• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Somali Insurgents Fire at US Congressman During Visit to Mogadishu

BulletWounD

BulletWounD

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 3, 2009
Messages
984
Reaction score
210
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Ruh-Roh.

Somali Insurgents Fire at US Congressman During Visit to Mogadishu

Somali insurgents fired mortars toward U.S. Congressman Donald Payne's plane during a visit to the Somali capital in Mogadishu.

The New Jersey Democrat was not injured, his spokeswoman Kerry McKenney told FOX News.

"One mortar landed at the airport when Payne's plane was due to fly and five others after he left and no one was hurt," Abukar Hassan, a police officer at Mogadishu airport, told Reuters.

McKenney said Payne, who chairs the House subcommittee on Africa, felt it was important to go to Mogadishu and see first-hand what was happening there.

[...]
Click to expand...

FOXNews.com - Somali Insurgents Fire at U.S. Congressman During Visit to Mogadishu - International News | News of the World | Middle East News | Europe News

I wouldn't associate this attack to pirates too soon. There is a violent Islamist movement in Somalia. To what extent the pirates and the Islamist movement are interrelated, I do not know. However, it's important not to jump the gun.
 
Well this is just rediculous.

I say slap some cannons/machine guns on the side of all merchant vessels, show those pirates a rude awakening to what happened to the last generation of Pirates that braved the open water.

Send those boys down to Davy Jones Locker.
 
thabigred said:
Well this is just rediculous.

I say slap some cannons/machine guns on the side of all merchant vessels, show those pirates a rude awakening to what happened to the last generation of Pirates that braved the open water.

Send those boys down to Davy Jones Locker.
Click to expand...

But they're just poor oppressed people trying to make a living.. cause commercial fishers ****ed up their livelihood, fishing off their shores. :roll:

Not to mention that whole international law thing forbidding non-war class vessels to not be armed.
 
stevenb said:
But they're just poor oppressed people trying to make a living.. cause commercial fishers ****ed up their livelihood, fishing off their shores. :roll:

Not to mention that whole international law thing forbidding non-war class vessels to not be armed.
Click to expand...

Sounds like the gun bans to me.

It allows ships to not defend themselves, and criminals a safe and easy way to rob law abiding citizens(in this case vessels).

It's a idiotic way to enforce laws, you end up never cracking down on the criminals and punishing law abiding citizens.
 
stevenb said:
But they're just poor oppressed people trying to make a living.. cause commercial fishers ****ed up their livelihood, fishing off their shores. :roll:

Not to mention that whole international law thing forbidding non-war class vessels to not be armed.
Click to expand...

double negative....but I get what you mean....not that I know the details of the laws, but I doubt that small arms are excluded...
 
The country is in civil war.. what you expect.. moron Fox News bs.
 
UtahBill said:
double negative....but I get what you mean....not that I know the details of the laws, but I doubt that small arms are excluded...
Click to expand...

Ah, I was going for the fact that frigates, cruise liners, tankers, etc..etc cannot have weapons on their ship.
 
StandUpChuck said:
says the guy throwing around the bias label.
Click to expand...

So what... the country is in a civil war, where the government forces are only in power due to massive Ethiopian presence. The city is one of the most dangerous if not the most dangerous city on the planet, and it is such a shocker that a US congressman gets shot at when there? Big freaking news... /yawn, report it, move on..
 
I see no reason why armed UN peacekeepers shouldn't be allowed to be contracted to protect private vessels. Any pirate approaching a ship flying the UN flag beneath the ship's registered flag, should be enough to warn approaching terrorist pirates to approach at their own risk.

Just makes sense to me. Might as well use the UN for something productive.
 
stevenb said:
Ah, I was going for the fact that frigates, cruise liners, tankers, etc..etc cannot have weapons on their ship.
Click to expand...

Cruise liners can have armed security personal on board.

Cruise lines are reluctant to talk about their specific security plans, fearing that the information could help those willing to pounce on ships. Crye said companies are permitted to arm their crews, but he wouldn't say if they did.
Cruise Ships Vulnerable to Attacks
 
winston53660 said:
Cruise liners can have armed security personal on board.

Cruise lines are reluctant to talk about their specific security plans, fearing that the information could help those willing to pounce on ships. Crye said companies are permitted to arm their crews, but he wouldn't say if they did.
Cruise Ships Vulnerable to Attacks
Click to expand...

Ah, neat, good idea on their part.
 
Captain America said:
I see no reason why armed UN peacekeepers shouldn't be allowed to be contracted to protect private vessels. Any pirate approaching a ship flying the UN flag beneath the ship's registered flag, should be enough to warn approaching terrorist pirates to approach at their own risk.

Just makes sense to me. Might as well use the UN for something productive.
Click to expand...

So you are saying we can hire the US military to defend the boats? Because that is what you are saying. You basicly making every military force that contributes to the UN peacekeeping force a mercenary... Then again the US does not participate in UN peacekeeping, so why should you care..
 
Captain America said:
I see no reason why armed UN peacekeepers shouldn't be allowed to be contracted to protect private vessels.
Click to expand...

The UN is a peacekeeping force, i do not want UN forces protecting a few oil rich ships tyvm.
The use of them can be used much more effectively elsewhere, besides. If US wishes to protect ships, let the US Navy take the job.
 
Laila said:
The UN is a peacekeeping force, i do not want UN forces protecting a few oil rich ships tyvm.
The use of them can be used much more effectively elsewhere, besides. If US wishes to protect ships, let the US Navy take the job.
Click to expand...

Just put a couple of [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Denial_System"]these suckers[/ame] on the ships and deep fry their asses.

Active_Denial_System_Humvee.jpg
 
Last edited:
PeteEU said:
So you are saying we can hire the US military to defend the boats? Because that is what you are saying. You basicly making every military force that contributes to the UN peacekeeping force a mercenary... Then again the US does not participate in UN peacekeeping, so why should you care..
Click to expand...

You know, how come it's always me that has to inform someone that they have left their fly open? I know it's embarassing for them. I don't particularly like to be the one who has to tell them either. But what am I supposed to do? Let them walk around with their little turtle-head poking out and continue to embarass themselves?

Looky here Petey. That's what YOU are saying. I CLEARLY said "UN Peacekeepers." Not ONCE did I say "US Military." So, unless you are suggesting that the UN Peacekeeping forces and the US military are two in the same (which is another debate in and of itself) I hate to be the one to tell you this but your fly is open and your lil' turtle-head is pokin out.'

If all the nations come together through the UN and strongly denounce these Somali scum suckers and initiate a Zero Piracy Tolerance, under a collective flag of the UN, and let the UN attempt exterminate them, everytime they stick up their little pirate heads, I think that might do the trick.

I think a trained force of five with some semi-sophisticated equipment on each ship should be enough to swat the pesty pirates whenever they are stupid enough to try their hi-jacking escapade. And the shipping company should incur the expenses of this UN fighting force. It's cheaper than ransom and it's cheap insurance.

Sooner or later, even a Somalin will get the message that we ain't gonna be putting up with their armed robbery on the high seas. Or, anywhere else for that matter. Call the Orkin man for all I care.
 
Last edited:
Laila said:
The UN is a peacekeeping force, i do not want UN forces protecting a few oil rich ships tyvm.
The use of them can be used much more effectively elsewhere, besides. If US wishes to protect ships, let the US Navy take the job.
Click to expand...

I can't even make myself type a response to that.
 
Captain America said:
Sooner or later, even a Somalin will get the message that we ain't gonna be putting up with their armed robbery on the high seas.
Click to expand...

No they won't ...

The riches outweigh the risk of death ..
Death is not a deterrant and never will be, life is seen as cheap in Somalia.
 
Captain America said:
You know, how come it's always me that has to inform someone that they have left their fly open? I know it's embarassing for them. I don't particularly like to be the one who has to tell them either. But what am I supposed to do? Let them walk around with their little turtle-head poking out and continue to embarass themselves?

Looky here Petey. That's what YOU are saying. I CLEARLY said "UN Peacekeepers." Not ONCE did I say "US Military." So, unless you are suggesting that the UN Peacekeeping forces and the US military are two in the same (which is another debate in and of itself) I hate to be the one to tell you this but your fly is open and your lil' turtle-head is pokin out.'

If all the nations come together through the UN and strongly denounce these Somali scum suckers and initiate a Zero Piracy Tolerance, under a collective flag of the UN, and let the UN attempt exterminate them, everytime they stick up their little pirate heads, I think that might do the trick.

I think a trained force of five with some semi-sophisticated equipment on each ship should be enough to swat the pesty pirates whenever they are stupid enough to try their hi-jacking escapade. And the shipping company should incur the expenses of this UN fighting force. It's cheaper than ransom and it's cheap insurance.

Sooner or later, even a Somalin will get the message that we ain't gonna be putting up with their armed robbery on the high seas. Or, anywhere else for that matter. Call the Orkin man for all I care.
Click to expand...

I dunno about the UN, but one thing we could do is send "honeypot" ships through the waters the pirates patrol. Nice, fat, ships full of empty containers. When the pirates board the ship, they are shocked to find that the crew consists of US Navy SEALS. SURPRISE! Then they can be detained for information gathering purposes, put to justice, and of course killed if need be.
 
Laila said:
No they won't ...

The riches outweigh the risk of death ..
Death is not a deterrant and never will be, life is seen as cheap in Somalia.
Click to expand...

BS. There's no such thing as a rich dead man. The key is to make the risks outweigh the benefits so that piracy becomes only marginally profitable, if at all, and results in the death or imprisonment of the pirates in the overwhelming majority of cases.
 
BulletWounD said:
BS. There's no such thing as a rich dead man. The key is to make the risks outweigh the benefits so that piracy becomes only marginally profitable, if at all, and results in the death or imprisonment of the pirates in the overwhelming majority of cases.
Click to expand...

I call bull****.

Pirates take some money yes but alot of it goes to their family. If they die but their 'friends' survive, their share of the booty still goes on.
 
Laila said:
I call bull****.

Pirates take some money yes but alot of it goes to their family. If they die but their 'friends' survive, their share of the booty still goes on.
Click to expand...

Dead/imprisoned pirates, failed raids, recovered ships, no booty... Here's the thing - right now it's cheaper for the shipping companies to pay the bounty. When they decide this is no longer the case, the pirates are going to be in a world of hurt. Now what we're seeing is governments step in on behalf of their citizens. If they try to take another American ship, the result will be the same - death or imprisonment. No booty, just misery.

I think honeypots would be a great way to deter piracy. Just load up a ship full of troops and pretend to be a tanker/cargo ship/whatever. When they try to board your ship, do whatever needs to be done. This adds to the risk calculation of even attempting to hijack a ship. They'll have to counter with larger boats and bigger raid parties, which can easily be detected and destroyed by our Navy.
 
BulletWounD said:
Dead/imprisoned pirates, failed raids, recovered ships, no booty... Here's the thing - right now it's cheaper for the shipping companies to pay the bounty. When they decide this is no longer the case, the pirates are going to be in a world of hurt. Now what we're seeing is governments step in on behalf of their citizens. If they try to take another American ship, the result will be the same - death or imprisonment. No booty, just misery.

I think honeypots would be a great way to deter piracy. Just load up a ship full of troops and pretend to be a tanker/cargo ship/whatever. When they try to board your ship, do whatever needs to be done. This adds to the risk calculation of even attempting to hijack a ship. They'll have to counter with larger boats and bigger raid parties, which can easily be detected and destroyed by our Navy.
Click to expand...

That's a good idea but that's assuming the Somalians are dumber than a box of rocks. Which, very well might be the case. Laila seems to think they are simply retarded and have no value on life. She might be right too. I dunno.

But that honey-pot idea would be one heckuva secret to keep. Plus, only a small fraction of the passing ships get assaulted. What are the odds?

I think we ougta go with the security squads flying under a neutral flag on as many vessels as we can.
 
Captain America said:
Laila seems to think they are simply retarded and have no value on life. She might be right too. I dunno.
Click to expand...

I didn't mean to make it sound like that.

I mean, hey. They were clever enough to outwit how many navies to hijack ships?

I just meant to make the point that after 24 years of deaths and before that the famine and starvation.
Life becomes expendable and is seen as cheap as death is nothing new.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom