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Navy deployed to Venezuela airports, seaports

Harry Guerrilla

Harry Guerrilla

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Navy deployed to Venezuela airports, seaports - Boston.com

CARACAS, Venezuela—President Hugo Chavez deployed the navy to Venezuela's seaports on Sunday, and he said state governors who challenge new legislation bringing transportation hubs under federal control could end up in prison.

Speaking during his weekly television and radio program, Chavez ordered naval vessels to seize control of Port Cabello in Carabobo state and Maracaibo Port in Zulia state -- two of Venezuela's largest seaports.
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Lawmakers loyal to Chavez voted last week to bring all airports, highways and seaports under federal control, a move government adversaries said was designed to expand the president's power.

"This is a national security issue," Chavez said Sunday, defending the law.

Opposition governors warned that the law approved by the Chavista-dominated National Assembly is designed to strangle the president's foes financially and to undermine support from constituents who elected them in November.
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Following the vote, Chavez signed a series of decrees giving his government control over hospitals, sports stadiums and other public institutions in states won by the opposition.
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Chavez is gaining more and more power. He is becoming an absolute dictator.

<Queue Chavez apologists>
 
Could have sworn he was branded as a dictator even before this move.
 
I'm... Shocked. No, really... :-\ How much longer do you think it'll be before he starts rounding up "class enemies" and summarily executing them? DIAF Chavez.
 
Just because the people of Venezuela like him doesn't make him any less of a dictator. We are just used to automatically assuming that dictators are evil bastards who have taken their country by pure force, and guile. I mean I am not saying he is innocent of anything it's just that he is no Saddam.
 
Arch Enemy said:
Just because the people of Venezuela like him doesn't make him any less of a dictator. We are just used to automatically assuming that dictators are evil bastards who have taken their country by pure force, and guile. I mean I am not saying he is innocent of anything it's just that he is no Saddam.
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I think it is pretty well detailed on this forum that he is doing things in a way that not even the most extreme liberals would support.

This mans intentions are not altruistic. He is not a Saddam yet.

Threatening opposition with arrest if they challenge his policies is just a few steps shy of an explicit dictatorship.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
I think it is pretty well detailed on this forum that he is doing things in a way that not even the most extreme liberals would support.

This mans intentions are not altruistic. He is not a Saddam yet.

Threatening opposition with arrest if they challenge his policies is just a few steps shy of an explicit dictatorship.
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Oh, but the left loves him because he's working "for the people." His brand of socialism is "different" and nobody has anything to worry about. I hope these not-so-veiled threats to throw dissenters in prison reveal to the world that the whole thing is a sham.
 
Reagan would have told us exactly what he thought of this SOB...

Oh, the good 'ole days!

:2wave:
 
BulletWounD said:
Oh, but the left loves him because he's working "for the people." His brand of socialism is "different" and nobody has anything to worry about. I hope these not-so-veiled threats to throw dissenters in prison reveal to the world that the whole thing is a sham.
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The line of Chavez lovers is long and they excuse most of what this douche does.

It will take him destroying his economy or a group of his people to convince them otherwise.

Grateful Heart said:
Reagan would have told us exactly what he thought of this SOB...

Oh, the good 'ole days!
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I may not be the Reagan type but when you see a duck you call it just that.
 
Grateful Heart said:
Reagan would have told us exactly what he thought of this SOB...

Oh, the good 'ole days!

:2wave:
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Considering the pathetic failure of Reagan's neoliberal expansion compared to the economic success of Bolivarian socialism, his Alzheimer's would have been more apparent than usual if he had.
 
Khayembii Communique said:
That's what happens when you break the law.

Your assertion that Chavez is a dictator was also pretty thoroughly refuted.
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He didn't say break the law he said challenge.

You can challenge something in court you know.

My points were never refuted. If congress votes his way most of the time then he can by proxy be a dictator.

I don't know how you keep blinding yourself with ideology when history has shown people like him will ultimately fail.
 
BulletWounD said:
Whether he's a dictator or not means very little to me. He is a tyrant.
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Better choice of words this time. Technically, he is not a dictator, but he represents the tyranny of the majority in Venezuela.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
It is not decentralized. So I can't answer a wrongly worded question.
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On the contrary, as previously noted by quotation of Professor Robin Hahnel's Venezuela: Not What You Think, decentralization and grassroots participation by worker-owned cooperatives has been a fundamental element of the success of Bolivarian socialism, as opposed to the failure of central planning.

New worker-owned cooperatives not only provided much needed jobs producing much needed basic goods and services, they also featured what was soon to become a hallmark of Bolivarian socialism -- popular participation at the grassroots level. When Chavez was first elected President in 1998, there were fewer than 800 legally registered cooperatives in Venezuela with roughly 20,000 members. In mid-2006 the National Superintendence of Cooperatives (SUNACOOP) reported that it had registered over 100,000 co-ops with over 1.5 million members. Generous amounts of oil revenues continue to provide start-up loans for thousands of new cooperatives every month, and the Ministry for the Communal Economy continues to spearhead a massive educational program for new cooperative members. However, the ministry provides more than technical assistance regarding technology, accounting, finance, business management, and marketing. It also teaches participants about cooperative principles, economic justice, and social responsibility.
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Hence, I'd recommend that you re-analyze your conception of Bolivarian socialism and the nature of Venezuelan economic success.
 
Agnapostate said:
On the contrary, as previously noted by quotation of Professor Robin Hahnel's Venezuela: Not What You Think, decentralization and grassroots participation by worker-owned cooperatives has been a fundamental element of the success of Bolivarian socialism, as opposed to the failure of central planning.



Hence, I'd recommend that you re-analyze your conception of Bolivarian socialism and the nature of Venezuelan economic success.
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Your failing to see that for these worker owned cooperatives to exist that the government has to centrally plan to get it.

The Venezuelan government is centrally planning everything else.

The forest for the trees and all that.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
Your failing to see that for these worker owned cooperatives to exist that the government has to centrally plan to get it.

The Venezuelan government is centrally planning everything else.

The forest for the trees and all that.
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You clearly don't understand the nature of central planning. "Central planning" is typically used to refer to central planning of allocation and retail schemes, not initial structural delegations that would themselves be involved in some degree of economic planning on a grassroots level.

You're going to have to devote some more study to political economy.
 
Agnapostate said:
You clearly don't understand the nature of central planning. "Central planning" is typically used to refer to central planning of allocation and retail schemes, not initial structural delegations that would themselves be involved in some degree of economic planning on a grassroots level.

You're going to have to devote some more study to political economy.
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I understand it but what I also understand is that something altruistic and good like a worker owned cooperative can be turned bad by a giant central planner like Chavez.

What happens if these worker collectives start selling the products they grow, make, etc at more than the government dictated price?
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
I understand it but what I also understand is that something altruistic and good like a worker owned cooperative can be turned bad by a giant central planner like Chavez.
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Worker-owned cooperatives aren't primarily intended to be "altruistic" or "good"; they're intended to be efficiency maximizers, and clearly are, judging by the Venezuelan rate of economic growth. Chavez is also not a "giant central planner." Indeed, he has little involvement with the nature of economic democracy in Venezuela, considering its local coordination.

Harry Guerrilla said:
What happens if these worker collectives start selling the products they grow, make, etc at more than the government dictated price?
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"Government dictated" price? The nature of worker owned enterprises necessitates participatory budgeting at the local level, another commendable facet of Bolivarian socialism.
 
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