Federal Deficit Hits October Record of $176 Billion

EpicDude86 said:

When it comes to legislation, I think you ought to read the actual bill not the wiki.

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I just needed it for the infrastructure break down and tax break down. And anyone who paid any attention during the discussions on it knew it was going to be heavy tax relief/infrastructure. Which is somewhat of a reason why the intelligent people knew it likely wouldn't have worked. For tax cuts to do actually do anything, they need to be large enough to promote discretionary spending for the masses. We really haven't seen that in recent history. Even in Bush's era the middle class tax cuts were not large enough to promote the necessary spending to get us out of recessions. Most middle class either used them for necessities, mortgage payments or just saved them. None of which drives the engine of the economy. As for infrastructure, there is no possible way to get those projects started quickly. When the bulk of the money is in those forms, timeliness goes out the window.

obvious Child said:

I just needed it for the infrastructure break down and tax break down. And anyone who paid any attention during the discussions on it knew it was going to be heavy tax relief/infrastructure. Which is somewhat of a reason why the intelligent people knew it likely wouldn't have worked. For tax cuts to do actually do anything, they need to be large enough to promote discretionary spending for the masses. We really haven't seen that in recent history. Even in Bush's era the middle class tax cuts were not large enough to promote the necessary spending to get us out of recessions. Most middle class either used them for necessities, mortgage payments or just saved them. None of which drives the engine of the economy. As for infrastructure, there is no possible way to get those projects started quickly. When the bulk of the money is in those forms, timeliness goes out the window.

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Weren't the middle class tax cuts in the stealfromus bill supposed to be like 13 bucks a week?

apdst said:

Weren't the middle class tax cuts in the stealfromus bill supposed to be like 13 bucks a week?

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yep....And those have already run their course.

apdst said:

Tell us how much has been spent on actual infrastructure projects--roads, bridges, etc.--and how much has been spent on BS like free money in Detroit, marsh mouses, deer under passes, turtle tunnels and the study of Alskan gand parents.

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At the moment, relatively little has been spent, around 19% which again backs my argument that this isn't stimulus as it's not timely.

Slow Stimulus: Where’s the Money? Liveshots

Furthermore, you haven't addressed my question. If we look at the actual breakdowns, you are once again the wrong.

Tell me how a bill that is nearly 51% tax relief/infrastructure is an genetically bill.

Or could just pretend I never asked you that as you normally do for everything you can't back up.

apdst said:

it has tax relief for the welfare class.

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I'd ask you to support such a claim, but you won't. By the way, I noticed you did not bash Bush when he pushed tax cuts that explicitly allowed the welfare class to get refundable checks.

Not that I'm under any illusions you're not a partisan hack.

Weren't the middle class tax cuts in the stealfromus bill supposed to be like 13 bucks a week?

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Can you act like an adult for a change?

As I understand the withholding tax relief, that is what the $13 was. Not the Stimulus bill. For someone who claims to have his own business, you should know this.

Obama's Stimulus: Tax Break or Chump Change?

February 27, 2009 02:40 PM ET | Paul Bedard

By Paul Bedard, Washington Whispers

Americans are not a happy bunch, according to our new Whispers poll from Synovate. The latest downer: Those polled say the income-tax break that amounts to about $13 a week is so small that they won't even notice it. And practically nobody said it was enough to even prompt a McDonald's splurge. Asked what they will do with the much-heralded $13 when it arrives beginning in April, a whopping 63 percent said that it is so small that they won't even notice it. Twenty-five percent said that they would simply apply it to bills. And a combined 12 percent said they'd either go to the movies or take the kids to McDonald's. Men were especially depressed, with 66 percent telling our pollster that the break was chump change. And women sounded more responsible, with 28 percent pledging to use the money to pay down credit card bills. Here are the grim statistics:

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obvious Child said:

At the moment, relatively little has been spent, around 19% which again backs my argument that this isn't stimulus as it's not timely.

Slow Stimulus: Where’s the Money? Liveshots

Furthermore, you haven't addressed my question. If we look at the actual breakdowns, you are once again the wrong.

Tell me how a bill that is nearly 51% tax relief/infrastructure is an genetically bill.

Or could just pretend I never asked you that as you normally do for everything you can't back up.

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Which further reinforces the idea that the porkulus bill is a joke, period.

Tell me how a bill that is nearly 51% tax relief/infrastructure is an genetically bill.

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I would...if that sentence made a damn bit of sense...:rofl

obvious Child said:

I'd ask you to support such a claim, but you won't. By the way, I noticed you did not bash Bush when he pushed tax cuts that explicitly allowed the welfare class to get refundable checks.

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You didn't see me bash Bush, because I wasn't posting on this forum. But, if you had been on the forum I was posting on, you would have seen me bash Bush and the Libbos Congress, alot.

apdst said:

Which further reinforces the idea that the porkulus bill is a joke, period.

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Depends how you define joke. I don't bias my posts like you do. I fully recognize on the basis of allocation of monies that the bill is a long term infrastructure investment bill. Apparently you missed my point about it not being timely. Does that mean that investing in infrastructure is a joke? Depends if you've been outside driving on American road lately. I have. Perhaps you have not?

Hmmm. Must have accidentally clicked that when I misspelled entitlement and Firefox suggested corrections.

My bad, the making work pay withholding tax credit is part of the stimulus. It still fails for the same reasons Bush's tax cuts did.

In some ways though, it is better principle. Utilizing psychology, what a tax cut that is relatively small should do is send $50 checks that are by law prohibited from being deposited that day. Putting $50 into everyone's pocket that more or less stays in that pocket should promote spending. If the tax cut is going to be small, there are ways to force people to spend it by tapping into consumer behavior.

As for you not bashing Bush, you seem to have no problem omitting how many of Obama's policies you give him grief for are nearly identical to Bush's. There is a reason I call Obama a Bush clone. You seem to think otherwise.

obvious Child said:

Depends how you define joke. I don't bias my posts like you do.

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That's how you define a joke, alright...:rofl

I say it here:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...ober-record-176-billion-5.html#post1058367014

And it comes out in your posts.

obvious Child said:

Goldenboy claimed that a weak dollar should push exports up. You claimed that did not happen and posted a link that showed that exports actually did increase.

Seeing how you haven't quite realized this I question your capacity to read.

Furthermore, you cited the trade imbalance as evidence exports declined yet you did not understand that exports can increase at the same time the trade deficit increases.

And tangents don't prove you weren't wrong the first time.

While I realize your capacity to read is questionable and likely your capacity to do math is equally questionable, tell me, do your cited examples exceed the amount assigned to infrastructure?

Stimulus to boost Arizona water infrastructure

Over $1 billion is set aside for just water infrastructure improvements.

The Stimulus Plan: How to Spend $787 Billion - The New York Times

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so much argumentation

and such bitchiness

LOL!

any money spent on turtles and coeds is too much

the stimulus failed

the man said 8% unemployment

big picture

the big picture looks bad, real bad

just like the trade deficit

just like imports doubling exports despite the weak dollar

unfortunately, most of the little stuff is equally unfavorable

most meaningfully, the headlines are 50 times bigger than such little arguments

Do you realize my argument is that you are wrong and perhaps you should take the time to actually understand the concepts you are talking about?

And the big picture isn't as bad as you make it out to be barring that $50+ trillion unfunded liabilities that existed prior to Dubya and Obama.

i understand all, it's quite obvious

the big picture is the worst it's been in my long life

"a lot" is 2 words

CA state curriculum standards, 6th grade most commonly misspelled words

i saw your little error in a previous post

no problem

take care

The Prof said:

i understand all, it's quite obvious

the big picture is the worst it's been in my long life

"a lot" is 2 words

CA state curriculum standards, 6th grade most commonly misspelled words

i saw your little error in a previous post

no problem

take care

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I think I know why you have so few thank you's.

who cares

other than you