defender with 50 cases a week and sometimes less than 2 hours time with their client to go over cases, and usually in that time they just work on ways to admit guilt and go for the least punishment.
 
Coming from someone who was wrongfully accused on a number of occassions and having 1 1/2 semesters left to get my associates and the rest of my certifications for my Criminal Justice degree, I can tell you it's not all stereotypes. Very few stereotypes about Law Enforcement, the Courts, and the Correctional System hold any water.

All of the 'safeguards' we put to make sure justice is done often let off the bad guys with minimal punishment while the innocent man can expect to take the brunt of the law because of an accident or bad timing. And if in fact that guy had accidentally downloaded kiddie porn (which btw people set up Porn Bombs on PURPOSE), it would have been easy to prove that he had only downloaded anything ONCE if the Prosecution done its job and SOUGHT JUSTICE (Yeah, it's not SUPPOSED to pursue a conviction, that's what politics have turned it into) and the Defense for most, if it isn't a private lawyer, is some public defender with 50 cases a week and sometimes less than 2 hours time with their client to go over cases, and usually in that time they just work on ways to admit guilt and go for the least punishment.

This post is undoubtedly the reason you are suspended :lol:
 
Update...

Amanda Knox prosecutor Giuliano Mignini convicted of 'abuse of office' - Times Online

Giuliano Mignini, the prosecutor who secured the conviction last month of the American student Amanda Knox for the murder of her British flatmate Meredith Kercher, was handed a 16-month prison sentence yesterday for “abuse of office” in a separate murder investigation.

Mignini was convicted by a Florence court of exceeding his powers by tapping the phones of police officers and journalists investigating the still unsolved “Monster of Florence” serial killings between 1968 and 1985.

Amanda Knox is no longer part of the regular news cycle; the media depicted her as a satanic whore before anyone had a chance to see the real story behind this miscarriage of justice, that is, an innocent college student was being railroaded by a corrupt, mentally unstable prosecutor. His conviction is just another example of how flawed Knox's murder "trial" really was.

The Italian justice system can still partially redeem itself if she's released on appeal; if, however, her conviction stands, Italy will have confirmed its status as politically dysfunctional.
 
Interesting update if it's true:

Amanda Knox Bombshell: Convicted Killer Rudy Guede Told Cellmate Knox Didn't Do It, Says Paper - Crimesider - CBS News

NEW YORK (CBS) The Italian newspaper La Repubblica and some Italian national television networks are reporting tonight a new version of events in the controversial Amanda Knox murder case in Perugia, Italy.


Knox, 22, and her former boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito, 25, were convicted of the murder of Meredith Kercher, along with a third man, Rudy Guede. Sollecito's attorneys, in conducting their own investigation, have interviewed a former cellmate of Rudy Guede.

Guede, 23, allegedly admitted to his cellmate that Amanda and Raffaele were not with him when Meredith Kercher was murdered.
 
Interesting update if it's true:

Amanda Knox Bombshell: Convicted Killer Rudy Guede Told Cellmate Knox Didn't Do It, Says Paper - Crimesider - CBS News

NEW YORK (CBS) The Italian newspaper La Repubblica and some Italian national television networks are reporting tonight a new version of events in the controversial Amanda Knox murder case in Perugia, Italy.


Knox, 22, and her former boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito, 25, were convicted of the murder of Meredith Kercher, along with a third man, Rudy Guede. Sollecito's attorneys, in conducting their own investigation, have interviewed a former cellmate of Rudy Guede.

Guede, 23, allegedly admitted to his cellmate that Amanda and Raffaele were not with him when Meredith Kercher was murdered.

Interesting! I've not heard anything more about this, but if I were Amanda's attorneys, I'd be filing court papers left and right.
 
1. I am not a lefty
2. I will not believe that until I see the evidence
3. I want proof the chain of evidence was respected
4. I want copies of all Italian police work
5. I want to see EVERY LAST PIECE OF EVIDENCE
6. I want independant lab testing of all evidence

Also ... it's interesting that the seemingly patriotic right .... is so willing to throw an American citizen to the wolves ... based on a verdict in a kangaroo court.

I smell a double standard.

Who elected you to the Italian judiciary? Why are you taking such interest in one of dozens of murder trials in Italy every year? Because she's American? Why are you questioning the case against her and not against Solecito, her co-defendant?

Where do you get off calling a high court in a developed EU country a "kangaroo court"? I have no doubt you would react pretty strongly to someone calling a US murder trial a "kangaroo court". In what way is this American citizens being "thrown to the wolves"? She's had probably better representation than 90% of others tried for murder in Italy due to the high-profile nature of the case.

Your attitude is insulting, pompous and xenophobic. And how about a word of condolence for the family of Meredith Kercher, the young Yorkshire student Knox and Solecito have now been shown, proved and convicted of murdering.
 
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Interesting! I've not heard anything more about this, but if I were Amanda's attorneys, I'd be filing court papers left and right.

Her appeal is already in hand. I've no doubt any new evidence will be accorded the weight it deserves depending on the strength of the material. I just hope that the media hoopla around these claims and rumours don't further turn the knife in the wound of the Kercher family.
 
Who elected you to the Italian judiciary? Why are you taking such interest in one of dozens of murder trials in Italy every year? Because she's American? Why are you questioning the case against her and not against Solecito, her co-defendant?

Where do you get off calling a high court in a developed EU country a "kangaroo court"? I have no doubt you would react pretty strongly to someone calling a US murder trial a "kangaroo court". In what way is this American citizens being "thrown to the wolves"? She's had probably better representation than 90% of others tried for murder in Italy due to the high-profile nature of the case.

Your attitude is insulting, pompous and xenophobic. And how about a word of condolence for the family of Meredith Kercher, the young Yorkshire student Knox and Solecito have now been shown, proved and convicted of murdering.

Andablue, have you read much about this case? If you read through this thread, you will see links to articles that show serious problems with the investigation that was conducted in this case. My original post talks about how I thought she was guilty. Several people here following the case closely laid out the problems. I can see why Vader calls it a kangaroo court.
 
Andablue, have you read much about this case? If you read through this thread, you will see links to articles that show serious problems with the investigation that was conducted in this case. My original post talks about how I thought she was guilty. Several people here following the case closely laid out the problems. I can see why Vader calls it a kangaroo court.

I have been following it. It has been a major story right across Europe. There have been all the usual conspiracy theories and flat-out xenophobia that you might expect with a high-profile murder case involving a foreign national. The foreigners compatriots are always stirred up to believe that their son/daughter couldn't be guilty and that, because the trial is taking place abroad, there must be something wrong with the verdict.

You guys have to leave it to the Italian judiciary to do its job. There may or may not have been an imperfect investigation (frankly, when has there been a perfect one?) but they have an appeals system, just like the US. Insulting the Italian system simply because it's not the same as the US system is not on.
 
I have been following it. It has been a major story right across Europe. There have been all the usual conspiracy theories and flat-out xenophobia that you might expect with a high-profile murder case involving a foreign national. The foreigners compatriots are always stirred up to believe that their son/daughter couldn't be guilty and that, because the trial is taking place abroad, there must be something wrong with the verdict.

You guys have to leave it to the Italian judiciary to do its job. There may or may not have been an imperfect investigation (frankly, when has there been a perfect one?) but they have an appeals system, just like the US. Insulting the Italian system simply because it's not the same as the US system is not on.

While I don't know if she's innocent or not, it seems quite clear that the proceedings which took place were not a fair to the defendant. They wanted to indict her and it seemed obvious that her nationality had a lot to do with why they wanted to indict her.
 
While I don't know if she's innocent or not, it seems quite clear that the proceedings which took place were not a fair to the defendant. They wanted to indict her and it seemed obvious that her nationality had a lot to do with why they wanted to indict her.

WTF? In what way did she not receive the same rights as Raffaele Sollecito, an Italian? Seemed obvious that her nationality had a lot to do with it? To whom was this obvious? Back up your extraordinary claims with some hard evidence. Why would an Italian court, Italy being one of the US's closest and most friendly allies, want to perjure their entire legal system in order to convict a rather strange but otherwise non-descript American student.

Had Knox committed her crime in the US, not one of you posters would be calling foul. Not one of you. You are saying she's not receiving justice because she's American. I'm saying you're doing so because the court is Italian.
 
Had Knox committed her crime in the US, not one of you posters would be calling foul. Not one of you.

We have plenty of protections against unfair trials though. We'll even give fair civil trials to terrorist suspects.
 
We have plenty of protections against unfair trials though. We'll even give fair civil trials to terrorist suspects.

2009 Miscarriages of Justice in the US:

* Alan Beaman, convicted for the stabbing and strangling to death of his ex-girlfriend, was exonerated.
* Timothy Cole was convicted in 1985 for a rape he did not commit, he was posthumously exonerated in early February 2009 after serving 14 years. He died in prison in 1999.
* Thaddeus Jimenez spent more than 16 years in jail before his conviction was tossed.
* Sgt. Brian W. Foster's conviction for rape was overturned.
* Joseph R. Fears, Jr. was convicted in 1984 for two rapes. His sentence was overturned after DNA evidence proved that he didn't commit one of the rapes.
* Paul House was exonerated after spending 22 years on death row for murder.
* Joshua Kezer's 60 years prison sentence for second-degree murder was overturned. Circuit Judge Richard Callahan said: "The criminal justice system failed in the investigative and charging stage, it failed at trial, it failed at post-trial review and it failed during the appellate process."
* Bill Dillon's life sentence for murder was overturned. He was convicted in 1981 based on John Preston's testimony that he and his scent-tracking German-Shepherd connected Dillon to the killer’s bloody t-shirt. However, a 2007 DNA test proved that Dillon's DNA did not match the DNA on the t-shirt. Hundreds of other convictions based on the alleged abilities of the same dog are now in doubt.
* Darryl Burton. Wrongly convicted and imprisoned for 24 years.

Ah! You'll say, but the fact that these were discovered to be miscarriages at all means that our safeguards work. Well, to an extent. But they also work in Italy, although there are far fewer recorded...

Miscarriages of Justice in Italy

* Pietro Valpreda, an anarchist condemned for the 1969 Piazza Fontana bombing, was finally found innocent sixteen years later. He was framed since it was planned to blame the crime on the radical Left, while it was committed by Neo-Fascist groups as the first step of the strategy of tension.
* Enzo Tortora, a popular anchorman on national RAI television, was arrested in 1983 and held in jail for months on trumped up charges by several pentiti of the Camorra and other people already known for perjury. It was soon noted that this was most likely an mis-identification due to confusion with a man bearing the same surname (meaning "turtledove"), but the pentiti kept on accusing Tortora of the gravest offenses related to drug dealing. He was sentenced to ten years in jail in his first trial held in 1985, being spared further incarceration only thanks to the providential intervention of the Radical Party who offered him a candidacy to the European Parliament, a place Tortora won in a landslide as the country became divided between those who held him guilty and those who held him innocent. He was completely acquitted and rehabilitated in 1986; he returned the next year to his work in TV, to a moving comeback in his "Portobello" show, to die in 1988 from cancer and become an icon of injustice and a perpetual reminder of the gravest public blunder of the Italian judiciary system.
* Daniele Barillà, an entrepreneur mistakenly identified as a major drug cartel boss in Milan, spent more than 7 years in jail in 1992-1999, despite growing evidence of his complete innocence and non-involvement in any criminal activity. To this day, the Italian state hasn't awarded him any compensation.

All interesting cases. Now, what makes your system so much more reliable?
 
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Where do you get off calling a high court in a developed EU country a "kangaroo court"?

Let's see...

The lead prosecutor is a corrupt (he was recently found guilty of prosecutorial misconduct) and fantastical figure who gleaned a motive from an occultist blogger that claims to communicate with the dead.

The jury had full access to sensational media reports painting Amanda Knox as a sex-crazed satanic American whore, AKA, Foxy Knoxy, which was just a nickname she was given for her soccer skills.

The chain of evidence was broken.

Key pieces of forensic evidence were mishandled by investigators.

Want more?

Your attitude is insulting, pompous and xenophobic. And how about a word of condolence for the family of Meredith Kercher, the young Yorkshire student Knox and Solecito have now been shown, proved and convicted of murdering.

Laughable. I defy you to read this entire thread and make that claim again.
 
Her appeal is already in hand. I've no doubt any new evidence will be accorded the weight it deserves depending on the strength of the material. I just hope that the media hoopla around these claims and rumours don't further turn the knife in the wound of the Kercher family.

The Kercher family's loss is no reason to send an innocent girl to jail for twenty-six years.
 
The Kercher family's loss is no reason to send an innocent girl to jail for twenty-six years.

I'm still not hearing any sympathy, whether or not you believe Knox is innocent.

If she is, then she has an appeal, which will be heard by a different judge, before a different jury. If she is found guilty again, will you accept the verdict? If she is found not guilty, I'll be happy to accept your criticisms of the original trial in relation to the inadequacy of that original process. After all, that's the purpose of appeals, and the inevitable conclusion of any overturned verdict, no?
 
I fully support this conviction. I watched the news reports on this trial. They showed Amanda Knox smiling and laughing in the court room. Excuse me? You're on trial for murder and you can't stop smiling? Sorry, but someone who was truly innocent, wouldn't be looking at these charges lightly, IMO. She cried when the verdict was read. Oh brother. I'm not sympathetic.

I am not sure if smiling is relevant. But if she is guilty of the crime then should pay the price, being a citizen of another country does not make immune to the laws of a country you are a guest in.
 
I'm still not hearing any sympathy, whether or not you believe Knox is innocent.

Of course I have sympathy for them. That goes without saying, unless you think I'm a monster.

My problem with people referencing the Kercher's pain is that they often use it as a pretext to condemn Amanda Knox.

If she is, then she has an appeal, which will be heard by a different judge, before a different jury.

I understand how it works, and am glad for it, but that does not excuse the numerous and obvious shortcomings of the initial trial.

If she is found guilty again, will you accept the verdict?

I would have to review the trial before I came to a decision.

If she is found not guilty, I'll be happy to accept your criticisms of the original trial in relation to the inadequacy of that original process. After all, that's the purpose of appeals, and the inevitable conclusion of any overturned verdict, no?

There is no reason for it to have gone this far. The prosecutor and the Italian media crucified her because they were concerned with their reputation and ratings, respectively...
 
Of course I have sympathy for them. That goes without saying, unless you think I'm a monster.

My problem with people referencing the Kercher's pain is that they often use it as a pretext to condemn Amanda Knox.

I'm certainly not suggesting you are a monster, but these things do not go without saying. The only sympathy I have encountered on this thread is for Knox.

There is no reason for it to have gone this far. The prosecutor and the Italian media crucified her because they were concerned with their reputation and ratings, respectively...

I do regret the media circus that accompanied this trial. There are analagous "show trials" in most countries that damage the ability of defendants to receive a fair trial. The media circus surrounding such high-profile cases make the operation of the justice system incredibly difficult. Think about the Louise Woodward and Phil Spector trials in the US, the Bulger case in the UK, Fritzl in Austria, Samu Carcaño in Spain.

With some of those cases it was found that media attention had affected the verdicts, some not. The only thing that can be said is that the media coverage cannot be allowed to drive the conclusions of the court, but that you cannot ethically judge that effect until the courts have been allowed to conclude their deliberations. Let's let that process conclude before drawing damning conclusions.
 
I'm certainly not suggesting you are a monster, but these things do not go without saying. The only sympathy I have encountered on this thread is for Knox.

Any decent human being has sympathy for Meredith Kercher and her family. I do believe that goes without saying.

I do regret the media circus that accompanied this trial.

Do you also regret the lack of evidence that links Amanda or Rafaelle to the murder, or the prosecutor's bizarre methods and history of prosecutorial misconduct?

There are analagous "show trials" in most countries that damage the ability of defendants to receive a fair trial. The media circus surrounding such high-profile cases make the operation of the justice system incredibly difficult. Think about the Louise Woodward and Phil Spector trials in the US, the Bulger case in the UK, Fritzl in Austria, Samu Carcaño in Spain.

All high profile cases can be influenced by the media but it seems like the Italian system does not take pains to prevent this by sequestering juries or at least granting a change of venue.

With some of those cases it was found that media attention had affected the verdicts, some not. The only thing that can be said is that the media coverage cannot be allowed to drive the conclusions of the court, but that you cannot ethically judge that effect until the courts have been allowed to conclude their deliberations. Let's let that process conclude before drawing damning conclusions.

I've seen the "evidence" against Amanda and Rafaelle and it is totally lacking in probative value. If you wish to challenge this assertion with facts of your own, I welcome it.
 
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