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Obama's Minions Are Ingrates

Harshaw said:
The reality covered by his "careful review" and addressed by his "comprehensive strategy," of course, overseen by his hand-picked general. Since March, it's been his baby.

So I ask you again --

Was he kidding?

Was he lying?

Was he grossly overstating?
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Is Cheney grossly overstating and lying or kidding us when he said his administration keep America safe?..afterall he and Bush created some kind of "Comprehensive strategy" to twart attack an on our country 9 months into their term which they were warned about from several sources.
They are totally responsible for that now...aren't they?

As I said...you righties can't have it both ways.

That is the reason we are in Afghanistan isn't it? To revenge those attacks.
 
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goldendog said:
Is Cheney grossly overstating and lying or kidding us when he said his administration keep America safe?..
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There were no further attacks on US soil after 9/11, which is what he referred to, so apparently not. :shrug:


afterall he and Bush created some kind of "Comprehensive strategy" to twart attack an on our country 9 months into their term
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Can you point to them holding a press conference and announcing this?


which they were warned about from several sources.
They are totally responsible for that now...aren't they?
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They took responsibility. They also responded within weeks. There was NO indecision, no dithering, no complaints about having to "review."

There sure as HELL were no talk show appearances, no soirees, no fund-raising trips, no battles with a network, no anything else which distracted from the decisions which needed to be made at that time. They didn't whine about it. They didn't complain about any messes left by Clinton. They didn't complain about the minority Democrats. They hunkered down and made the decisions.

The country needed leadership in those days, and say what you want about what happened after, NO ONE except the most rabid haters says Bush didn't lead in those days. He did exactly what the country needed, which is why his approval rating topped 90 percent at the time.

So, Bush in October '01, and Obama in October '09? Absolutely no comparison whatsoever. Obama is an indecisive whiner. Bush led.

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Of course, this is all a distraction anyway. You simply don't want to answer the points above.

I realize you know there's no path for you here, and you KNOW that Obama specifically, overtly took responsibility for Afghanistan back in March. But why not just say so instead of all this lame whining about Bush?

Bush is gone.
 
Harshaw said:
There were no further attacks on US soil after 9/11, which is what he referred to, so apparently not. :shrug:




Can you point to them holding a press conference and announcing this?




They took responsibility. They also responded within weeks. There was NO indecision, no dithering, no complaints about having to "review."

There sure as HELL were no talk show appearances, no soirees, no fund-raising trips, no battles with a network, no anything else which distracted from the decisions which needed to be made at that time. They didn't whine about it. They didn't complain about any messes left by Clinton. They didn't complain about the minority Democrats. They hunkered down and made the decisions.

The country needed leadership in those days, and say what you want about what happened after, NO ONE except the most rabid haters says Bush didn't lead in those days. He did exactly what the country needed, which is why his approval rating topped 90 percent at the time.

So, Bush in October '01, and Obama in October '09? Absolutely no comparison whatsoever. Obama is an indecisive whiner. Bush led.

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Of course, this is all a distraction anyway. You simply don't want to answer the points above.

I realize you know there's no path for you here, and you KNOW that Obama specifically, overtly took responsibility for Afghanistan back in March. But why not just say so instead of all this lame whining about Bush?

Bush is gone.
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"Bush is gone"

So are 3000 us Citizens and 4000 US troops.

And apparently because it was 9 months into their first term in office and they were warned previously...they are responsible.
 
goldendog said:
"Bush is gone"

So are 3000 us Citizens and 4000 US troops.

And apparently because it was 9 months into their first term in office and they were warned previously...they are responsible.
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Simply repeating the same distractions and deflections from discussing Obama and the here and now . . . and bordering on Truffer crap, for that matter. :roll:

You've conceded the point. You can run along now.
 
Harshaw said:
Simply repeating the same distractions and deflections from discussing Obama and the here and now . . . and bordering on Truffer crap, for that matter. :roll:

You've conceded the point. You can run along now.
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I accept your concession.....:2wave:

You've made my point very clear....the right can't have it both ways.

If as you say President Obama is going to be held responsible for the present day Afghanistan and what let to it along with not making decisions quickly and accurately enough then so should Dick and Bush.

That's just the way it is.
 
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goldendog said:
I accept your concession.....:2wave:
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Yeah. I'm sure that works on the playground where you hang out, but I answered everything you said, you know about Bush actually taking responsibility and dealing with 9/11, making the necessary decisions, but you seem to think that ignoring it and repeating what you said means I have to answer it again. You lose. But then, what else is new?

That you simply have never even tried to answer my points, and instead tried to make it about Bush, well, that says everything necessary. And one of the things it says is that you don't actually think much of Obama, much as you'd insist that you do, because you know you aren't even trying to defend him on the merits of my points. :shrug: Oh, well.
 
tumbleweed said:
Emanuel actually made a valid point in a round about way. According to the OP Bush didn't do a full review supposedly asking all the questions Emanuel was referring to until mid-September to mid-November 2008 via the Lute Review, roughly 7 years after the first combat operations. At that point, late 2008, Bush wouldn't have had time to make the necessary changes that probably should have been made long before the situation in Afghanistan became Obama's problem.
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Surely, Rahm must have been screaming to the high heavens, demanding a full inquiry at the time, asking the "basic questions"....

:rofl

What a god damn pathetic joke. What the hell does Rahm Emanuel know about warfare? About the "basic questions" concerning Afghanistan?

Nothing, that's what. He knows nothing. He's just a scumbag Chicago politician trying to deflect blame from his cowardly boss; it goes without saying that the partisan faithful will lap it up like the non-thinking, useful idiots that they are.

This administration is the perfect liberal storm.

Spineless, whiny, lying hypocrites.
 
Harshaw said:
Yeah. I'm sure that works on the playground where you hang out, but I answered everything you said, you know about Bush actually taking responsibility and dealing with 9/11, making the necessary decisions, but you seem to think that ignoring it and repeating what you said means I have to answer it again. You lose. But then, what else is new?

That you simply have never even tried to answer my points, and instead tried to make it about Bush, well, that says everything necessary. And one of the things it says is that you don't actually think much of Obama, much as you'd insist that you do, because you know you aren't even trying to defend him on the merits of my points. :shrug: Oh, well.
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Didn't you try to make the whole thing NOT about Bush and Cheney past policies having a direct consequences as to current Afghanistan..

Post a link where Bush or Cheney took any responsiblity for NOT being prepared for the 9-11 attacks on their watch?
 
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goldendog said:
Didn't you try to make the whole thing NOT about Bush and Cheney past policies having a direct consequences as to current Afghanistan..
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Nope.

I'm pointing out that Obama took charge and responsibility himself, with his own "comprehensive strategy" and own hand-picked general, whereas you excuse him entirely, clinging to blaming Bush exclusively.


Post a link where Bush or Cheney took any responsiblity for NOT being prepared for the 9-11 attacks on their watch?
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They took responsibility for dealing with it, didn't blame it on anyone, and dealt with it.

If you want to discuss what they should have done with the information they had, I created a thread for that several weeks ago.

http://www.debatepolitics.com/gover...3-things-bush-could-have-done-pre-9-11-a.html

Besides, any president who hasn't taken charge after burning nearly a quarter of his term is a weak, ineffectual one. What IS he waiting for? Someone to tell him it's OK?
 
goldendog said:
Didn't you try to make the whole thing NOT about Bush and Cheney past policies having a direct consequences as to current Afghanistan..

Post a link where Bush or Cheney took any responsiblity for NOT being prepared for the 9-11 attacks on their watch?
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Dude, arguing with Harshaw on this point is obviously moot. He's not going to admit fault with his argument. It would mean backpedaling on the inane title of his thread and the basic understanding of the situation you have so rightly pointed out. Don't bother wasting any more cyberspace on his obviously inconsistent arguments.
 
goldendog said:
I accept your concession.....:2wave:

You've made my point very clear....the right can't have it both ways.

If as you say President Obama is going to be held responsible for the present day Afghanistan and what let to it along with not making decisions quickly and accurately enough then so should Dick and Bush.
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Uh, did you miss the whole part about how Bush actually made the decisions which needed to be made? You quoted it all, of course, but that certainly doesn't mean you read it.
 
Harshaw said:
Uh, did you miss the whole part about how Bush actually made the decisions which needed to be made? You quoted it all, of course, but that certainly doesn't mean you read it.
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He needed to make the decision to leave Afghanistan and let the Taliban regain strength over a 6 year period?

He needed to have additional troop requests sit on his desk for eight months prior to him leaving office.

He NEEDED TO DO THOSE THINGS?
 
goldendog said:
He needed to make the decision to leave Afghanistan and let the Taliban regain strength over a 6 year period?

He needed to have additional troop requests sit on his desk for eight months prior to him leaving office.

He NEEDED TO DO THOSE THINGS?
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That's funny; I thought we were talking about 9 months into his Presidency, not two years into his second term.

If you can find me defending Bush's incompetent second term anywhere, please point it out. I'll be waiting.

But it still has nothing to do with Obama being an indecisive whiner about something he had already "carefully reviewed" and implemented a "comprehensive strategy" for.
 
chevydriver1123 said:
Alcoholism is personal behavior, I dont buy into the whole genetic theory.
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Good on ya... I threw it in there because there is a tendency for a group of people (Libs) to make it seem like everything is beyond our control... like we're blobs with no personal will.

.
 
Harshaw said:
That's funny; I thought we were talking about 9 months into his Presidency, not two years into his second term.

If you can find me defending Bush's incompetent second term anywhere, please point it out. I'll be waiting.

But it still has nothing to do with Obama being an indecisive whiner about something he had already "carefully reviewed" and implemented a "comprehensive strategy" for.
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Was it two years into Bush and Cheney's second term when they left Afghanistan behind and focused on finding Bin Laden in Iraq? Leaving the Taliban to regain strenght and Afghanistan to dissolve into what it is currently.

Check your dates.
 
goldendog said:
"Bush is gone"

So are 3000 us Citizens and 4000 US troops.

And apparently because it was 9 months into their first term in office and they were warned previously...they are responsible.
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Nice try, but that only werks with kooks on the left.

.
 
Cheney's big defense of his and Bush's incompetence seems to be that they left a "secret report" for Obama, and if he had followed their "advice", we wouldn't be having these problems in Afghanistan. They had 8 years to get things sorted out over there, and instead of solving anything, made it worse through neglect. Their "advice" based on "experience" is worthless, and I completely understand why the current administration says they had to start over in Afghanistan.
 
goldendog said:
So soon into the new Presidents term is it legitimate not to blame the CURRENT situation on the ground in Afghanistan on the prior adminstraions stand off policy reguarding that war? As it stand now the situation was born from past policies was it not?
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its been another week. What is obama's decision.It's his war now.......
 
Reverend_Hellh0und said:
its been another week. What is obama's decision.It's his war now.......
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You posted on this thread last a week ago? I think in reality only the weekend has gone bye Rev. So it's nine months in. Are you one that thinks that Obama is responsible for everything that has happened reguardless of past failed policies?
 
goldendog said:
You posted on this thread last a week ago? I think in reality only the weekend has gone bye Rev. So it's nine months in. Are you one that thinks that Obama is responsible for everything that has happened reguardless of past failed policies?
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Nope, I think he is the one fiddling while troops are being shot at. I think he is the one who is more interested in ending don't ask dont tell, than he is interested in making a decision on the war.


He's a pathetic president, and getting more pathetic by the minute.
 
Reverend_Hellh0und said:
Nope, I think he is the one fiddling while troops are being shot at. I think he is the one who is more interested in ending don't ask dont tell, than he is interested in making a decision on the war.


He's a pathetic president, and getting more pathetic by the minute.
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So I would assume that the Previous President and VP are responsible for certain things that happened on their watch 9 months in and no past policies were relevant to those act committed on Bush and Cheney's watch.
If they didn't have a stated comphensive plan then they sure the hell should have seeing though they were warned by several sources of impending attacks withing the US.

If Obama is going to be held to those standards then it only makes sense to apply the same logic to the failures of the Bush/Cheney adminstration on 9-11. Aren't we still in Afghanistan to avenge the 9-11 attacks 6 years later. Having to fight a built up taliban and deal with the setbacks of a corrupt Bush install puppet goverment which led to recent election fraud.
 
goldendog said:
So I would assume that the Previous President and VP are responsible for certain things that happened on their watch 9 months in and no past policies were relevant to those act committed on Bush and Cheney's watch.
If they didn't have a stated comphensive plan then they sure the hell should have seeing though they were warned by several sources of impending attacks withing the US.

If Obama is going to be held to those standards then it only makes sense to apply the same logic to the failures of the Bush/Cheney adminstration on 9-11. Aren't we still in Afghanistan to avenge the 9-11 attacks 6 years later. Having to fight a built up taliban and deal with the setbacks of a corrupt Bush install puppet goverment which led to recent election fraud.
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I've always stated that there was blame to go all around for 9-11. Your strawman is teh FAIL :lol:
 
Reverend_Hellh0und said:
I've always stated that there was blame to go all around for 9-11. Your strawman is teh FAIL :lol:
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Is there not plenty of blame to go around in the current day Afghan situation..seeing though they were born from past failed polices and taking a hands off stance for 6 years.

So Obama's responsible for it all 9 months in and Bush and Cheney aren't...really Rev trying to have it both ways is really a losing prospect.

Can't be done.
 
goldendog said:
Is there not plenty of blame to go around in the current day Afghan situation..seeing though they were born from past failed polices and taking a hands off stance for 6 years.

So Obama's responsible for it all 9 months in and Bush and Cheney aren't...really Rev trying to have it both ways is really a losing prospect.

Can't be done.
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When did I say bush and cheney were not responsible. This is yet another strawman.


Link and quote please, or try to stay honest, ok?
 
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