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Kremlin says U.S. allegations Russia is working to re-elect Trump are false

Oborosen said:
What truth? We've already seen that Russia had at best, a minimal effect on the voter base during 2016 and even then they were doing crap that benefited both Trump and Hillary.

Hell, they weren't even the only country found to be meddling in our election and for some reason people are so latched onto Russia for some damn reason.

I can use the "not letting anyone talk" defense against the democrats as well. Seeing as it shows that they don't want anyone seeing through their lies.
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To the bolded: :thumbs:

All this is little more than feeding the fauxrage machine, sowing

Russia's purpose in meddling in US elections is to sow the seeds of seeds of discord, division and chaos.


One might legitimately ask why the current uproar against Trump from the US political isn't exactly responding as the Russian's intended?
 
Oborosen said:
While your reply shows that my pity of you was warranted. Feels nice to play by your rules.
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:3oops::3oops:

I didn't know you cared. I'm so embarrassed.

Do you care for me more than you care for Putin? It's okay. I'm not the jealous type.
 
Michael Cole said:
Why are you sticking up for Russia? I don't give a damn how minimum it was. And Trump has told us nothing.

Repeating the obvious tells me nothing, obo.
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Seeing as I'm not sticking up for Russia in anyway here. I'm just stating the obvious.

Try and twist what I'm saying all you like. It only makes you look desperate.
 
Michael Cole said:
True, but our IC has proved meddling. What we should be doing is a counterattack. Leave the politics at home. And Trump needs to tell us WTF is going on. I'm not holding my breath.
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A free and open society with free and open elections to launch 'a counterattack' against the elections of a society which is neither free nor open nor free elections?

Leads to the serious question as to how this might be accomplished, for one, and for two, if an escalating war of election meddling is really something the US wants to engage in, should engage in.
 
JacksinPA said:
Kremlin says U.S. allegations Russia is working to re-elect Trump are false - Reuters

MOSCOW (Reuters) - The Kremlin said on Friday that allegations from U.S. intelligence officials that Russia is interfering in the 2020 election campaign and trying to boost President Donald Trump’s re-election chances are false and the result of paranoia.

A person familiar with the matter said on Thursday that U.S. intelligence officials had told U.S. lawmakers last week that Russia was interfering in the 2020 election campaign by aiming to cast doubt on the integrity of the vote to boost Trump’s re-election.
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Paranoia, huh? Three & a half years of Trump have me looking into rehab facilities already.
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Well what would expect the Kremlin to say? Would you expect the Kremlin to admit it if they had done it? Really?
 
eohrnberger said:
A free and open society with free and open elections to launch 'a counterattack' against the elections of a society which is neither free nor open nor free elections?

Leads to the serious question as to how this might be accomplished, for one, and for two, if an escalating war of election meddling is really something the US wants to engage in, should engage in.
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Bad choice of words on my part. Thanks for pointing it out. Good job, actually. :mrgreen:

What are we doing to secure our elections? That's what I mean.
 
Oborosen said:
Seeing as I'm not sticking up for Russia in anyway here. I'm just stating the obvious.

Try and twist what I'm saying all you like. It only makes you look desperate.
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Minimizing the effects and scope of Russian meddling is indeed sticking up for Russia. Utilizing whataboutism also shows you sticking up for Russia.
 
eohrnberger said:
To the bolded: :thumbs:

All this is little more than feeding the fauxrage machine, sowing

Russia's purpose in meddling in US elections is to sow the seeds of seeds of discord, division and chaos.


One might legitimately ask why the current uproar against Trump from the US political isn't exactly responding as the Russian's intended?
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When it comes to the current left side in the US, they don't even need to hear "Russia" to have an issue with Trump. Literally everything the man does, is going to tweak them off in some fashion.

I'm pretty tired of it at this point honestly.
 
Michael Cole said:
Minimizing the effects and scope of Russian meddling is indeed sticking up for Russia. Utilizing whataboutism also shows you sticking up for Russia.
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You're still falling deeper into desperation I see.
 
Michael Cole said:
Bad choice of words on my part. Thanks for pointing it out. Good job, actually. :mrgreen:

What are we doing to secure our elections? That's what I mean.
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Agreed. The US needs to secure the elections against meddling by all entities, be they foreign or domestic.

From that point, it would appear to be pretty good already. The election results are collected in a distributed system, typically hard to alter or influence vs. a centralized system.

Now if you are referring to various sources of 'information' specific to candidates, positions, and such, well, that's a far more nebulous endeavor and a far more subjective evaluation, isn't it?
 
Oborosen said:
When it comes to the current left side in the US, they don't even need to hear "Russia" to have an issue with Trump. Literally everything the man does, is going to tweak them off in some fashion.

I'm pretty tired of it at this point honestly.
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Agreed. Repeating the same substanceless narratives over and over do not increase their credibility in the least, in fact, it decreases their credibility.
 
Oborosen said:
When it comes to the current left side in the US, they don't even need to hear "Russia" to have an issue with Trump. Literally everything the man does, is going to tweak them off in some fashion.

I'm pretty tired of it at this point honestly.
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Agreed. Repeating the same substanceless narratives over and over do not increase their credibility in the least, in fact, it decreases their credibility.
 
From a recent NYT article:

"Both Republicans and Democrats asked the intelligence agencies to hand over the underlying material that prompted their conclusion that Russia again is favoring Mr. Trump’s election." (Lawmakers Are Warned That Russia Is Meddling to Re-elect Trump - The New York Times)

Notice, the media is pushing the story that Russia is helping both Trump and Sanders, but no info has yet to actually be provided.
 
eohrnberger said:
Agreed. The US needs to secure the elections against meddling by all entities, be they foreign or domestic.

From that point, it would appear to be pretty good already. The election results are collected in a distributed system, typically hard to alter or influence vs. a centralized system.

Now if you are referring to various sources of 'information' specific to candidates, positions, and such, well, that's a far more nebulous endeavor and a far more subjective evaluation, isn't it?
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Yes, it is. And from this standpoint, we can distinguish foreign propaganda from subjective opinion.

Sadly, we have a president and GOP that refuse to acknowledge this.
 
Oborosen said:
The left couldn't prove that Russia stole the election for Trump before. So I don't think they have much of a chance in doing so this time around either.
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What constantly keeps getting mentioned is "Russian interference" without ever presenting what that "interference" actually means in real terms.
 
Mr. Invisible said:
From a recent NYT article:

"Both Republicans and Democrats asked the intelligence agencies to hand over the underlying material that prompted their conclusion that Russia again is favoring Mr. Trump’s election." (Lawmakers Are Warned That Russia Is Meddling to Re-elect Trump - The New York Times)

Notice, the media is pushing the story that Russia is helping both Trump and Sanders, but no info has yet to actually be provided.
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One of the many reasons why it's standard practice to wait at least 24hrs, before deciding anything concerning this story.
 
Mr. Invisible said:
What constantly keeps getting mentioned is "Russian interference" without ever presenting what that "interference" actually means in real terms.
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We know that they bought several thousand dollars in Facebook adds for one... whoopee...
 
Oborosen said:
We know that they bought several thousand dollars in Facebook adds for one... whoopee...
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If a Facebook ad can change someone's voting, and I'd have to question even how many people are even seeing that ad, then we have much, much bigger problems than alleged 'Russian interference.'
 
Mr. Invisible said:
If a Facebook ad can change someone's voting, and I'd have to question even how many people are even seeing that ad, then we have much, much bigger problems than alleged 'Russian interference.'
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Interference is much more complex than Facebook, but since you bring up ads.

Of course advertising influences people's votes. Suggesting otherwise is pretty damn lame.
 
Michael Cole said:
Interference is much more complex than Facebook, but since you bring up ads.

Of course advertising influences people's votes. Suggesting otherwise is pretty damn lame.
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Yes advertising does influence people's votes, but to what actual extent when controlled for other factors?

Sent from my SM-A305N using Tapatalk
 
Mr. Invisible said:
Yes advertising does influence people's votes, but to what actual extent when controlled for other factors?

Sent from my SM-A305N using Tapatalk
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I don't know. Educated people do. We're paying them to do these things.

What I want from our intelligence community is protection from Russian propaganda taking hold in this country. I prefer a no tolerance approach. Your opinion may differ.

When the President of the United States believes it was Ukraine, and not Russia that meddled in our elections, and a good chunk of the American public thought, at least for a moment, that a secret server was located in Ukraine, it becomes glaringly obvious that something is seriously amiss.
 
Michael Cole said:
I don't know. Educated people do. We're paying them to do these things.

What I want from our intelligence community is protection from Russian propaganda taking hold in this country. I prefer a no tolerance approach. Your opinion may differ.

When the President of the United States believes it was Ukraine, and not Russia that meddled in our elections, and a good chunk of the American public thought, at least for a moment, that a secret server was located in Ukraine, it becomes glaringly obvious that something is seriously amiss.
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The mercenaries who function as your elite will always take your money....whether there is any chance that they will turn in competent work is much less a sure thing.
 
Michael Cole said:
Yes, it is. And from this standpoint, we can distinguish foreign propaganda from subjective opinion.
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True, as we have seen, the impact of the Russian social media effort to influence the US election is minimal to the point of being inconsequential, the US voter not being taken in by it. Seems the US voter is immune from foreign propaganda.

Sadly, we have a president and GOP that refuse to acknowledge this.
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Meh. :shrug:
 
JacksinPA said:
Kremlin says U.S. allegations Russia is working to re-elect Trump are false - Reuters

MOSCOW (Reuters) - The Kremlin said on Friday that allegations from U.S. intelligence officials that Russia is interfering in the 2020 election campaign and trying to boost President Donald Trump’s re-election chances are false and the result of paranoia.

A person familiar with the matter said on Thursday that U.S. intelligence officials had told U.S. lawmakers last week that Russia was interfering in the 2020 election campaign by aiming to cast doubt on the integrity of the vote to boost Trump’s re-election.
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Paranoia, huh? Three & a half years of Trump have me looking into rehab facilities already.
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I remember when Russia's word was gospel when they said they confiscated all of Syria's chemical weapons.
 
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