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White House Launches Web Site to Battle Health Care 'Rumors'

Considering at least some republicans have made it clear they are opposing it to play politics with President Obama("Obama's Waterloo"), that would explain at least part of it. The other part is that congress is doing the right thing and taking it's time with a very complicated piece of legislation.

Vicchio doesn't care. He just wants it defeated because it's Obama's health care bill. A Republican could introduce a similar bill (not far-fetched if you understand the concessions given to the big drug companies in the current bill) and the far-right partisans would be singing its praise.

They don't care what the bills says or discussing pros/cons point by point--they don't like it because Sean and Rush told them they're not supposed to like it.

One of my favorite quotes from a town hall screamer: "Keep your big government hands off my medicare."

Go, grandpa! Way to exercise your right to sound like an complete idiot.
 
Bush lied. Cheney lied. Palin lied. Rush is lying. Conservatives are lying.

Blah, blah, blah.

This is always your recourse when you're cornered. It's right up there with I-know-you-are-but-what-am-I?

That light at the end of the tunnel is a train. The stock market is jumping not because the economy is improving (unemployment is still horrible); it's because Obama's agenda is in trouble and capitalism is growing optimistic again.

It's tiime to abandon the childish tactics of the 60s, stop demonizing everything this country was founded on, and open your eyes to what is real, and what is propaganda. Heil, Obama!

Please, don't act like everyone who votes democrat is this hyper-partisan. I agree, Bush lies, Cheney lies, Rush lies....but it's also true that Obama lies, Clinton lies, Olbermann lies.

The fact is this country has been going downhill for quite sometime, and reform is needed not in the way of health care, but the entire system in general. Corruption runs rampant in both parties and is in fact perpetuated by the fact that one side must always be right while the other is wrong. I don't agree with either party, but am forced into choosing a lesser of two evils every time. The problem is I unfortunately see us going further and further down the rabbit hole as time goes on.

PS...the Hitler jokes are just as immature when used against Obama as when used against Bush. Connections can be made between any two people. I'm quite certain one could compare Ghandi to Hitler in some way shape or form, but until one starts to do the terrible things that he has done, let's lay off the ridiculous comparisons? Thanks! :2wave:
 
Vicchio doesn't care. He just wants it defeated because it's Obama's health care bill. A Republican could introduce a similar bill (not far-fetched if you understand the concessions given to the big drug companies in the current bill) and the far-right partisans would be singing its praise.

They don't care what the bills says or discussing pros/cons point by point--they don't like it because Sean and Rush told them they're not supposed to like it.

One of my favorite quotes from a town hall screamer: "Keep your big government hands off my medicare."

Go, grandpa! Way to exercise your right to sound like an complete idiot.

"Keep your big government hands off my medicare" - :rofl

How about the one where everyone raised their hands to protest "Socialist Healthcare", then raised their hands when asked if they use Medicare or Medicaid?

When push comes to shove, let us see how many would really vote to end "Socialist Healthcare" like Medicare and Medicaid. Let's have the government completely stop all payment next year, not a single dime will be paid out. Let's see how long these bastions of anti-Socialism hold out? Simply pathetic how ignorant people are. And we are suppose to listen to these morons?

Looking at the crowd of people, you can quite easily see these are not the Rolls Royce driving elites, best of luck to them when we end these socialist healthcare initiatives.
 
....Connections can be made between any two people. I'm quite certain one could compare Ghandi to Hitler in some way shape or form, but until one starts to do the terrible things that he has done, let's lay off the ridiculous comparisons? Thanks! :2wave:

You know we could also connect Kevin Bacon to Hitler.....should we fear Footloose 2?
 
Vicchio doesn't care. He just wants it defeated because it's Obama's health care bill. A Republican could introduce a similar bill (not far-fetched if you understand the concessions given to the big drug companies in the current bill) and the far-right partisans would be singing its praise.

They don't care what the bills says or discussing pros/cons point by point--they don't like it because Sean and Rush told them they're not supposed to like it.

One of my favorite quotes from a town hall screamer: "Keep your big government hands off my medicare."

Go, grandpa! Way to exercise your right to sound like an complete idiot.



Actually, no Haz, I'm against BIG GOVERNMENT in our lives. I don't care if JESUS proposed it, I would be against it.

I was against the Bail Outs, I thought McCain was an IDIOT for running back to DC to "help broker" them.

You fail in your attempt to smear me.
 
Actually, no Haz, I'm against BIG GOVERNMENT in our lives. I don't care if JESUS proposed it, I would be against it.

I was against the Bail Outs, I thought McCain was an IDIOT for running back to DC to "help broker" them.

You fail in your attempt to smear me.

Just curious Vich.....are you for or against "Big Government" in social issues such as gay marriage, reproductive freedom, etc.?
 
Vicchio doesn't care. He just wants it defeated because it's Obama's health care bill. A Republican could introduce a similar bill (not far-fetched if you understand the concessions given to the big drug companies in the current bill) and the far-right partisans would be singing its praise.

They don't care what the bills says or discussing pros/cons point by point--they don't like it because Sean and Rush told them they're not supposed to like it.

One of my favorite quotes from a town hall screamer: "Keep your big government hands off my medicare."

Go, grandpa! Way to exercise your right to sound like an complete idiot.

tell it to baucus, the cbo, the bluedogs

tell it to dem governors bill richardson, christine gregoire, bill ritter and phil bredesen, who called "the mother of unfunded mandates" the white house's attempt to sluff off its medicare responsibilities on the already bankrupt 50

tell it to maxine waters and lynn woolsey, loudly and angrily voicing threats from the progressive posse

tell it to the freshmen, kicking back, 2/3 of them from districts which voted for mccain

tell it to DICK DURBIN on yesterday's john king---he's the liberal WHIP and close associate of obama who declared his "openness" to CUTTING the public option

the gop has nothing to do with this

maxine waters, and she's dumb as a rock, was right---had pelosi/obama done health care before their fatally foolish foray into cap and trade, a fiasco, we wouldn't be where we are today

this is the most POLITICALLY INEPT white house in american history

it has nothing to do with tea, radio, state farm insurance, fishies, grampas or astroturf

tell it to dnc chair howard dean who's launched ATTACK ads against prominent BLUE senators dorgan, pryor, bayh, landrieu, nelson, nelson, conrad, lincoln and others

tell it to the dem-appointed mathematician doug elmendorf

or, instead, you could continue to focus on mr v---LOLOL!
 
Just curious Vich.....are you for or against "Big Government" in social issues such as gay marriage, reproductive freedom, etc.?

Let's see.....the national government has no authority in matters of marriage or baby-killing, so by definition, one is for smaller government for opposing federal intrusion in those areas..


...wow...you know what? The federal government doesn't have any authority to interfere in health care matters, either.
 
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White House Launches Web Site to Battle Health Care 'Rumors'

How in the hell are they going to dispell Obamacare rumors, when they can't tell us anything to begin with? Anything the White House tells is a rumor. PBO has already admitted that doesn't have the first clue what's in the bill.
 
You know we could also connect Kevin Bacon to Hitler.....should we fear Footloose 2?

* Adolf Hitler was in Rio Rita (1942) with Julian Rivero
* Julian Rivero was in Broken Lance (1954) with Robert Wagner
* Robert Wagner was in Wild Things (1998) with Kevin Bacon

But regardless of any connection, I believe that ALL of us should fear Footloose 2 ;)
 
* Adolf Hitler was in Rio Rita (1942) with Julian Rivero
* Julian Rivero was in Broken Lance (1954) with Robert Wagner
* Robert Wagner was in Wild Things (1998) with Kevin Bacon

But regardless of any connection, I believe that ALL of us should fear Footloose 2 ;)

Well, Robert Wagner was a Nazi. You may have a good point.
 
Just curious Vich.....are you for or against "Big Government" in social issues such as gay marriage, reproductive freedom, etc.?

Does Gay Marriage require the Govt to spend tons of money?

Nope. So I could really care less.

Abortion is a diff matter I won't let you drag this into, NICE TRY THOUGH.
 
Does Gay Marriage require the Govt to spend tons of money?


Of course it does. Since the government denied them the right to get married, the government owes them reparations. Tax money should be used to pay for not only the wedding, but the honeymoon and the cost of the divorce. I'm sure the government will pay the child support based on the notion that gays shouldn't have ever gotten married, to begin with.
 
You fail in your attempt to smear me.

Vicchio, you take care of that all on your own.

If your posts weren't so far-right fringe hyper-partisan and you made some attempt to work with the facts related to an issue, then maybe I could respond seriously.

But how does one prove to the clown-mime that there is no wall? Or rope? Or box?

It's all a performance. IMO.
 
How in the hell are they going to dispell Obamacare rumors, when they can't tell us anything to begin with? Anything the White House tells is a rumor. PBO has already admitted that doesn't have the first clue what's in the bill.

Well if there is a specific point of contention, point it out and dispute it. Show your sources, credible ones at that. But you now fall right into the same group as Palin, Beck, and co. and being capable of only telling lies, but not refuting them. Is there anything equal to Kill Granny and Big Govt. will be accessing your checking account? Euthanasia, govt. will decide who gets treatment, illegals will free healthcare, everyone will lose their coverage, and other nonsense.
 
Well if there is a specific point of contention, point it out and dispute it. Show your sources, credible ones at that. But you now fall right into the same group as Palin, Beck, and co. and being capable of only telling lies, but not refuting them. Is there anything equal to Kill Granny and Big Govt. will be accessing your checking account? Euthanasia, govt. will decide who gets treatment, illegals will free healthcare, everyone will lose their coverage, and other nonsense.

A point of contention? With a supporting source? Credible ones, at that? No ****? This has certainly been a Monday; broke a winch line, blowed out a tire, broke a tie-rod end, lost a load, pissed off one of my pards over nothing and cut off a finger, again. But, it's posts like this make it all ok.

Here's my problem. I don't believe that I should be forced to pay all this money, just to keep the welfare class in insurance. They already have damn medicare and medicaid that I'm paying for. Enough is-a-goddamn-enough.

As it stands, now, I will owe the government somewhere around $14,000 a year, aside from the rest of my expenses, fees and taxes. That's just nuts.

Anyone who owns a small business, or works for a small business should be very concerned about this bill. This is going to cost more jobs.

SEC. 411. ELECTION TO SATISFY HEALTH COVERAGE PARTICIPATION REQUIREMENTS.
(a) In General- Chapter 43 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 is amended by adding at the end the following new section:
`SEC. 4980H. ELECTION WITH RESPECT TO HEALTH COVERAGE PARTICIPATION REQUIREMENTS.
`(a) Election of Employer Responsibility To Provide Health Coverage-
`(1) IN GENERAL- Subsection (b) shall apply to any employer with respect to whom an election under paragraph (2) is in effect.
`(2) TIME AND MANNER- An employer may make an election under this paragraph at such time and in such form and manner as the Secretary may prescribe.
`(3) AFFILIATED GROUPS- In the case of any employer which is part of a group of employers who are treated as a single employer under subsection (b), (c), (m), or (o) of section 414, the election under paragraph (2) shall be made by such person as the Secretary may provide. Any such election, once made, shall apply to all members of such group.
`(4) SEPARATE ELECTIONS- Under regulations prescribed by the Secretary, separate elections may be made under paragraph (2) with respect to–
`(A) separate lines of business, and
`(B) full-time employees and employees who are not full-time employees.
`(5) TERMINATION OF ELECTION IN CASES OF SUBSTANTIAL NONCOMPLIANCE- The Secretary may terminate the election of any employer under paragraph (2) if the Secretary (in coordination with the Health Choices Commissioner) determines that such employer is in substantial noncompliance with the health coverage participation requirements.
`(b) Excise Tax With Respect to Failure To Meet Health Coverage Participation Requirements-
`(1) IN GENERAL- In the case of any employer who fails (during any period with respect to which the election under subsection (a) is in effect) to satisfy the health coverage participation requirements with respect to any employee to whom such election applies, there is hereby imposed on each such failure with respect to each such employee a tax of $100 for each day in the period beginning on the date such failure first occurs and ending on the date such failure is corrected.
`(2) LIMITATIONS ON AMOUNT OF TAX-
`(A) TAX NOT TO APPLY WHERE FAILURE NOT DISCOVERED EXERCISING REASONABLE DILIGENCE- No tax shall be imposed by paragraph (1) on any failure during any period for which it is established to the satisfaction of the Secretary that the employer neither knew, nor exercising reasonable diligence would have known, that such failure existed.
`(B) TAX NOT TO APPLY TO FAILURES CORRECTED WITHIN 30 DAYS- No tax shall be imposed by paragraph (1) on any failure if–
`(i) such failure was due to reasonable cause and not to willful neglect, and
`(ii) such failure is corrected during the 30-day period beginning on the 1st date that the employer knew, or exercising reasonable diligence would have known, that such failure existed.
`(C) OVERALL LIMITATION FOR UNINTENTIONAL FAILURES- In the case of failures which are due to reasonable cause and not to willful neglect, the tax imposed by subsection (a) for failures during the taxable year of the employer shall not exceed the amount equal to the lesser of–
`(i) 10 percent of the aggregate amount paid or incurred by the employer (or predecessor employer) during the preceding taxable year for employment-based health plans, or
`(ii) $500,000.

SEC. 412. RESPONSIBILITIES OF NONELECTING EMPLOYERS.
(a) In General- Section 3111 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 is amended by redesignating subsection (c) as subsection (d) and by inserting after subsection (b) the following new subsection:
`(c) Employers Electing to Not Provide Health Benefits-
`(1) IN GENERAL- In addition to other taxes, there is hereby imposed on every nonelecting employer an excise tax, with respect to having individuals in his employ, equal to 8 percent of the wages (as defined in section 3121(a)) paid by him with respect to employment (as defined in section 3121(b)).
`(2) SPECIAL RULES FOR SMALL EMPLOYERS-
`(A) IN GENERAL- In the case of any employer who is small employer for any calendar year, paragraph (1) shall be applied by substituting the applicable percentage determined in accordance with the following table for `8 percent’:
———————————————————————————————————————
———————————————————————————————————————
`If the annual payroll of such employer for the preceding calendar year: The applicable percentage is:
Does not exceed $250,000 0 percent
Exceeds $250,000, but does not exceed $300,000 2 percent
Exceeds $300,000, but does not exceed $350,000 4 percent
Exceeds $350,000, but does not exceed $400,000 6 percent

———————————————————————————————————————
`(B) SMALL EMPLOYER- For purposes of this paragraph, the term `small employer’ means any employer for any calendar year if the annual payroll of such employer for the preceding calendar year does not exceed $400,000.
`(C) ANNUAL PAYROLL- For purposes of this paragraph, the term `annual payroll’ means, with respect to any employer for any calendar year, the aggregate wages (as defined in section 3121(a)) paid by him with respect to employment (as defined in section 3121(b)) during such calendar year.
`(3) NONELECTING EMPLOYER- For purposes of paragraph (1), the term `nonelecting employer’ means any employer for any period with respect to which such employer does not have an election under section 4980H(a) in effect.
`(4) SPECIAL RULE FOR SEPARATE ELECTIONS- In the case of an employer who makes a separate election described in section 4980H(a)(4) for any period, paragraph (1) shall be applied for such period by taking into account only the wages paid to employees who are not subject to such election.
 
Let's paraphrase, so those with partisan goggles on can better see things for what they are.

White House practices free speech and answers critics of health care reform. -- that's the story, right? That's the BREAKING NEWS story. That the WH is putting information on the internet for people to evaluate. This thread seems to be about the fact that they are doing this. Answering questions. Answering their critics. Exercising, what is called again...? Oh, yeah... Free speech.

Goddamn them and their free speech!! How dare they respond to critics in a thoughtful and appropriate way. Bastards!:roll::roll:

And guess what, Vicchio, we are all free to research, read, and fact check on our own. Of course the WH is making a hard sell, but when you go to any legitimate, non-partisan fact check site on the internet, you'll see that there are pros and cons to the bill.

But how can we make up our own minds when Rush has already told us what to think!

But, hell, let's just yell and scream out as many talking points until they give up and go home. Free speech, right?

If you lie loud enough, it becomes true. It's even better if you do it for 4 hours a day on AM radio.
 
None of the Libbos dare address the info I posted. Should I be at all surprised by that?
 
Does Gay Marriage require the Govt to spend tons of money?

Nope. So I could really care less.

Abortion is a diff matter I won't let you drag this into, NICE TRY THOUGH.

I wasn't trying to "drag you in"....I was honestly just curious how you felt about those particular issues. Its always an interesting dichotomy for many people. In the same way as Abortion and Capital Punishment often present conflicting ethical issues.
 
A point of contention? With a supporting source? Credible ones, at that? No ****? This has certainly been a Monday; broke a winch line, blowed out a tire, broke a tie-rod end, lost a load, pissed off one of my pards over nothing and cut off a finger, again. But, it's posts like this make it all ok.

Here's my problem. I don't believe that I should be forced to pay all this money, just to keep the welfare class in insurance. They already have damn medicare and medicaid that I'm paying for. Enough is-a-goddamn-enough.

As it stands, now, I will owe the government somewhere around $14,000 a year, aside from the rest of my expenses, fees and taxes. That's just nuts.

Anyone who owns a small business, or works for a small business should be very concerned about this bill. This is going to cost more jobs.

Wow. Thanks for showing us your valued and oh so complex cards. Amazing. I would love to see how the bill is bad for small business. Seems to be something that people shrill about, but I've yet to see solid evidence that lowering health care prices would hurt small businesses.

How is it going to cost more jobs exactly? You see, Sam asked you for specifics but all you did was tell us about your bad day and then whine. When you have evidence for your shrill cries of wolf, let us know.

Lastly, by saying there is a "welfare class," you also show your disdain for the poor. It's obvious that you have the false point of view that they all have the straps to pull up on their boots.

Do you not have a house, food on your table, luxuries? I get tired of American's whining about how rich they are because they never realize how much they truly are rich.
 
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If this health care plan was so great then why isn't every single politician that is wanting it guaranteeing that they will join it as soon as it is passed? I think that alone would sway a lot of people.
 
Wow. Thanks for showing us your valued and oh so complex cards. Amazing. I would love to see how the bill is bad for small business. Seems to be something that people shrill about, but I've yet to see solid evidence that lowering health care prices would hurt small businesses.

How is it going to cost more jobs exactly? You see, Sam asked you for specifics but all you did was tell us about your bad day and then whine. When you have evidence for your shrill cries of wolf, let us know.

Lastly, by saying there is a "welfare class," you also show your disdain for the poor. It's obvious that you have the false point of view that they all have the straps to pull up on their boots.

Do you not have a house, food on your table, luxuries? I get tired of American's whining about how rich they are because they never realize how much they truly are rich.

You didn't even read the two sections that I posted, or you don't have a clue about what you read, or how businesses work. Which is it?

What do you do for a living and how much money do you make? Please, tell me you're not another punk kid that doesn't work and has even less experience about how thing work in the real world.

I come from a family of 12. My mom was a secretary and my dad was an oilfield hand, so spare me the downtrodden po' folks BS. Fair enough?
 
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I wasn't trying to "drag you in"....I was honestly just curious how you felt about those particular issues. Its always an interesting dichotomy for many people. In the same way as Abortion and Capital Punishment often present conflicting ethical issues.

Okay, that' different then.

I think the Feds should say out of both.

If Cali want Steve and Adam to marry, aces. If they think 12 year old girls should get abortions without telling Mom and Dad, well that's Cali's business.

However, that also mean if Texas rejects those two.. it should be left alone.

Abortion and Capital Punishment aren't even in the same ball bark... it only causes problems for those with built in guilt complexes.
 
Okay, that' different then.

I think the Feds should say out of both.

If Cali want Steve and Adam to marry, aces. If they think 12 year old girls should get abortions without telling Mom and Dad, well that's Cali's business.

However, that also mean if Texas rejects those two.. it should be left alone.

Abortion and Capital Punishment aren't even in the same ball bark... it only causes problems for those with built in guilt complexes.

I can understand your position. The problem that it presents for me is that when you have different standards for different states it complicates things. If Steve and Adam get married in California and move to Colorado...all of a sudden they aren't married? But Dick and Jane can move to Colorado and still be married? Seems like an equal protection problem to me.

Same thing with abortion. Making it legal in one state and illegal in another doesn't affect the woman who can afford to travel to another state to have an abortion, but it does affect those who can't.

Seems to me that it should either be illegal or not.


As for abortion and capital punishment not being in the same league. I guess it all depends on how you interpret "thou shalt not kill" if you are at all religious. Certainly in Capital Punishment you are killing a human being. In abortion, if you believe that life as a human being begins at birth than you are killing as well. Either way you are killing if you accept that premise. Not exactly different ball parks.
 
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