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Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban

WillRockwell said:
I don't appreciate you leaping to conclusions about "my argument"...this seems to be standard procedure in any firearms discussion.
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I don't appreciate your constant usage of logical fallacies. In every single post you are dumping nothing but logical fallacy after logical fallacy.

WillRockwell said:
We are talking about restricting weapons, not driving, not procreation. You do understand that in imagining "a bunch of people with small weapons giving our military a hard time" you are describing the ongoing murder of American military personnel? And you consider this patriotism?
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Your acting as if for some reason in America only that our military will defy thousands of years of history and not listen to the government when they order them to do something bad to citizens.

Your argument is uninformed and unrealistic.

WillRockwell said:
I have no intention of Googling recent mass murders to research the types of weapons used.
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A logical fallacy followed by no attempt to support your argument.

So you can make statements as fact and not have to research it, I must know where you get your supreme knowledge.
 
Coming into this late... wow there have been a lot of replies!

For my understanding, can some pro-gun people explain something to me?

Why do you want to own an assault rifle? Is it in case you need to fight your government? Fend off an intruder? Do you plan to go hunting with one? Or is it "just because"?

I don't really understand the need to have an assault rifle. Also, can someone explain to me if the constitution mentions unlimited access to any firearm, or if it's just to "firearms" as a rule? If the latter, then the government can technically restrict your firearms all they want, as long as you have access to some, no?
 
Orius said:
Coming into this late... wow there have been a lot of replies!

For my understanding, can some pro-gun people explain something to me?

Why do you want to own an assault rifle? Is it in case you need to fight your government? Fend off an intruder? Do you plan to go hunting with one? Or is it "just because"?

I don't really understand the need to have an assault rifle. Also, can someone explain to me if the constitution mentions unlimited access to any firearm, or if it's just to "firearms" as a rule? If the latter, then the government can technically restrict your firearms all they want, as long as you have access to some, no?
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irrelevant.



btw, which part of "shall not be infringed" is giving you pause?
 
Orius said:
It wasn't in jest, I'm asking questions because I don't know.
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what? why i want to own what you call an "assault rifle"?


Why not?

Why do some people want to kite board?

Why do some people hate soccer?

Why do some people box?


Why do some people prepare for natural disasters?

Why do some people get doctorates in chinese medicine?


I guess I don't really understand your question.
 
WillRockwell said:
It doesn't take much to prove you wrong. Take Dylan Harris, for example: Hi-Point 995 Carbine 9 mm semi-automatic rifle with thirteen 10-round magazines, fired 96 times.
The only house of cards here is you and your apeasement of mass murderers.
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This weapon was not considered an "assault rifle" under the previous AWB.....


It is basically a large 9mm pistol with a stock.



FAIL


:lol:
 
Orius said:
Coming into this late... wow there have been a lot of replies!

For my understanding, can some pro-gun people explain something to me?

Why do you want to own an assault rifle? Is it in case you need to fight your government? Fend off an intruder? Do you plan to go hunting with one? Or is it "just because"?

I don't really understand the need to have an assault rifle. Also, can someone explain to me if the constitution mentions unlimited access to any firearm, or if it's just to "firearms" as a rule? If the latter, then the government can technically restrict your firearms all they want, as long as you have access to some, no?
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All of them, fighting the gov't is a particular use for that weapon though.

And no they can't restrict it, talking of the US, although it depends on your intepretation of the constitution to a degree. If you use the one the interpretation that even the pro-central gov't Hamilton prefered of a strict construction then they cannot because the constitution grants the feds no power to do this(without twisting words and such.).
 
WillRockwell said:
It doesn't take much to prove you wrong. Take Dylan Harris, for example: Hi-Point 995 Carbine 9 mm semi-automatic rifle with thirteen 10-round magazines, fired 96 times.
The only house of cards here is you and your apeasement of mass murderers.
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lol, maybe you should get your story straight on what an assault rifle is.

A pistol with a stock on it, that's still not full auto or select fire.. is not an assault rifle.

Try again.

winston53660 said:
Here I will do you a favor:

YouTube - Armed Bank Robbery
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What's funny about this, they were using full auto ak47s. Your average citizen cannot buy those legally (already under NFA law), so that makes your post irrelevant.

Please try again.

Orius said:
Coming into this late... wow there have been a lot of replies!

For my understanding, can some pro-gun people explain something to me?

Why do you want to own an assault rifle? Is it in case you need to fight your government? Fend off an intruder? Do you plan to go hunting with one? Or is it "just because"?

I don't really understand the need to have an assault rifle. Also, can someone explain to me if the constitution mentions unlimited access to any firearm, or if it's just to "firearms" as a rule? If the latter, then the government can technically restrict your firearms all they want, as long as you have access to some, no?
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I won't be a douche to you.

Most people ask why I want a 338 lapua magnum... at $5 a round, and a bullet that's still supersonic at 1 mile. Many say, it's way too much of a round for a normal person to have... same with my friends who have 50 bmgs.

The same could be said to anyone who drives a luxury car, or sports car when they don't need it. But, because our nation was built the way it is... we as citizens have no need, nor should we ever be compelled to explain why we need any of our rights. When you start explaining why you need them.. that's when it becomes easier for them to take them under other justifications.

As for ar15s and ak47s (civilian versions of course). They're fun to shoot... and well... they're pretty well designed to kill zombies.

Reverend_Hellh0und said:
This weapon was not considered an "assault rifle" under the previous AWB.....

It is basically a large 9mm pistol with a stock.

FAIL


:lol:
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Did you honestly believe he'd post anything relevant / factual?
 
stevenb said:
What's funny about this, they were using full auto ak47s. Your average citizen cannot buy those legally (already under NFA law), so that makes your post irrelevant.
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It isn't that hard to figure how to convert these weapons.

Oh and here is a tid bit from the front page of the NYT:

PHOENIX — The Mexican agents who moved in on a safe house full of drug dealers last May were not prepared for the fire power that greeted them.

When the shooting was over, eight agents were dead. Among the guns the police recovered was an assault rifle traced back across the border to a dingy gun store here called X-Caliber Guns.

Now, the owner, George Iknadosian, will go on trial on charges he sold hundreds of weapons, mostly AK-47 rifles, to smugglers, knowing they would send them to a drug cartel in the western state of Sinaloa. The guns helped fuel the gang warfare in which more than 6,000 Mexicans died last year.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/26/us/26borders.html?scp=1&sq=US is a vast Arms Bazzar&st=cse
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BTW I have not stated my position on the AWB. And when I see things like the above going I have serious concerns about these weapons even though I do think we have the RIGHT to own these weapons.
 
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Orius said:
Coming into this late... wow there have been a lot of replies!

For my understanding, can some pro-gun people explain something to me?

Why do you want to own an assault rifle? Is it in case you need to fight your government? Fend off an intruder? Do you plan to go hunting with one? Or is it "just because"?

I don't really understand the need to have an assault rifle. Also, can someone explain to me if the constitution mentions unlimited access to any firearm, or if it's just to "firearms" as a rule? If the latter, then the government can technically restrict your firearms all they want, as long as you have access to some, no?
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I asked the same questions at the beginning of the thread. They won't answer, they just get defensive and violent. I originally said that gun owners must of necessity be more responsible and mature than the average person - the resonse of these contributors has caused me to doubt that belief.
 
WillRockwell said:
I asked the same questions at the beginning of the thread. They won't answer, they just get defensive and violent. I originally said that gun owners must of necessity be more responsible and mature than the average person - the resonse of these contributors has caused me to doubt that belief.
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I answered it twice. please review the thread.


btw, how does one get "violent" in a thread? Are you ok? :lol:
 
Wessexman said:
Where has he appeased them? He simply does not want to remove the rights and liberties of citizens. Your post makes no sense.
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It only makes sense if you THINK. By guaranteeing the rights of people to own weapons with more firepower than law enforcement, capable of firing unlimited rounds in a short amount of time, you are not only appeasing, but enabling potential mass murderers and terrorists.
 
WillRockwell said:
I think it's pretty clear that the hardcore firearms enthusiasts believe they need weapons for a pending overthrow of the government, and that "liberals" know that overthrow is coming and use "firearm regulation" to try to disarm the "patriots" before they can rise up. We really are on different planets.
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Yes... and yours is nowhere near here.
 
WillRockwell said:
You are wrong, and make the same mistake as other 2nd amendment apologists of attributing automatic "liberal" motives for my response. You can't seem to understand that a person can approve of firearms, support hunting, yet feel the need to restrict certain firearms which can be used to commit mass murder. My point is that a gun owner, who by definition must be a responsible adult, should understand that certain guns should not be available to certain people. This opinion is not an excuse to begin taking away your guns, and is not in violation of the 2nd amendment.
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Banning any firearm is a violation of the 2nd, as the 2nd amendment protects all firearms.
 
WillRockwell said:
It doesn't take much to prove you wrong. Take Dylan Harris, for example: Hi-Point 995 Carbine 9 mm semi-automatic rifle with thirteen 10-round magazines, fired 96 times.
The only house of cards here is you and your apeasement of mass murderers.
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You DO know that the gun you mention, above, was purchased while the 1994 AW ban was in place - right?
 
Orius said:
For my understanding, can some pro-gun people explain something to me?

Why do you want to own an assault rifle? Is it in case you need to fight your government? Fend off an intruder? Do you plan to go hunting with one? Or is it "just because"?
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You are confusing the term assault rifle with 'assault weapon'. They are not the same thing.

The response is: the same reason I want to be able to wear a jacket emblazoned with the words "F--- THE DRAFT" into a federal courthouse --- it is my right to do so, should I find it necessary.


I don't really understand the need to have an assault rifle. Also, can someone explain to me if the constitution mentions unlimited access to any firearm, or if it's just to "firearms" as a rule?
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The term used is "arms"
However far you want to extend that term, it certainly covers all firearms.

If the latter, then the government can technically restrict your firearms all they want, as long as you have access to some, no?
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Not any more than they could ban the Roman Catholic Church, under the argument that you can still be a Baptist.
 
WillRockwell said:
I asked the same questions at the beginning of the thread. They won't answer
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This is a lie. -I- answered your question; you have failed to address that answer.
 
winston53660 said:
It isn't that hard to figure how to convert these weapons.

Oh and here is a tid bit from the front page of the NYT:



BTW I have not stated my position on the AWB. And when I see things like the above going I have serious concerns about these weapons even though I do think we have the RIGHT to own these weapons.
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Really?

And then it becomes illegal under the NFA.

I could do lots of things that *would* be illegal.. but... just because I *can* do them... doesn't mean that I *WILL* do them.

Liberty is a two way road, you have to take the good with the bad.

WillRockwell said:
It only makes sense if you THINK. By guaranteeing the rights of people to own weapons with more firepower than law enforcement, capable of firing unlimited rounds in a short amount of time, you are not only appeasing, but enabling potential mass murderers and terrorists.
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You're still talking about machine guns... When you're ready to talk about what your average citizen can own legally let us know.
 
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