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Ridge accuses Bush White House of political use of terror alert system

Would you please point out the terrorist attacks on US soil after 9/11?

Maybe it's true, only Bush could keep us safe... everyone knows Libs are very weak on defence.

No terrorist attacks on US soil after 9/11 is a meaningless statement. Without knowing why, we have no way of knowing who to give credit to. I suppose we can give Bush credit for only one big terrorist attack on US soil, but that is hardly worth glowing praise.

And then we get to the "every one knows" argument. What every one knows is, somehow, wrong a surprising amount of the time, as it is in this case. Remember, it was a republican who came up with the phrase "peace dividend".
 
No terrorist attacks on US soil after 9/11 is a meaningless statement. Without knowing why, we have no way of knowing who to give credit to. I suppose we can give Bush credit for only one big terrorist attack on US soil, but that is hardly worth glowing praise.

Maybe they just decided to take an extended vacation. :roll:
And then we get to the "every one knows" argument. What every one knows is, somehow, wrong a surprising amount of the time, as it is in this case. Remember, it was a republican who came up with the phrase "peace dividend".

On Sunday, Democratic delegates convening in Denver were prayed over by representatives of various faiths. One stood out: Ingrid Mattson, president of the Islamic Society of North America. With this choice, Barak Obama's campaign has committed a strategic error of the first order.

After all, the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA) has been identified by the Department of Justice not only as a front for the Muslim Brotherhood - a global Islamist movement with the stated mission in America of "destroying Western civilization from within." Worse yet, it has also been named as an unindicted co-conspirator in the United States' largest alleged terrorism financing conspiracy.

Like other Brotherhood operations, ISNA's purpose is to promote what might be called "soft jihad" - the task of steadily insinuating the brutally repressive and subversive program the Islamists call Shariah through da'wa, proselytizing and social networking.

The more one learns about Dr. Mattson and her organization, the more questions will be raised about Barak Obama's judgment and that of his party in affording them a prominent role in the 2008 Democratic convention. For example:

The Democrats 'Soft' Jihadist

PHOENIX — Democratic presidential candidate Joe Lieberman (search) unleashed a torrent of attacks Wednesday, but this time, not all were directed at President Bush.

Much of the Connecticut senator's ire was aimed at his top rivals.

"The anti-tax-cut, soft-on-defense, big-spending Democrats will take the Democratic Party to the edge and maybe over," Lieberman told Fox News while campaigning at a state-of-the-art job training center in Phoenix

FOXNews.com - Lieberman Calls Dem Opponents Soft Spendthrifts - Politics | Republican Party | Democratic Party | Political Spectrum

After all, Democrats’ “soft on defense” image played a key role in driving millions of blue collar voters (as well as a small but influential band of Cold War liberals later called neoconservatives) into the GOP’s arms. With the possible exception of race, no issue did more to perpetuate the Republican near-stranglehold on the White House—which began in 1968 and seems to have ended in 2008.

Democratic Strategist

I could go on for hours, but I think I've made my point.
 

Were we getting attacks every single day before 9/11? Maybe we were getting them weekly? Monthly? No? Because to my knowledge large scale attacks on U.S. soil by foreign terrorist are rare occurrences. So rare in fact that most people could name at least the last 4 or 5 and have intervals of 5-10 years between them.
 
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Would you please point out the terrorist attacks on US soil after 9/11?
That's a double edged sword for an argument. The rabbit hole goes very deep.

Maybe it's true, only Bush could keep us safe... everyone knows Libs are very weak on defence.
No, it's not "true." How many terrorist attacks have there been on U.S. soil since Barack Obama has been President? Well then....there you go...Libs are very strong on national security and defense.
 
Hmmm, so somehow discussing these new facts will take away our addressing the present? Give me a break.

Everybody, stop commenting on this subject matter RIGHT NOW because danarhea says so. :roll:

With all due respect, aps (And I do give you plenty of respect. You and I go back a long way.), I was totally disgusted with the Clinton Penis Envy shown by Republicans when Bush was screwing up. I am hoping to avoid the same thing, now that Obama is in office. I don't mean that we should forget the crap Bush did while in office, but finger pointing at Bush, while Obama is in charge, isn't going to cut it for me, just as finger pointing at Clinton didn't cut it for me when Bush was in office. Obama is the chief in the here and now, and when he screws up, we ought to speak out about it.
 
Was the terror alert raised or is he claiming he was pressured but didn't do it? If he was pressured he should have said so at the time vs. waiting to sell the info in his new book.

He claims he was pressured but didn't raise the alert level & I agree that the time to say something was then. However, that doesn't change the fact that, if he's proven right, it was yet another attempt by the Bush Admin. to politicize the whole Exec. branch in violation of law.
 
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He claims he was pressured but didn't raise the alert level & I agree that the time to say something was then. However, that doesn't change the fact that, if he's proven right, it was yet another attempt by the Bush Admin. to politicize the whole Exec. branch in violation of law.

Yeah, if it's true it's completely wrong. However it sucks that we can only choose to believe him or not without ever knowing for sure. It is supposed to be the most exciting bit of information in his entire book. It is the line that the book is going to be marketed with. It's basically the selling point. Probably he's not lying, but I can't know that and it sort of pisses me off. He should have said something THEN vs now when saying something scandalous earns him money. If his book didn't have that tidbit it probably wouldn't sell as well. How would they market it, then?

The whole situation disgusts me frankly.
 
Yeah, if it's true it's completely wrong. However it sucks that we can only choose to believe him or not without ever knowing for sure. It is supposed to be the most exciting bit of information in his entire book. It is the line that the book is going to be marketed with. It's basically the selling point. Probably he's not lying, but I can't know that and it sort of pisses me off. He should have said something THEN vs now when saying something scandalous earns him money. If his book didn't have that tidbit it probably wouldn't sell as well. How would they market it, then?

The whole situation disgusts me frankly.

I pretty much agree with you & hate it when people only release info to sell a book. If the info is true, it's usually too late to do any good if you wait years until you can sell your story.

That being said, from all I know of Tom Ridge, he's a stand-up guy & I believe his story...which can either be corroberated or refuted by others. I believe him but lost any respect for him due to waiting until he could SELL the info.
 
I pretty much agree with you & hate it when people only release info to sell a book. If the info is true, it's usually too late to do any good if you wait years until you can sell your story.

That being said, from all I know of Tom Ridge, he's a stand-up guy & I believe his story...which can either be corroberated or refuted by others. I believe him but lost any respect for him due to waiting until he could SELL the info.

Has anyone collaborated with his story? Frances Townsend doesn't and others have dismissed it out of hand.

I don't know the guy at all so I have no idea if he's a stand up guy or not. I'm not sure how "stand up" it is to release info such as this as a marketing scheme for your book.
 
Has anyone collaborated with his story? Frances Townsend doesn't and others have dismissed it out of hand.

I don't know the guy at all so I have no idea if he's a stand up guy or not. I'm not sure how "stand up" it is to release info such as this as a marketing scheme for your book.

I have not yet heard any corroboration, though I don't consider that surprising. There just are not many who would be able to corroborate it.

It's certainly sad that people do stuff like this to sell books, but hardly uncommon. I sometimes doubt we will ever find a really moral public official.
 
I have not yet heard any corroboration, though I don't consider that surprising. There just are not many who would be able to corroborate it.

It's certainly sad that people do stuff like this to sell books, but hardly uncommon. I sometimes doubt we will ever find a really moral public official.

We need better investigative reporters to get to the bottom of some of this crap while it's happening. Seems today much of journalism has been reduced to he said/she said with little to no real old fashioned investigation.
 
We need better investigative reporters to get to the bottom of some of this crap while it's happening. Seems today much of journalism has been reduced to he said/she said with little to no real old fashioned investigation.

No kidding. When was the last really important scandal broken by the media? Or that was really advanced by the media? Reporters need to go watch All The President's Men a few times...
 
Has anyone collaborated with his story? Frances Townsend doesn't and others have dismissed it out of hand.

I don't know the guy at all so I have no idea if he's a stand up guy or not. I'm not sure how "stand up" it is to release info such as this as a marketing scheme for your book.

FWIW, he wasn't the one who released this info - it was the company publishing his book. There are quotes from Ridge and the book itself that directly contradict the claim advanced by the publisher.
 
Has anyone collaborated with his story? Frances Townsend doesn't and others have dismissed it out of hand.

I don't know the guy at all so I have no idea if he's a stand up guy or not. I'm not sure how "stand up" it is to release info such as this as a marketing scheme for your book.

Problem is..(unless people are really stupid) when they engage in criminal activity they don't usually record/transcribe their crimes, unless their name is Nixon. If the meetings where this alleged crime was committed was recorded or transcribed, we will get our proof. Lack of such proof doesn't prove it didn't happen.
 
He claims he was pressured but didn't raise the alert level & I agree that the time to say something was then. However, that doesn't change the fact that, if he's proven right, it was yet another attempt by the Bush Admin. to politicize the whole Exec. branch in violation of law.
What Ridge actually said is different from the title of this thread. You and others need to read his comments and you would've already if you'd been reading the thread.
 
We need better investigative reporters to get to the bottom of some of this crap while it's happening. Seems today much of journalism has been reduced to he said/she said with little to no real old fashioned investigation.
They investigated the hell out of Joe the plumber.
 
What Ridge actually said is different from the title of this thread. You and others need to read his comments and you would've already if you'd been reading the thread.

So the linked article posted by the OP is inaccurate when it says this?

In his new book, the first Homeland Security chief, Tom Ridge, accuses top aides to President George W. Bush of pressing him to raise the terror alert level to influence the 2004 presidential election.
 
So the linked article posted by the OP is inaccurate when it says this?

In his new book, the first Homeland Security chief, Tom Ridge, accuses top aides to President George W. Bush of pressing him to raise the terror alert level to influence the 2004 presidential election.
That quote contradicts Ridge's comment, which was already posted in this thread.

There's a second point here which is also huge. Some people in this thread (including the title) are claiming that this actually changed the terror level. That also isn't true.
 
That quote contradicts Ridge's comment, which was already posted in this thread.
Repost it here please.

There's a second point here which is also huge. Some people in this thread (including the title) are claiming that this actually changed the terror level. That also isn't true.
I don't know any credible source who said that. Certainly not Ridge, & the topic title makes no such claim.
 
Repost it here please.


I don't know any credible source who said that. Certainly not Ridge, & the topic title makes no such claim.
It's somewhere in this thread.

The title of this thread does indeed make that claim and someone claimed that it changed the outcome of the election.
 
Problem is..(unless people are really stupid) when they engage in criminal activity they don't usually record/transcribe their crimes, unless their name is Nixon. If the meetings where this alleged crime was committed was recorded or transcribed, we will get our proof. Lack of such proof doesn't prove it didn't happen.

Also, God, the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus and Leprechauns also exist.
 
Problem is..(unless people are really stupid) when they engage in criminal activity they don't usually record/transcribe their crimes, unless their name is Nixon. If the meetings where this alleged crime was committed was recorded or transcribed, we will get our proof. Lack of such proof doesn't prove it didn't happen.
Ridge didn't accuse anyone of a crime.
 
Ridge didn't accuse anyone of a crime.

He certainly did. It's a felony for federal employees (like the AG) to use their official powers for political purposes. It's a Hatch Act violation, for starters. (trying to get Ridge to use the Alert status of the U.S. to help Bush get reelected is a crime, whether the actual act was done or not)
 
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