No healthcare reform vote before autumn: Obama

No healthcare reform vote before autumn: Obama

President Barack Obama said Wednesday there will be no vote on his proposed reforms of the US healthcare system before autumn, a setback that is costing him more political capital with each passing day.

"This bill, even in the best-case scenario, will not be signed -- we won't even vote on it probably until the end of September or the middle of October," he said in a session here to muster public support for the reforms.

Click to expand...

Looks like the deal cut with the Blue Dogs might not be all that helpful--the health care reform proposals are still hemorrhaging popularity in and out of Congress.

Jim DeMint might end up calling it exactly....this bill is turning into Dear Leader's Waterloo.

(one can only hope)

Glad to hear it. This large of a project needs more than just a month or two of review.

The longer this takes the better. There will be time to carefully scrutinize this massive mess that even John Conyers admitted he doesn't know what's in it and needs more lawyers to read it and interpret it for him.

Yes folks, you just cannot fabricate the clown like atmosphere that now dominates American politics thanks to these buttclowns who now infest the Government. :rofl

Regardless of whether this passes or not, and I hope it doesn't personally, time IS a good thing.

There is absolutely, positively, ZERO reason this thing has to be passed NOW like Obama and his administration were trying to push it except for extremely "politics as usual", partisan, political reasons.

A bill like this should take a while to work through, and its telling as to the importance not to the country but to the legacy/viability of Barack Obama and the questiaonble content of it that this thing was attempted to be pushed and shoved through at light speed.

Gibberish said:

Glad to hear it. This large of a project needs more than just a month or two of review.

Click to expand...

Republicans have been quite open about the fact that "delay" is code for "kill". They don't want time for "review", they want time to rally the misinformation machine and kill the bill. If they actually cared about fixing the H.C. system, Repubs would get behind the only decent alternative proposal to emerge from their ranks- the Wyden plan.

Does that mean it's going to be October before I can sign up for my free insurance?

Cassandra said:

Republicans have been quite open about the fact that "delay" is code for "kill". They don't want time for "review", they want time to rally the misinformation machine and kill the bill. If they actually cared about fixing the H.C. system, Repubs would get behind the only decent alternative proposal to emerge from their ranks- the Wyden plan.

Click to expand...

"Kill" is good.

I don't need health care destruction, myself, and can't imagine why anyone else would want to destroy the nation's health care industry, either.

Why do you want it destroyed?

Cassandra said:

Republicans have been quite open about the fact that "delay" is code for "kill". They don't want time for "review", they want time to rally the misinformation machine and kill the bill. If they actually cared about fixing the H.C. system, Repubs would get behind the only decent alternative proposal to emerge from their ranks- the Wyden plan.

Click to expand...

You do understand that the Republicans can do nothing about this? Right? The Dems could have passed it last January if they wanted to. They could have passed it this week without a single Republican vote.

No, the Democrats have a HUGE public relations problem with this, and several will be voted out of office for passing it. That is why there is a delay.

Zyphlin said:

Regardless of whether this passes or not, and I hope it doesn't personally, time IS a good thing.

There is absolutely, positively, ZERO reason this thing has to be passed NOW like Obama and his administration were trying to push it except for extremely "politics as usual", partisan, political reasons.

A bill like this should take a while to work through, and its telling as to the importance not to the country but to the legacy/viability of Barack Obama and the questiaonble content of it that this thing was attempted to be pushed and shoved through at light speed.

Click to expand...

But ZOMG WTF, don't you care about THE CHILDREN!!!??!!???!

Some cancer patient might die today in an alley without health coverage if we don't get this passed right now. :lol:

Erod said:

You do understand that the Republicans can do nothing about this? Right? The Dems could have passed it last January if they wanted to. They could have passed it this week without a single Republican vote.

No, the Democrats have a HUGE public relations problem with this, and several will be voted out of office for passing it. That is why there is a delay.

Click to expand...

I am constantly amused when Liberals or Democrats attempt to claim that Republicans are responsible if this bill doesn't pass. :rofl

Erod said:

You do understand that the Republicans can do nothing about this? Right? The Dems could have passed it last January if they wanted to. They could have passed it this week without a single Republican vote.

No, the Democrats have a HUGE public relations problem with this, and several will be voted out of office for passing it. That is why there is a delay.

Click to expand...

What I understand is that both parties are awash in campaign contributions from the stake holders in this extremely expensive inefficient patchwork inaccurately dubbed a H.C."system". Now, the Republicans and blue dog dems are suddenly concerned about the deficit?! Where was their concern when they passed the godawful medicare prescription drug bill or the huge tax cuts? Where were the 10 year estimates about the cost of those bills?

The Republicans are all over the media with criticism. I don't see them pushing any courageous alternative plan. I give kudos to Weyden for taking the issue seriously but most politicians will dance with the ones that brought them to the ball.

It actually takes libertarians and progressives to see a courageous stance on something that would save piles of money- allowing the reimportation of pharmaceuticals, for example.

If anything, it is likely that Dems will lose seats if they don't pass a bill. That is what happened after Clinton's failed attempt and that is why Repubs are focused on defeating the bill.

Cassandra said:

What I understand is that both parties are awash in campaign contributions from the stake holders in this extremely expensive inefficient patchwork inaccurately dubbed a H.C."system". Now, the Republicans and blue dog dems are suddenly concerned about the deficit?! Where was their concern when they passed the godawful medicare prescription drug bill or the huge tax cuts? Where were the 10 year estimates about the cost of those bills?

The Republicans are all over the media with criticism. I don't see them pushing any courageous alternative plan. I give kudos to Weyden for taking the issue seriously but most politicians will dance with the ones that brought them to the ball.

It actually takes libertarians and progressives to see a courageous stance on something that would save piles of money- allowing the reimportation of pharmaceuticals, for example.

If anything, it is likely that Dems will lose seats if they don't pass a bill. That is what happened after Clinton's failed attempt and that is why Repubs are focused on defeating the bill.

Click to expand...

The Republicans are supposedly going to introduce their bill tomorrow. The MSM probably won't mention it though.

And conservatives, independents, libertarians, and blue-dog dems aren't in favor of Obama's plan, so I don't see how passing it will help Obama. Only the far left is predominantly for it.

Erod said:

Only the far left is predominantly for it.

Click to expand...

You gotta be kidding? The progressive wing is ready to bolt because (as I understand it) the blue dogs insist on increasing payments for Docs, removing the public option and decreasing H.C. subsidies to low-income families.

Cassandra said:

You gotta be kidding? The progressive wing is ready to bolt because (as I understand it) the blue dogs insist on increasing payments for Docs, removing the public option and decreasing H.C. subsidies to low-income families.

Click to expand...

They are, the progressives are choking on the concessions that have been made so far. They are not happy.

Zyphlin said:

Regardless of whether this passes or not, and I hope it doesn't personally, time IS a good thing.

There is absolutely, positively, ZERO reason this thing has to be passed NOW like Obama and his administration were trying to push it except for extremely "politics as usual", partisan, political reasons.

A bill like this should take a while to work through, and its telling as to the importance not to the country but to the legacy/viability of Barack Obama and the questiaonble content of it that this thing was attempted to be pushed and shoved through at light speed.

Click to expand...

While I disagree as to the importance of the bill, I reluctantly agree that more time is needed and a good thing.

jackalope said:

While I disagree as to the importance of the bill, I reluctantly agree that more time is needed and a good thing.

Click to expand...

We will see. I think special interests will take advantage of the time. Health Care Insurers will spend more of our premium money to bribe senators to do it their way so they can protect their bottom line. The American people will have more time to be scared with lies and made fearful of change. Sad really. I think we do need the time to do this, but I wish the Senators would forgo their August recess and work through it in order to keep the momentum going.

Erod said:

The Republicans are supposedly going to introduce their bill tomorrow. The MSM probably won't mention it though.

And conservatives, independents, libertarians, and blue-dog dems aren't in favor of Obama's plan, so I don't see how passing it will help Obama. Only the far left is predominantly for it.

Click to expand...

I think we are both making the mistake of thinking that FACTS matter to these people; great answer however.

Erod said:

And conservatives, independents, libertarians, and blue-dog dems aren't in favor of Obama's plan, so I don't see how passing it will help Obama. Only the far left is predominantly for it.

Click to expand...

Has it escaped everyone's attention that Dear Leader doesn't even have a plan? He has a wish list, not a plan. He wants "reform", but has no clue what the nuts and bolts of that "reform" should be.

It is no different than it was with the "stimulus" bill--he wanted "stimulus", but staked out no position on what would actually be stimulative. Instead, he merely took the porkfest conjured up by Queen Nancy and her cadre of Congressional Corruptocrats and waved it in front of everyone as "stimulus" (never mind that economists on the left and the right looked at it and said "no, this is not stimulus").

Now, Queen Nancy, Henry Taxman, along with her Senate shills Chris Dudd and Kent Conman, are attempting to conjure up another round of reckless raping of the public fisc, and Dear Leader will once again accept it uncritically, touting it as "reform."

What sort of leadership is that? How can anyone know if what is requested is what is being delivered unless they have some idea of what the deliverables should look like?

Dear Leader is guilty of a double sin: he seeks greater government control, power, and involvement in the lives of ordinary people, and he cares not a bit about how his corruptocrat companions in Congress get it for him.

formerroadie said:

The American people will have more time to be scared with lies and made fearful of change.

Click to expand...

Fascinating; the American people are being bombarded daily with lies from Democrats about this and many more issues which is why we are currently in a $1.8 trillion deficit and will be spending well beyond $100 million per day on servicing the nations debt.

The tactics of fear are the only reason so much of this porculus spending has gone on and only now Americans are coming to the realization that they were filled with fear mongering BS about saving the economy and stunned at the fact that now someone will have to pay the bill.

How high do you think taxes will need to be raised to pay for all this, and with the understanding that not ONE single job has been created since Obama came into office?

These same Liberals who railed daily how bad the economy was under Bush and how outrageous it was he spent us into a $200 billion deficit, had a mere 4.7% unemployment rate and GDP growth in the 3-4% range now blather that the loss of jobs at the rate of 500,000 per month, negative GDP growth and spending us into a vast deficit hole of $1.8 trillion now suddenly makes perfect sense.

Folks, you just cannot fabricate the level of stupidity it takes for these people to make such arguments and think that a majority of Americans are too stupid to figure this out and NOT like what they are hearing or seeing.

celticlord said:

Has it escaped everyone's attention that Dear Leader doesn't even have a plan? He has a wish list, not a plan. He wants "reform", but has no clue what the nuts and bolts of that "reform" should be.

It is no different than it was with the "stimulus" bill--he wanted "stimulus", but staked out no position on what would actually be stimulative. Instead, he merely took the porkfest conjured up by Queen Nancy and her cadre of Congressional Corruptocrats and waved it in front of everyone as "stimulus" (never mind that economists on the left and the right looked at it and said "no, this is not stimulus").

Now, Queen Nancy, Henry Taxman, along with her Senate shills Chris Dudd and Kent Conman, are attempting to conjure up another round of reckless raping of the public fisc, and Dear Leader will once again accept it uncritically, touting it as "reform."

What sort of leadership is that? How can anyone know if what is requested is what is being delivered unless they have some idea of what the deliverables should look like?

Dear Leader is guilty of a double sin: he seeks greater government control, power, and involvement in the lives of ordinary people, and he cares not a bit about how his corruptocrat companions in Congress get it for him.

Click to expand...

Great point; you would be correct. He basically knows what he wants when he sees it; which should stun Americans even more than them spending us into a $1.8 trillion hole without a single tangible result to point at should.

Obamacare equals EUTHANASIA CARE AND RATION CARE, it will not only destroy the best healthcare delivery system the world has ever known, it will raise the cost, raise taxes, kill the stock market, kill the economy, and kill jobs. Obama has already caused enormous damage to this country. He must be restrained. Stop Obamacare and Cap and trade and let’s save America.

Obama is a hard left radical and fanatic. He has appointed other radicals to cabinet level posts. He has circumvented the constitution via the appointment of radicals to be czars that aren’t answerable to anyone but him. He sat in Rev. Wright’s pews for 20 plus years and all his associations before he was elected were with hardcore radicals.

celticlord said:

Has it escaped everyone's attention that Dear Leader doesn't even have a plan? He has a wish list, not a plan. He wants "reform", but has no clue what the nuts and bolts of that "reform" should be.

It is no different than it was with the "stimulus" bill--he wanted "stimulus", but staked out no position on what would actually be stimulative. Instead, he merely took the porkfest conjured up by Queen Nancy and her cadre of Congressional Corruptocrats and waved it in front of everyone as "stimulus" (never mind that economists on the left and the right looked at it and said "no, this is not stimulus").

Now, Queen Nancy, Henry Taxman, along with her Senate shills Chris Dudd and Kent Conman, are attempting to conjure up another round of reckless raping of the public fisc, and Dear Leader will once again accept it uncritically, touting it as "reform."

What sort of leadership is that? How can anyone know if what is requested is what is being delivered unless they have some idea of what the deliverables should look like?

Dear Leader is guilty of a double sin: he seeks greater government control, power, and involvement in the lives of ordinary people, and he cares not a bit about how his corruptocrat companions in Congress get it for him.

Click to expand...

Unlike most Americans, he has tried to learn a few lessons from history: On health care reform:
1) it must be done quickly before the Republicans rally the propaganda scare machine ( a lesson from the Johnson era).
2) Suggest, but do not dictate, what the reform must look like. Congress is much happier when they have a hand forming the baby. ( lesson learned from the Clinton administration).

As far as government control of the H.C. system- you should be long past worrying about that.

Turbeaux said:

Obamacare equals EUTHANASIA CARE AND RATION CARE, it will not only destroy the best healthcare delivery system the world has ever known, it will raise the cost, raise taxes, kill the stock market, kill the economy, and kill jobs. Obama has already caused enormous damage to this country. He must be restrained. Stop Obamacare and Cap and trade and let’s save America.

Obama is a hard left radical and fanatic. He has appointed other radicals to cabinet level posts. He has circumvented the constitution via the appointment of radicals to be czars that aren’t answerable to anyone but him. He sat in Rev. Wright’s pews for 20 plus years and all his associations before he was elected were with hardcore radicals.

Click to expand...

Hmmm. Objection. Plaintiff states facts not in evidence.

Erod said:

You do understand that the Republicans can do nothing about this? Right? The Dems could have passed it last January if they wanted to. They could have passed it this week without a single Republican vote.

No, the Democrats have a HUGE public relations problem with this, and several will be voted out of office for passing it. That is why there is a delay.

Click to expand...

Not all Democrats support the Health care bill. The Democrats themselves are in debate over this, which is why it won't pass.

Cassandra said:

Unlike most Americans, he has tried to learn a few lessons from history: On health care reform:
1) it must be done quickly before the Republicans rally the propaganda scare machine ( a lesson from the Johnson era).

Click to expand...

Why is this a "Republican" anything? He has the majority and the votes to pass it; what does this have to do with Republicans?

As to scare machines, what is that; is this the one that tries to get the FACTS about Government managed programs to the people so that they can make an informed choice?

Here's part of that scare tactic; ask your congressman if they and this President will be under the SAME plan they claim is so great for us; if the answer is "no," then I think it is clear your answer should also be a flat out "no." Tell them you are fine if it is the same healthcare program THEY get and see what the answer will be; if not a bunch of diversionary tactics and obfuscations.

Cassandra said:

2) Suggest, but do not dictate, what the reform must look like. Congress is much happier when they have a hand forming the baby. ( lesson learned from the Clinton administration).

Click to expand...

So far we haven't seen "dictate", just lies and distortions about what it will provide and how much it will cost; but give these cretins time, I am sure they will get to the dictate stage and then we will all be royally screwed.

Cassandra said:

As far as government control of the H.C. system- you should be long past worrying about that.

Click to expand...

Really; how is this possible? Have you looked at the confiscatory tax rates other countries are paying for their systems? Have you seen the waiting lists? Have you seen the shortage of doctors and technological breakthroughs?

I am fascinated when people argue FOR mediocrity and not demand better.

I had a debate with a Canadian friend about waiting times and their response was basically; “I have no problem waiting for something as mundane as acid reflux if others are in greater need first.”

My response was why ANYONE should have to wait; we certainly don't have to in this country....YET. But give Democrats time and we will have the same ****ty care everyone else has.