Obama 'ready to drop shield plans for Russian help on Iran'

Infinite Chaos said:

Fraid not, Russia supplies much of Europe with gas. They have us by the "short and curlies" every winter when they threaten to cut off supplies. They also have huge oil reserves and have just claimed a large part of the Arctic.

Go on holiday around any parts of Europe and you'll see and hear more Russians than Germans / French / Italians etc.

We're lucky Russia discovered its oil reserves after the Cold war was over. Anyhow - is there a link for the story?

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That isn't enitirely true.

Russia has the EU by the curlies. Russia's claim on the arctic is still in dispute.

In 1990, the Soviet Union fell.... Russia is still not yet out of the woods ... so to speak.

rhinefire said:

If Russia fires only one then we will be back on the streets in million years. If they fire 400 it will take a billion years.

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I think you guys are drastically overestimating how powerful nukes are. If they fire one, they'd destroy a city but life would go on for the rest of us. If they fire 400, they'd destroy 400 cities but life would go on for the rest of us. To destroy civilization would require the United States and Russia to empty their entire nuclear arsenals on one another, and the rest of the world.

But regardless, this doesn't really address the point I was making. If the purpose of the shield is to defend against Russia rather than Iran, all it would take is for Russia to fire a few more nukes than the shield could handle, which is certainly within their capabilities.

I think we should trade our membership in NATO for Russian help in negotiations with the "world"

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No, NATO works most of the time, while missile shields fail miserably more often than not.

In one word: NAIVE

Title Correction:
Obama 'ready to drop pants and hold ankles for Russians and Iranians

Text correction:

MOSCOW, March 2 (RIA Novosti) - Washington has told Moscow that Russian help in resolving Iran's nuclear program would make its missile shield plans for Europe unnecessary, a Russian daily said on Monday, citing White House sources...

Sources in the Kremlin responded initially with shock that the President of The United States could be so naive, then shock changed to uncontrollable laughter, as the Russian leaders were sharing this latest foray into Disney Politics with the Iranians per telephone.

Under deep cover, one member of the Kremlin staff said we would no sooner help Obama with Iran than we Russians would give up drinking Wodka. Is he stupid, or naive or both asked the grizzled international veteran, and added, "we look forward to working President Obama". When asked if he left out working "with" President Obama, the staffer smiled and left the room.

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What is naive is to think it is a good idea to **** around in another great power's backyard. It is unlikely to even achieve much except help to destabilise the global balance of power further.

The US threw Poland to the wolves in '45. Why is anyone surprised when they do it again?

Russia is no more threatening to me then being surrounded by US technology on all fronts.

Triad said:

:doh

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The last Democrat liked to drop his pants.
That was far less dangerous than what this clown wants to do.
Drop it for the Russians and Iranians.

I hope they wear condoms.

Joby said:

No, NATO works most of the time, while missile shields fail miserably more often than not.

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Don't most missile development programs?

Joby said:

Well, apparently the Russians also saw through the charade about how the missile shield was to protect against Iran. But the thing is, the missile shield is set for 10 interceptor missiles in Poland. As Vader pointed out, the only good it can do in regards to Russia is as a bargaining chip. If we can get cooperation from the Russians regarding Iran as well as easier supply lines into Afghanistan then it'll be worth the trade-off (not to mention, Euro's would certainly be happy with better relations between the West and Russia. Especially the thousands who froze during the recent gas dispute).

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I wouldn’t even know where ppl and NYT get all these rumors and thoughts. What is the purpose of the cheap falsifications? Translated version of http://lenta.ru/news/2009/03/03/nooffer/
Previously, this information was commented by Dmitry Medvedev. The Russian president said that he conducts a dialogue with the American leadership on plans to place missile defense system in Poland and the Czech Republic, but the possibility of "any exchanges [of favors]" had not been brought up in the dialogue so far.

RIA Novosti - Russia - Obama 'ready to drop shield plans for Russian help on Iran'



RIA Novosti - World - Kazakhstan, Russia sign contract on S-300 air defense systems

ASTANA, March 4 (RIA Novosti) - Kazakhstan has signed a contract with Russia on the purchase of S-300 air defense missile systems, the Kazakh defense minister said on Wednesday.

The latest version of the S-300 family is the S-300PMU2 Favorit, which has a range of up to 195 kilometers (about 120 miles) and can intercept aircraft and ballistic missiles at altitudes from 10 meters to 27 kilometers.
It is considered one of the world's most effective all-altitude regional air defense systems, comparable in performance to the U.S. MIM-104 Patriot system.
The CSTO is a post-Soviet security grouping comprising
1.Armenia,
2.Belarus,
3.Kazakhstan,
4.Kyrgyzstan,
5.Russia,
6.Uzbekistan
7.and Tajikistan.

I wouldn’t even know where all these fantasies about Russian firing nukes do come from?




It is not a way to get cooperation. It is a way to get cornered by Russians. It is a way to spend billions we don’t have for things which of no use, when all Russians have to do is to move a few old rockets on their own territory. It is not like they even have to use the rockets in a hypothetical situation, - that would be too expensive, - a few bare hands, knives and some explosives would suffice. Don't get too close to the body, don't get too close to Russia.

The stakes in the situation are huge. The US has cornered itself. It is all now up to Russians. Of course, the US can continue on the way to a war… Obama and Democrats will desperately need a bigger war as a natural part of their stimulus plan. The only thing which plays for us is that Russia DOES need the US. One has to enter a conversation with Russia and see what they have in mind… one has to be unemotional, careful, smart and capable of taking pain. Unfortunately Russia does not need weak America, and Obama is set to make America weak.. Unfortunately Russia does not need stupid and careless America… and there is no one there even with a quarter of intelligence of Russian counterparts. It is all up to Russians now, we have no chips to bargain, no muscles to flex, no brains to turn the situation around. I hope for the best, but looking at Obama and Hillary, I get a shiver… It is all bad, very bad.

Joby said:

While Russia is emerging from the post-Cold War slump they are nowhere near the capabilities they had before the fall, especially in regards to their Navy, nuclear submarines in particular. I was wary of hearing Cheney introduce the idea of a 'new cold war' a few years back (likely in part to justify defense contracts for obsolete, ultra-expensive cold war weapons), and am optimistic that can be avoided.

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Just to remind you, just a few words:
All military of the State of Georgia, all equiped and trained by the US and NATO against a Russsian Army #58 equiped with drunk commanders and falling apart ancient tanks. Russia just moved a finger. Don't get too close to the body, don't get too close to Russia.