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BNP leader pelted in egg protest

By the way, lest someone be tempted to dismiss me as just a white woman with a white agenda, my kids are multiracial. I have dealt with racism at close range for the past almost 20 years.

And I still say, let them speak. I live in the Southern U.S. where we know, openly, who the racists are. I much prefer it to people who say one thing, and then vote another way.

Clearly, there are plenty of people in the UK who buy into the agenda of the BNP. By trying to silence the BNP, you only give their views more validity. Exposing them to the light of day only allows people to see how truly ridiculous they are.
 
Thatcher tried to deny the IRA the Oxygen of Publicity, the idiot thought because it worked on her cabinet it would work on the IRA:)
 
B L Zeebub said:
Thatcher tried to deny the IRA the Oxygen of Publicity, the idiot thought because it worked on her cabinet it would work on the IRA:)
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I wonder how long her tactics extended that particular conflict, building extreme feelings on both sides?
 
Catz Part Deux said:
I wonder how long her tactics extended that particular conflict, building extreme feelings on both sides?
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That was taken care of by Sunday Bloody Sunday, that atrocity is worth researching:)
 
Catz Part Deux said:
Clearly, there are plenty of people in the UK who buy into the agenda of the BNP. By trying to silence the BNP, you only give their views more validity. Exposing them to the light of day only allows people to see how truly ridiculous they are.
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This is an assumption.

The BNP gained ground because the economic crisis has exposed the wood lice immigration has been to our economy, and because we are sick of the Labour party and everything they stand for, the corruption (not that the BNP are likely to be any less corrupt, but we have very little evidence to suggest they are, of both the conservatives and labour party), the realization of the detrimental effects of the EU to our treasured independance...the reason they have gained ground is because they have more voice then they ever did in light of recent events, racism policies have only helped bring there offence views down a tone. Anyway, with some of the things those Nazi's say, they would get thrown straight out of parliament by the speaker as it is. Example, John Tyndall's anti-semetic views and claiming his bible was Mein Kampf (the latter wouldnt get him chucked out but just get a view of how ignorant these people are).

EDIT: Isnt Anti-semetism illegal in America? Just a thought.
 
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kaya'08 said:
This is an assumption.

The BNP gained ground because the economic crisis has exposed the wood lice immigration has been to our economy, and because we are sick of the Labour party and everything they stand for, the corruption (not that the BNP are likely to be any less corrupt, but we have very little evidence to suggest they are, of both the conservatives and labour party), the realization of the detrimental effects of the EU to our treasured independance...the reason they have gained ground is because they have more voice then they ever did in light of recent events, racism policies have only helped bring there offence views down a tone. .
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My assumption is an accurate one. Some whites in GB clearly feel that they have been harmed, economically and otherwise, by the presence of so many non-white immigrants in the country. Instead of encouraging open debate about this subject, British policy has stifled dissent and driven the conflict underground. You can put any spin on it that you wish, the fact remains that enough people voted for BNP to put them in office. I don't think they've ever been particularly secretive about who/what they are, even as an American I've heard about them for years and know who they are...white nationalists. So, presuming that your countrymen are too ignorant to realize that they're voting for racists is simply absurd.

Thus, there must be plenty of white Britons who share their racist views, and hence have no problems voting for them.

And, that makes it clear that Britain's race laws haven't actually changed public opinion as much as you'd like to think. Hence, they aren't working.

I'm telling you that real, open discussion on race, even if it offended some of you, would probably take this issue farther than laws that stifle dissent.
 
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kaya'08 said:
EDIT: Isnt Anti-semetism illegal in America? Just a thought.
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No, it's not. You can find plenty of anti-semites in the far left AND the far right here, though they usually cloak themselves in the guise of being anti-"zionists" these days.
 
Catz Part Deux said:
No, it's not. You can find plenty of anti-semites in the far left AND the far right here, though they usually cloak themselves in the guise of being anti-"zionists" these days.
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How about the use of the N word? Hmm, i need to brush up on my American politics.
 
kaya'08 said:
How about the use of the N word? Hmm, i need to brush up on my American politics.
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Also not illegal. Listen to some gangster rap and get back to me. Racism and racist expressions are not illegal here. Racist actions, such as work or housing discrimination, however, are illegal, but are generally litigated civilly.
 
Catz Part Deux said:
My assumption is an accurate one. Some whites in GB clearly feel that they have been harmed, economically and otherwise, by the presence of so many non-white immigrants in the country. Instead of encouraging open debate about this subject, British policy has stifled dissent and driven the conflict underground. You can put any spin on it that you wish, the fact remains that enough people voted for BNP to put them in office. I don't think they've ever been particularly secretive about who/what they are, even as an American I've heard about them for years and know who they are...white nationalists. So, presuming that your countrymen are too ignorant to realize that they're voting for racists is simply absurd.
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Actually, we have been harmed economically in general by immigrants and this isnt subject to just non-whites, because to be quiet frank with you catz, most of our immigrants are white from Poland, Bulgaria etc.
People voted for BNP for reasons stated that you cannot possibly conclude was a result of such laws, which where introduced long before the european elections. Anyway, it was a low turnout.

And they are not white nationalists so its evident there is a huge misunderstanding on them in America. Not once have they stated, under the rule of John Tyndall or Nick Griffin, that the white race is superior, and you can even visit there site or wiki them. To call them British nationalists would be correct, racist ones at that. White nationalists believe in white superiorty, in this case there just racist, they even have members in the BNP who are of openly Jewish decent, and have even tried to garner Jewish support for the party.
 
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Catz Part Deux said:
Also not illegal. Listen to some gangster rap and get back to me. Racism and racist expressions are not illegal here. Racist actions, such as work or housing discrimination, however, are illegal, but are generally litigated civilly.
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Ermm, not really the type to pull down my trousers and start rapping to Jay Z to be honest. :lol:
 
kaya'08 said:
People voted for BNP for reasons stated that you cannot possibly conclude was a result of such laws, which where introduced long before the european elections. Anyway, it was a low turnout.
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I'm not saying that the votes were the net effect of those laws, though I would not underestimate the cumulative effect of silencing dissent, even racial dissent. What I would say is that racism has not been driven backwards by these laws as much as some would like to conclude.

And they are not white nationalists so its evident there is a huge misunderstanding on them in America. Not once have they stated, under the rule of John Tyndall or Nick Griffin, that the white race is superior, and you can even visit there site of wiki them.
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http://web.archive.org/web/20070629010001/http://www.bnp.org.uk/resources/constitution_8ed.pdf

The BNP is "committed to stemming and reversing the tide of non-white immigration and to restoring, by legal changes, negotiation and consent the overwhelmingly white makeup of the British population that existed in Britain prior to 1948".
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This is per their own constitution, dated 2004.

The BNP IS, in fact, a white nationalist party.

Do your homework.
 
Catz Part Deux said:
I'm not saying that the votes were the net effect of those laws, though I would not underestimate the cumulative effect of silencing dissent, even racial dissent. What I would say is that racism has not been driven backwards by these laws as much as some would like to conclude.
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It was supposed to reverse racist insults, and it has worked perfectly. The reason for them gaining votes have been explained already and i wont accept any other alternative as an answer if you can proove to me the BNP have been silenced and if they have gained ground on it as a result. This is just a theory.



http://web.archive.org/web/20070629010001/http://www.bnp.org.uk/resources/constitution_8ed.pdf



This is per their own constitution, dated 2004.

The BNP IS, in fact, a white nationalist party.

Do your homework.
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My mistake you are right, i confused the two (white supremacist and nationalist) for a moment there. My bad.
 
Gerry Gable the owner of the anti BNP site hopenothate, was also a member of the Violent [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/62_Group]62 Group - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
Formal membership was only open to those who were Jewish
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Kaya'08, could it be that the BNP's popularity has risen as a result of them being forced to tone down their speech? Could it be that they seem a lot more normal and less threatening now that they can't freely express what they're really all about?

Just something to think about.

Like I said, let them self-destruct with their real thoughts and ideas. If you force them by law to sound less extreme, you're effectively condoning them misleading the British public.
 
Arcana XV said:
Kaya'08, could it be that the BNP's popularity has risen as a result of them being forced to tone down their speech? Could it be that they seem a lot more normal and less threatening now that they can't freely express what they're really all about?
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They can express exactly what they are about without using racial insults. They can tell the pakistanis to leave. They can tell all black people there rights will be taken away. But they cannot throw racial slurs at these people.
I wouldnt even mind, these laws have been around for years now. Therefore one cannot conclude there popularity has been spurred up in a time of economic uncertaintly and in a time when the voting turnout was pathetically low, because of a restriction of certain speech.

Like I said, let them self-destruct with their real thoughts and ideas. If you force them by law to sound less extreme, you're effectively condoning them misleading the British public.
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They've been misleading the public for years. Every party misleads the populace to a certain extent, this is nothing new, but we know what there about, as someone already posted here, they've just changed there marketing.
 
kaya'08 said:
Actually, we have been harmed economically in general by immigrants and this isnt subject to just non-whites, because to be quiet frank with you catz, most of our immigrants are white from Poland, Bulgaria etc.
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would you like to give me some examples of this:)
 
kaya'08 said:
They can express exactly what they are about without using racial insults. They can tell the pakistanis to leave. They can tell all black people there rights will be taken away. But they cannot throw racial slurs at these people.
I wouldnt even mind, these laws have been around for years now. Therefore one cannot conclude there popularity has been spurred up in a time of economic uncertaintly and in a time when the voting turnout was pathetically low, because of a restriction of certain speech.



They've been misleading the public for years. Every party misleads the populace to a certain extent, this is nothing new, but we know what there about, as someone already posted here, they've just changed there marketing.
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I still think that left to their own devices they would have stayed on the extreme right wing fringe where they belong. Their support would have been minimal had they been allowed to freely express themselves. Most regular people are not into extreme ideologies.
 
B L Zeebub said:
would you like to give me some examples of this:)
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Sure. Companies are shedding jobs nationwide and its left many Britons homeless and without an income to support there families. The last jobs to go are the immigrants jobs. They come abroad and work in Britain for cheaper, they take all the jobs they can get there hands on, and when it comes down to it, when a Briton tries to go out and find a job with decent pay and hours, we end up finding ourselves competing with the foriegners. I know many natives who have lost there jobs because theres Poles who are willing to do the same thing for the absolute minimum wage. They'd push it down further if they could. Its like an unfair workers monopoly. Then you got the large portion of immigrant workers who come here and decide it wise to live off unemployement benefits which we happen to pay for and house them in council estates. The list goes on, but thats a different argument. These people are a burden to the state and the Australian Immigration laws are a model example of how ours should be. If you are a burden to the state, then :2wave:
 
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kaya'08 said:
Sure. Companies are shedding jobs nationwide and its left many Britons homeless and without an income to support there families. The last jobs to go are the immigrants jobs. They come abroad and work in Britain for cheaper, they take all the jobs they can get there hands on, and when it comes down to it, when a Briton tries to go out and find a job with decent pay and hours, we end up finding ourselves competing with the foriegners. I know many natives who have lost there jobs because theres Poles who are willing to do the same thing for the absolute minimum wage. They'd push it down further if they could. Its like an unfair workers monopoly. Then you got the large portion of immigrant workers who come here and decide it wise to live off unemployement benefits which we happen to pay for and house them in council estates. The list goes on, but thats a different argument. These people are a burden to the state and the Australian Immigration laws are a model example of how ours should be. If you are a burden to the state, then :2wave:
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I am now retired from being a director of 3 companies in the UK, my elder brother is a non exec director of 15 companies and finance director of two, md of a third.

Would you like to give me examples with links of the above not factless rhetoric:)
 
B L Zeebub said:
I am now retired from being a director of 3 companies in the UK, my elder brother is a non exec director of 15 companies and finance director of two, md of a third.

Would you like to give me examples with links of the above not factless rhetoric:)
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Factless rhetoric? This is the reality for many British citizens. Your obviously an educated man involved in higher sectors of business with extensive skills, this isnt the case for many Britons involved in the lower sectors of labour.
 
kaya'08 said:
Factless rhetoric? This is the reality for many British citizens. Your obviously an educated man involved in higher sectors of business with extensive skills, this isnt the case for many Britons involved in the lower sectors of labour.
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:lol::lol:I left school at 15yrs with no qualifications, facts with links please.

Ps Subject or citizen?
 
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The Economic Impact of Immigration

Effects of immigration on Britain.

Immigration has become the UK's top public policy issues, for a reason. Only a quarter of the British public believe that immigration has any benefits to the British economy, and then rest are calling for tighter control. The government is yet to release hard facts that immigration has had any large benefits to our economy, and proves that infact, such large scale immigration has caused harm to our economy and society.
 
Young man you make statements I ask for proof easy peasy, facts please with link:)
 
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