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Thread: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet G. S

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    [
    QUOTE=W_Heisenberg;1071976154]We know that's not true because Russia did nothing in response to the sanctions.
    And now we are relying upon the good faith of Russia.
    Maybe Russia was just trying to continue to create chaos-- you know, fan the flames with those who thought Trump had conspired with Russia.

    So, I have examined that issue too. So there was a huge difference between what Russia did in 2012 and prior, and what it did in 2016. The 2016 active measures campaign against us was a far more serious, and well-cordinated endeavor on Russia's part. Your characterization of 2012 and 2016 being similar is grossly inaccurate to the point of it being a lie.

    And if you want to go through what happened in 2012 point by point. I have the time and inclination to do so in order to prove you wrong. So let's get started. Where would you like to begin with respect to 2012 and prior?
    I have no idea what Russia did in 2012. I do know that Obama thought Romney was wrong when the latter stated that Russia was the great for to the USA.
    I do know that Obama did nothing in 2016-- until Clinton lost. Then suddenly Russian involvement became a big issue.

    This is another lie. Mueller did not disagree. I know you love Trump and are trying to do everything possible to protect him, but you really need to stop lying on his behalf. You are completely mischaracterizing what Mueller said, to the point of lying.

    https://docs.house.gov/meetings/IG/I...t-20190724.pdf
    We already know that the FBI didn't think he was a security threat because they dropped the investigation.
    And we know that the FBI didn't think the transcripts showed any law violations because Comey said there wasn't a criminal or national security threat.
    We have the tapes.
    All you are trying to do here is insinuate there is some super secret stuff somewhere that if revealed will show all.


    It does not matter that the FBI concluded Flynn was not a threat.
    Of course it does. Why waste time on a non-threat?

    It matters that the FBI noticed Flynn lying about the call to White House officials. The FBI then became duty-bound to examine the old evidence in light of the new evidence.
    There wasn't any new evidence. They knew what was actually said.
    I do not understand why this is so difficult to understand.


    Flynn's lie was material and directly impeded the FBI's counterintelligence investigation into Russia's attempts to interfere in the 2016 election.
    Flynn wasn't being interviewed in pursuit of investigating Russian interference.
    He was being interviewed in pursuit of Trump conspiracy with that interference.

    Flynn's lie was material to a possible violation of the Logan Act. Furthermore, it is normal for a criminal suspect to be charged and convicted with lying even though they are not charged and convicted with some related crime.

    I thought we agreed that the Logan Act precept was nonsense.

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    Quote Originally Posted by W_Heisenberg View Post
    This comment doesn't make any sense.

    We know Russia did not retaliate in return by expelling our diplomats, upon Flynn's requested, and as we would have been expected Russia to have done:

    Putin says Russia will not expel anyone in response to US sanctions

    So this has nothing whatsoever to do with trusting on the good faith of Russia. They simply chose not to retaliate by expelling our diplomats. We know they did not do this because those diplomats were not sent home.
    You are assuming that expelling some American diplomats would be more important for Russia than helping foster a narrative that the new president had conspired with Russia to fix the election.
    I think its clear at this point Putin made the right decision for his national interests.

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    Quote Originally Posted by Athanasius68 View Post
    Fortunately, we now know there was nothing for either to cover: There was no conspiracy by Trump and/or his campaign to fix the election.
    So the theory about "cover" is without factual basis.
    We know that Trump welcomed the Russian help and expected to benefit from it so it is logical to believe Putin expected to benefit from it too.

    Trump Administration Made Secret Efforts To Ease Russia Sanctions : NPR
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.
    - Voltaire

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    Quote Originally Posted by Athanasius68 View Post
    Flynn said Russia should not overreact. Its not clear why that was a bad thing.
    It's because in doing so he was negating the effect of the diplomatic expulsions and the sanctions.

    It's not that complicated.

    Whether opposition to sanctions is contrary to national issues is a policy issue which is of no business of the FBI.
    It is with respect to the Logan Act. It is with respect to counterintelligence -- because if someone is doing something contrary to U.S. national interests and the action creates the suspicion that person is an agent of the foreign government -- especially within the context of an ongoing and broader counterintelligence investigation the FBI becomes obligated to investigate. And the lies Flynn told about his calls with Kislyak created a situation where it clearly became the business of the FBI.
    I'm the globalist your racist, MAGA-hat wearing uncle warned you about.

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    Quote Originally Posted by Athanasius68 View Post
    Yet you find it perfectly acceptable to go after Flynn in such circumstances? That isn't 'normal.'
    1. We need not rely solely on the Logan Act. In fact, the primary concern the FBI had was from a counterintelligence angle.

    2. The FBI reacted normally. What's not normal is FLYNN's BEHAVIOR. Flynn's behavior is NOT NORMAL. That's what made Flynn's behavior suspicious. It's not normal for soon-to-be U.S. officials to take money from a foreign government, not report it, lie about it on national television, have dinner with the leader of that particular foreign country, and subsequent to an active measures campaign against the U.S., try to intervene in U.S. foreign policy when having no official authority to do so.

    THAT is not normal.

    THAT is strange.

    THAT is worthy of investigation.

    And then the idiot lied about it. Flynn lied about it. Not the FBI. Not Obama. Not Clinton. Not Comey. Not Strzok. Flynn. Flynn lied.
    I'm the globalist your racist, MAGA-hat wearing uncle warned you about.

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    Quote Originally Posted by Athanasius68 View Post
    The thing about Flynn is that he was a guy who was prosecuted in order to get him to divulge the information he had about the Trump/Russia conspiracy.
    YES! This is what the FBI does ALL the time with EVERYONE they suspect of being involved in a criminal conspiracy.

    Flynn was not treated any differently.
    I'm the globalist your racist, MAGA-hat wearing uncle warned you about.

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    Quote Originally Posted by Athanasius68 View Post
    Those people who called such a conspiracy bunk over the past few years have been proven correct and the dropping of charges supports this.
    The fact that the Special Counsel could not prove a conspiracy beyond a reasonable doubt does NOT mean Flynn was treated unfairly, and it does NOT mean that Flynn's case should be dropped, and it does NOT mean that the FBI erred in conducting the investigation.

    The whole point of an investigation is to discover the truth of a thing.

    An investigation does not fail if it cannot find enough evidence to prove a crime beyond a reasonable doubt.

    An investigation is not a goal.

    An investigation is a process.

    If investigators knew the outcome of an investigation beforehand there would never be any investigations of anything, ever.

    If investigators were afraid that an investigation would not ultimately produce evidence provable of a crime beyond a reasonable doubt, there would be very few investigations. The only investigations you would likely see is for investigations in which the evidence is already overwhelming. But this not how our law enforcement agencies generally work. Our law enforcement agencies generally have to do the hard work of uncovering evidence. Investigations don't usually just fall in the lap of investigators.

    You keep making this point in an attempt to protect your cult leader, but you're wrong. This propagandistic argument you keep making has no basis in the actual reality of what law enforcement does on a day-to-day basis.

    And as we now know there was no reason to think there ever was a conspiracy.
    This is a lie. Read the Special Counsel's report. After you've read the Special Counsel's report you will have knowledge that there were very good reasons to suspect a conspiracy.
    I'm the globalist your racist, MAGA-hat wearing uncle warned you about.

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    Quote Originally Posted by Athanasius68 View Post
    You are assuming that expelling some American diplomats would be more important for Russia than helping foster a narrative that the new president had conspired with Russia to fix the election.
    I think its clear at this point Putin made the right decision for his national interests.
    1. What the **** does this have to do with "trusting" Russia?

    2. You are pushing a false dichotomy. It's a logical fallacy to assume that Russia MUST have either been trying to foster a narrative that Trump conspired with Russia OR actually trying to avoid punishment.

    3. When the Russian government did not get what they wanted from the Trump administration, because Congress -- NOT TRUMP -- found its spine and stood up for America, they expelled over 700 hundred diplomats from Russia:

    Russia Expels 755 U.S. Diplomats - The Atlantic
    I'm the globalist your racist, MAGA-hat wearing uncle warned you about.

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    Quote Originally Posted by W_Heisenberg View Post
    YES! This is what the FBI does ALL the time with EVERYONE they suspect of being involved in a criminal conspiracy.

    Flynn was not treated any differently.
    Your forbearance in the face of blatant lies and unserious arguments is again, commendable. I just wanted to note this: Flynn was prosecuted because he was guilty. The plea deal, as I noted earlier, relieved him of prosecution of more serious charges because he agreed to cooperate. It is convenient of your interlocutors to ignore this and minimize Flynn's other misconduct, but it still exists. Someone even claimed here "no one gets prosecuted" for FARA violations, which will be news to to Paul Manafort, Richard Gates and Sam Patten, among others.

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    Re: Federal judge hires high-powered D.C. attorney to defend his actions in Flynn case Judge Emmet

    When Flynn said this:
    FLYNN: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I understand. Okay, um, okay. Listen, uh, a couple of things. Number one, what I would ask you guys to do - and make sure you, make sure that you convey this, okay? - do not, do not uh, allow this administration to box us in, right now, okay? Um -
    KISLYAK: We have conveyed it.
    Was that an effort to support the national security of the United States, or was he asking for another political favor from a foreign adversary? It was made clear to Russia that OBAMA, not Putin, was the administration's adversary. That is why I think Judge Sullivan reacted unfavorably. He was mindful of the United States Constitution, Article III, section 3, which reads, in pertinent part:
    Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.
    Russia attacked the United States. It was an act of cyber warfare. A cyber attack is considered both hostile and an act of war. So who, exactly, is the "enemy" in this scenario? Were not his reassurance intended to give "comfort" to the Russian authorities?
    Last edited by NWRatCon; 05-31-20 at 04:35 PM.

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