Letter from White House counsel Pat Cipollone to House leaders

ocean515 · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
Yeah, but that exactly what the Leftists want.

Difficult to argue otherwise.

Perhaps it's because the indoctrination and threats they receive for not toeing the line have conditioned them to prefer such a world.

Good luck selling that outside the corral.

apdst · Oct 9, 2019

haymarket said:
Yes - early stages of this current crime by Trump.

Oh, so before now, he committed no crimes? :lamo

Pound4abrown · Oct 9, 2019

Torus34 said:
Hi! You might be interested to know that Mr. Benito Mussolini used the phrase, 'Drain the swamp'. And so it goes.

Regards.

PS. A quote used without attribution carries with it a whiff of plagiarism, I'm a-thinkin'.

Where is your attribution to Kurt Vonnegut?
Just kidding, I don't care. I just love to mention Vonnegut whenever possible.

apdst · Oct 9, 2019

ocean515 said:
Difficult to argue otherwise.

Perhaps it's because the indoctrination and threats they receive for not toeing the line have conditioned them to prefer such a world.

Good luck selling that outside the corral.

That's why they are chompin at the bit to ban guns. So they can install a single party, with absolute power, that can make up the rules as it goes along.

Nuber · Oct 9, 2019

GDViking said:
I am due in court later today, I think I will just send them a letter stating that I do not recognize their authority over me...

The House does not have absolute and complete power over the President. There are checks and balances in order to provide for co-equal branches of the Federal government. Impeachment is a power that resides with the house, but there are procedures and constitutional laws to be followed in order to impeach (see the OP). Currently the House is not allowing for anyone other than Democrats to subpeona and investigate because of their unprecedented behavior (the Dems are making a power play). House leadership (Pelosi and Schiff) are, I believe, intentionally making this a political issue for political, 2020 election purposes.

Trump has turned the tide of this entire narrative and called out the Democrats - bring a vote on the floor of the house (Trump and the R's are making a counter move). Put your people in the house on record, lets see who will go on record for and against impeachment. Then, we can have fair and full investigations with full discovery by the accusers as well as the accused, similar to the legal protections that we all take for granted on a daily basis.

Perhaps some of this will end up in the courts - the supremes can then weigh in on if one political party can exclusively control the investigation and call it impeachment. If this happens it will likely carry out into next year, and we can have another unprecedented partisan presidential election.

Stand back and watch the show people, this is all about power. Who has it. Who wants it. Who has the moxi to exert the power they do have. And the voters get to see it all unfold...

ocean515 · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
That's why they are chompin at the bit to ban guns. So they can install a single party, with absolute power, that can make up the rules as it goes along.

If you extend the line they are pushing, again, it's difficult to argue otherwise.

From their concepts of free speech, association, individual rights, due process, etc., the path they are on is very clear.

haymarket · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
Oh, so before now, he committed no crimes? :lamo

That might be your opinion. It is not mine.

apdst · Oct 9, 2019

haymarket said:
That might be your opinion. It is not mine.

So we aren't in the "early stages". Right?

apdst · Oct 9, 2019

ocean515 said:
If you extend the line they are pushing, again, it's difficult to argue otherwise.

From their concepts of free speech, association, individual rights, due process, etc., the path they are on is very clear.

One branch of government, controlled by one party.

cabse5 · Oct 9, 2019

Torus34 said:
Oh, my! Overturn the popular will of the voters. The President of the United States of America, in strict accordance with the Constitution of the United States of America, is not, repeat, not elected by 'the popular will of the voters' but, rather, by the Electoral College.

Such is the nonsense we have to deal with from both the right and the left these days.

SIAP. This impeachment inquiry is not the popular will of the voters. There are 435 members of the house. There are (I think) 7 heads of different committees in the house that are trying to advance impeachment inquiry. Let me repeat: ( I think) 7 different heads of committees within the house are advancing this impeachment inquiry in the house and the impeachment inquiry in the house is not the popular will of the people because the entire house has not weighed in on the impeachment inquiry process. Having the entire house weigh in on the impeachment inquiry would make this impeachment inquiry the republican-representative will of the people in the house.

Hatuey · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
It isn't supposed to. This is Trump triple-dog-daring the Democrats to vote on impeachment and the Democrats are going to tuck tail.

Good things Democrats aren't 12 year olds and triple dog daring doesn't work outside of playgrounds.

Phew.

Sent from the Matrioshka in the WH Christmas tree.

apdst · Oct 9, 2019

Hatuey said:
Good things Democrats aren't 12 year olds and triple dog daring doesn't work outside of playgrounds.

Phew.

Sent from the Matrioshka in the WH Christmas tree.

It looks like it's working. :lamo

haymarket · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
So we aren't in the "early stages". Right?

I view it as such.

W_Heisenberg · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
That's why they are chompin at the bit to ban guns. So they can install a single party, with absolute power, that can make up the rules as it goes along.

ocean515 said:
If you extend the line they are pushing, again, it's difficult to argue otherwise.

From their concepts of free speech, association, individual rights, due process, etc., the path they are on is very clear.

I see you both are engaging in a time-honored propaganda tactic amongst the far right:

Accuse the other side of that which you are guilty...

Why So Many Evangelicals Are OK With President Trump's Lies - Pacific Standard

How Do We Know That Trump Supporters Are Authoritarians? | The Rise of Trump

Why Do So Many Americans Continue to Support Donald Trump? In a Word: Authoritarianism | John Dean | Verdict | Legal Analysis and Commentary from Justia

Who Are Trump’s Supporters? : Democracy Journal

How Trump's Embrace Of Authoritarian Rulers Has Impacted The World : NPR

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/06/opinion/campaign-stops/purity-disgust-and-donald-trump.html?_r=1

https://www.niskanencenter.org/trump-supporters-authoritarians/

--

Keep in mind, in this thread, we are discussing the fact that Trump is asserting he is above the Rule of Law, and that Congress is not a co-equal branch entrusted with oversight responsibility as outlined in the Constitution.

haymarket · Oct 9, 2019

cabse5 said:
SIAP. This impeachment inquiry is not the popular will of the voters. There are 435 members of the house. There are (I think) 7 heads of different committees in the house that are trying to advance impeachment inquiry. Let me repeat: ( I think) 7 different heads of committees within the house are advancing this impeachment inquiry in the house and the impeachment inquiry in the house is not the popular will of the people because the entire house has not weighed in on the impeachment inquiry process. Having the entire house weigh in on the impeachment inquiry would make this impeachment inquiry the republican-representative will of the people in the house.

I would like to see the entire House vote to formally investigate him for impeachment. I can support that because it further shoves it up the rear corridor of the fascist Trump. But why do they have to do it that way? Can you point to something in the Constitution or in the House rules which makes this a must?

Harshaw · Oct 9, 2019

bubbabgone said:
The letter has footnotes to legal decisions for everything. Read the link.

No, it doesn't. Most of the citations lead to news stories, journal articles, and Congressional records. There are very few references to "legal decisions."

He didn't even make legal arguments. He made political ones.

Hatuey · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
It looks like it's working. :lamo

Is that why you keep begging Democrats to hold a vote? Cause it's working?

Lol, wow. Talk about being out of your depth.

Sent from the Matrioshka in the WH Christmas tree.

cabse5 · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
One branch of government, controlled by one party.

It's not even that. The house is controlled by (I think) 7 different heads of committees in the house to advance the impeachment process against Trump in the house.

ocean515 · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
One branch of government, controlled by one party.

Eliminate the EC. Objective is clear.

apdst · Oct 9, 2019

Hatuey said:
Is that why you keep begging Democrats to hold a vote? Cause it's working?

Lol, wow. Talk about being out of your depth.

Sent from the Matrioshka in the WH Christmas tree.

Hatuey, have they voted? Are they planning to vote? Nope!...LOL!

ocean515 · Oct 9, 2019

W_Heisenberg said:
I see you both are engaging in a time-honored propaganda tactic amongst the far right:

Accuse the other side of that which you are guilty...

Why So Many Evangelicals Are OK With President Trump's Lies - Pacific Standard

How Do We Know That Trump Supporters Are Authoritarians? | The Rise of Trump

Why Do So Many Americans Continue to Support Donald Trump? In a Word: Authoritarianism | John Dean | Verdict | Legal Analysis and Commentary from Justia

Who Are Trump’s Supporters? : Democracy Journal

How Trump's Embrace Of Authoritarian Rulers Has Impacted The World : NPR

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/06/opinion/campaign-stops/purity-disgust-and-donald-trump.html?_r=1

https://www.niskanencenter.org/trump-supporters-authoritarians/

--

Keep in mind, in this thread, we are discussing the fact that Trump is asserting he is above the Rule of Law, and that Congress is not a co-equal branch entrusted with oversight responsibility as outlined in the Constitution.

Thanks for sharing examples of the propaganda you embrace.

cabse5 · Oct 9, 2019

haymarket said:
I would like to see the entire House vote to formally investigate him for impeachment. I can support that because it further shoves it up the rear corridor of the fascist Trump. But why do they have to do it that way? Can you point to something in the Constitution or in the House rules which makes this a must?

But why do they have to vote in the house to extend the impeachment inquiry? Because that vote would be more like the will of the people since all 435 members of the house (which represent all 50 states) can respond about the impeachment inquiry.

EDIT: And constituents of said representatives can contact their representative to tell them how they should vote.

MTAtech · Oct 9, 2019

apdst said:
The Constitution says, "bribery, treason, high crimes and misdemeanors", too. Congress can't impeach a president for any reason they dream up.

Trying to extort a foreign leader to investigate his presumptive 2020 rival is covered by 'high crime and misdemeanors.' The Founders understood this well. Madison argued that the Constitution needed a provision “for defending the community against the incapacity, negligence, or perfidy of the Chief Magistrate.” Waiting to vote him out of office in a general election wasn’t good enough. “He might pervert his administration into a scheme of peculation” -- embezzlement -- “or oppression,” Madison warned. “He might betray his trust to foreign powers.”

trouble13 · Oct 9, 2019

Parrish said:
POTUS and his lawyers can "prove " their case before the Senate.

No they cant, because the Democrats are not gonna impeach him so it will never reach the senate.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

W_Heisenberg · Oct 9, 2019

ocean515 said:
Thanks for sharing examples of the propaganda you embrace.

I think it's important to speak the truth at all times, even if it hurts, even if this means accurately describing Trump as an authoritarian thug who does not care about the U.S. Constitution.

Letter from White House counsel Pat Cipollone to House leaders

ocean515

apdst

Pound4abrown

apdst

Nuber

ocean515

haymarket

apdst

apdst

cabse5

Hatuey

Rule of Two

apdst

haymarket

W_Heisenberg

haymarket

Harshaw

Filmmaker ● Lawyer ● Patriot

Hatuey

Rule of Two

cabse5

ocean515

apdst

ocean515

cabse5

MTAtech

trouble13

W_Heisenberg