• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

First on The CNN Ticker: Ridge disagrees with Cheney

Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

Here are "actual" numbers and proof of how well your president did.

Bush by the Numbers - ProPublica

Considering the source, that isn't too bad after fighting two major conflicts in the Middle East, the events of 9-11 and devastation of hurricane Katrina.

What part are you attempting to point to; the National Debt? Okay, what part do you not get that Obama's spending will add more to that debt than the last four Presidents combined?

I am curious, what are you attempting to defend here? Obama's spending us into $1.8 trillion deficit with MUCH more to come?
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

In addition; the inflated value of the stock market did not necessarily mean that $4 trillion dollars disappeared; that is an impossibility. Where do you think this $4 trillion went? Did someone burn it in a bonfire?

It went to China who we are in great debt to due to Bush's heavy borrowing. $4.9trillion actually.
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

It went to China who we are in great debt to due to Bush's heavy borrowing. $4.9trillion actually.

A larger percentage of the National Debt is held by inter-Governmental transfers and US citizens.

But again, all this is begging for a point. What is your point? That the Democrats spending us into a $1.8 trillion dollar deficit with MORE to come is a GOOD thing because Bush did it on a smaller scale? You're kidding me right?
:rofl
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

Considering the source, that isn't too bad after fighting two major conflicts in the Middle East, the events of 9-11 and devastation of hurricane Katrina.

What part are you attempting to point to; the National Debt? Okay, what part do you not get that Obama's spending will add more to that debt than the last four Presidents combined?

I am curious, what are you attempting to defend here? Obama's spending us into $1.8 trillion deficit with MUCH more to come?

I am not attempting to defend anything. I am asserting that the money is needed in order to overhaul a system that your party ran into ruins. It takes money to make money.

Also, my main point is that regardless of the rhetoric you use, Republicans are bigger spenders than Democrats. Yes, Obama's deficit spending is tremedous, but I will wager that the quality of life for American's will improve dramatically as it has always done under Democrat control.
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

I think there is plenty of evidence of who is culpable for some of the events leading up to the stock market's collapse in value; but the notion that it was Bush requires willful denial or one to engage in useless hyper partisan hyperbole.

.

You will notice that the effect of the current stimulus has been to basically stop the panic and arrest the downward economic spiral. Bush's people should have seen this coming, could have done many things to stop it. Acting ahead of a crisis in order to minimize or prevent it is part of the job of the governing administration. You don't have to believe me, just pay attention and you'll see how it's done.
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

A larger percentage of the National Debt is held by inter-Governmental transfers and US citizens.

But again, all this is begging for a point. What is your point? That the Democrats spending us into a $1.8 trillion dollar deficit with MORE to come is a GOOD thing because Bush did it on a smaller scale? You're kidding me right?
:rofl

No it is not a good thing. Debt never is, unless it leads to great gains in the future. Time will tell.
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

It has the distinction of being both original and true. Thank you.
Celticlord has been calling Prez Doofus Dear Leader for months and your kind have bitched about it incessantly?

Typical, though. :rofl

.
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

I am not attempting to defend anything. I am asserting that the money is needed in order to overhaul a system that your party ran into ruins. It takes money to make money.

Where do you think the Government gets it's money from?

Also, my main point is that regardless of the rhetoric you use, Republicans are bigger spenders than Democrats. Yes, Obama's deficit spending is tremedous, but I will wager that the quality of life for American's will improve dramatically as it has always done under Democrat control.

I will be more than happy to take any wager you wish regarding the quality of life we will have during this Presidency and Democrat controll of the Congress.

Claiming Republicans were bigger spenders than the Republican Congress requires the willful ignorance of the historic record.

During Republican control of the congress, it was the first time in four or five decades the budget was ballanced. When Republicans lost control of the congress the deficit what under $170 billion and in decline, since the Democrats took over it has assumed a scale beyond that of World War II.

What part of REALITY do you not get?
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

No it is not a good thing. Debt never is, unless it leads to great gains in the future. Time will tell.

Again, what is your point then in continually pointing to Republican Presidents when the current administration and Democrat controlled congress is spending us beyond a $1.8 trillion deficit?

Who do you think is going to pay for all this? How does this make us better off?

We have passed trillions in bailout funds and yet, the unemployment rate continues to shoot up, productivity is in decline, no one is spending and if you compound this with higher taxes to pay for all the Government spending, what do you think will happen then?
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

Again, what is your point then in continually pointing to Republican Presidents when the current administration and Democrat controlled congress is spending us beyond a $1.8 trillion deficit?

Who do you think is going to pay for all this? How does this make us better off?

We have passed trillions in bailout funds and yet, the unemployment rate continues to shoot up, productivity is in decline, no one is spending and if you compound this with higher taxes to pay for all the Government spending, what do you think will happen then?

The bailout funds are supposed to be paid back. Now what part of Bush's endeavour in Iraq is going to be paid back in cash money with even the slightest expectation?
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

Again, what is your point then in continually pointing to Republican Presidents when the current administration and Democrat controlled congress is spending us beyond a $1.8 trillion deficit?

Who do you think is going to pay for all this? How does this make us better off?

We have passed trillions in bailout funds and yet, the unemployment rate continues to shoot up, productivity is in decline, no one is spending and if you compound this with higher taxes to pay for all the Government spending, what do you think will happen then?

FDR spent more money than anyother president before him to overhaul the U.S. during the Great Depression in the New Deal. The result? America became the richest nation in the world. This is the same thing, an overhaul, and it will work.
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

Where do you think the Government gets it's money from?



I will be more than happy to take any wager you wish regarding the quality of life we will have during this Presidency and Democrat controll of the Congress.

Claiming Republicans were bigger spenders than the Republican Congress requires the willful ignorance of the historic record.

During Republican control of the congress, it was the first time in four or five decades the budget was ballanced. When Republicans lost control of the congress the deficit what under $170 billion and in decline, since the Democrats took over it has assumed a scale beyond that of World War II.

What part of REALITY do you not get?

Clinton, not the Repubican Congress balanced the budget. Republicans simply voted yes for his budget and attempted to take the credit. The Republican Congress under Bush passed 90% of any budget or policy and created the current deficit. Now who is ignoring the historical record? Do you think the War in Iraq was free?
 
Last edited:
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

You will notice that the effect of the current stimulus has been to basically stop the panic and arrest the downward economic spiral. Bush's people should have seen this coming, could have done many things to stop it. Acting ahead of a crisis in order to minimize or prevent it is part of the job of the governing administration. You don't have to believe me, just pay attention and you'll see how it's done.
Other than the Prez Doofus cheerleading efforts, what evidence do you have of this?

The latest news I've heard said forty-four states lost jobs in April and the losses are expected to continue through 2010. CA is on the verge of bankruptcy and many other states are in deparate straights. So where are all these positive signs you've noticed?


.
 
Bashing Cheney after that utter joke some of you call President did nothing but give a flowery manure filled speech while bashing everyone but his glorious self.

Cheney looked and spoke like a man who has credibility as a leader.
Obama looked like a snob, spoke like an idealisic brat, an lacked any credibilty whatsoever.

Obama is pathetic. Pelosi in drag.
 
Last edited:
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

The bailout funds are supposed to be paid back. Now what part of Bush's endeavour in Iraq is going to be paid back in cash money with even the slightest expectation?

The idea that most of this Government deficit spending is the bailout money and that it will EVER be paid back or paid back soon requires a level of denial I just cannot get to.

So who do you think will be paying for all this spending and what does the tiny deficit spent by Bush have to do with what is happening NOW?

How does this reconcile with Democrat rhetoric about the irresponsible Republicans getting us into a $200 billion deficit versus what we now have at $1.8 trillion under Democrats?
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

FDR spent more money than anyother president before him to overhaul the U.S. during the Great Depression in the New Deal. The result? America became the richest nation in the world. This is the same thing, an overhaul, and it will work.

The historic facts do not support your argument. If anything economists suggest that the spending exacerbated and lengthened the depression; it was WWII that got us out of it. And it took decades to pay the deficits created by the war down.

The notion that FDR's work projects made us the richest nation in the world is not supported by any credible historic record.

But that stated, what does what happened in FDRs time have to do with now? Last time I looked, we were in a recession, not a World War. Are you desperately trying to defend this irresponsible spending spree by suggesting it is like WWII?
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

Clinton, not the Repubican Congress balanced the budget. Republicans simply voted yes for his budget and attempted to take the credit. The Republican Congress under Bush passed 90% of any budget or policy and created the current deficit. Now who is ignoring the historical record? Do you think the War in Iraq was free?

You truly are living in a parallel universe if you believe this poppycock. Did you ever hear of Newt Gingrich and the Contract with America?

Do me a favor, present me with one credible link that supports your assertion that Clinton had ANYTHING to do with the surplus; particularly when it was the Republican Congress led by Newt Gingrich who set the spending agenda.

:rofl
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

You truly are living in a parallel universe if you believe this poppycock. Did you ever hear of Newt Gingrich and the Contract with America?

Do me a favor, present me with one credible link that supports your assertion that Clinton had ANYTHING to do with the surplus; particularly when it was the Republican Congress led by Newt Gingrich who set the spending agenda.

:rofl

What is the Newts great legacy as being the Republicans speaker of the house.

Wasn't he forced to step down due to ethics violations?
The new voice of the Republican party....Run with that. It's a proven winner.
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

What is the Newts great legacy as being the Republicans speaker of the house.

Wasn't he forced to step down due to ethics violations?
The new voice of the Republican party....Run with that. It's a proven winner.

Why don't you look it up instead of entering into intellectually challenged babble?
 
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

Why don't you look it up instead of entering into intellectually challenged babble?

Nope..as you can see I'm an expert on the meaning of truth.

Nobody has to look up the fact the Newt is a pandering nitwit.

Everybody already knows that.

Everyone that understands what "truth" is.
 
Last edited:
Re: Tom Ridge Says Cheney is Wrong

What is the Newts great legacy as being the Republicans speaker of the house.

Wasn't he forced to step down due to ethics violations?
The new voice of the Republican party....Run with that. It's a proven winner.

I gotta tell you the most of the time I read or see something on this it literally makes me lol.

The new and ethical voice of the republican party.....Newt :rofl



.......the rest of the time I just think the GOP is never gonna get it together
:slapme:
 
It is style that makes him fear mongering. I think the count was 24 times Cheney invoked 9/11. That is fear mongering, using fear to make your point.

I do agree 100 % with the idea that President Obama needs to stop invoking president Bush's administration. It tends to come off sounding like an excuse.

Fear mongering is one thing but to those who forget or never experienced the pain of 9/11 they need to be reminded of what this war on terror is all about. A war we didn't start.

Standing outside of the issue one can gain an unenviable objectivity about these matters.

Half this country or more felt 9/11 emotionally and still feel it that way and are inclined to old school attitudes toward threats to our country and those who threaten us.
 
Fear mongering is one thing but to those who forget or never experienced the pain of 9/11 they need to be reminded of what this war on terror is all about.

24 times? Sorry you can't admit it, but that's fear mongering.

Hell I even called Obama fear mongering when he mentioned how much the economy was in need of that stimulus IMMEDIATELY.

You should try to at least be objective on that. 24 times is fear mongering.
 
24 times? Sorry you can't admit it, but that's fear mongering.

Hell I even called Obama fear mongering when he mentioned how much the economy was in need of that stimulus IMMEDIATELY.

You should try to at least be objective on that. 24 times is fear mongering.

In this world of 30 second sound bytes each pithy phrase needs to have 9/11 in it to make sense and have the right impact in a sound byte.

Media 101.
 
Last edited:
Fear mongering is one thing but to those who forget or never experienced the pain of 9/11 they need to be reminded of what this war on terror is all about. A war we didn't start.

Standing outside of the issue one can gain an unenviable objectivity about these matters.

Half this country or more felt 9/11 emotionally and still feel it that way and are inclined to old school attitudes toward threats to our country and those who threaten us.

Just to be clear, I still cannot watch the 9/11 footage. If they start showing part of it in a news story, I have to turn the channel. I found what happened to be incredibly emotionally devastating. There is zero chance I will ever forget the day.

I play MMO's. At the time of 9/11, I played an online game called Everquest. After I had to run from the coverage of the disaster, being totally unprepared for the sight of people jumping to their death to avoid the heat of the building and things of that nature, I logged into Everquest. There where people online in the game, who knew people who worked in the WTC, who knew people in New York, or who lived in New York, all doing largely what I was doing, getting away from the pain. I remember some of the things they where saying, and marveled at the pain and torment these people where feeling.

9/11 affected me deeply, and forever. I think that is true for almost every one, liberal or conservative, republican or democrat. I don't think we are in any danger of forgetting 9/11.
 
Back
Top Bottom