• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Texas loosens firearm laws hours after the state's latest mass shooting left 7 dead

eohrnberger said:
"it is a poor craftsman who blames his tools"

In this situation it is a poor position to blame the tools and not the hand that wields those tools.
Click to expand...

Gun laws only put people in jails....not guns
 
eohrnberger said:

According to the Crime Prevention Research Center, “gun free zones” (areas where guns are prohibited) have been the target of more than 98% of all mass shootings. This staggering number is why such designated areas are often referred to as “soft targets,” meaning unprotected and vulnerable.

“According to the Crime Prevention Research Center, only a little more than 1% of mass public shootings since 1950 have occurred in places that were not considered to be a gun-free zone,” reports The Blaze. “In fact, as Crime Prevention Research Center President John Lott Jr. noted in October 2015, only two mass shootings in the U.S. since 1950 have occurred in an area where citizens were not prohibited from carrying a gun.”
​

I'll just leave this here.
Click to expand...

The last 2 mass shootings in Texas did not occur in 'gun free zones'. As of today, even churches aren't considered gun fee zones by Texas law. If you believe that if a state has gun free zones it's inviting a terrorist attack, you are wrong. This bill even restricts the number of armed marshals a school can hire to protect students.
 
HumblePi said:
The last 2 mass shootings in Texas did not occur in 'gun free zones'. As of today, even churches aren't considered gun fee zones by Texas law. If you believe that if a state has gun free zones it's inviting a terrorist attack, you are wrong. This bill even restricts the number of armed marshals a school can hire to protect students.
Click to expand...

The people in those areas were unarmed.
 
HumblePi said:
The last 2 mass shootings in Texas did not occur in 'gun free zones'.
Click to expand...

OK. Those 2 must be part of the 2% then. :shrug:

As of today, even churches aren't considered gun fee zones by Texas law. If you believe that if a state has gun free zones it's inviting a terrorist attack, you are wrong. This bill even restricts the number of armed marshals a school can hire to protect students.
Click to expand...

:shrug: A bill that contradicts itself. Isn't the first time, and won't be the last time.

I'll leave Texans to run Texas.
 
Cardinal said:
What do you think would happen if every inmate had a gun, apdst?
Click to expand...

I'm not the poster you're asking, but I'd like to answer the question.

First, if you have a prison full of violent criminals, and you give them all guns, my guess is over time, most of them would end up dead. That would be a net benefit for society.

Second, while it lasted, the physically weaker criminals would be better off, as now any criminal could kill any other criminal regardless of his strength, age, or fighting ability. Prison rapes and beatings would become a thing of the past.

My guess is you'd end up with a small group of prisoners who were polite and respectful to one another.
 
HumblePi said:
Texas loosens firearm laws hours after the state's latest mass shooting left 7 dead

A series of new firearm laws go into effect in Texas on Sunday, just hours after a shooting left seven people dead in the western part of the state.
The laws will further loosen gun restrictions in a state that's had four of the 10 deadliest mass shootings in modern US history, including the El Paso shooting last month, when a gunman stormed a Walmart and killed 22 people.
The new measures were all passed during the 2019 legislative session, which ended in June.

Texas gun laws: Weapons will be allowed in churches and on school grounds - CNN
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Allowing more people to have more guns in more public places is certainly not going to reduce the number of terrorists in this country.
Click to expand...

I guess as some point someone who thinks this is a big deal will explain what those laws have to do with mass shootings, or why there's anything interesting about the timing, given the fact that the laws in question were passed months ago.
 
aociswundumho said:
I'm not the poster you're asking, but I'd like to answer the question.

First, if you have a prison full of violent criminals, and you give them all guns, my guess is over time, most of them would end up dead. That would be a net benefit for society.

Second, while it lasted, the physically weaker criminals would be better off, as now any criminal could kill any other criminal regardless of his strength, age, or fighting ability. Prison rapes and beatings would become a thing of the past.

My guess is you'd end up with a small group of prisoners who were polite and respectful to one another.
Click to expand...

And a lot of dead guards
 
apdst said:
1. Use the death penalty more.

2. Arm more citizens.

3. Train police to be able to do a better job of stopping the threat.

4. Harden soft targets.

5. Stop trying to put cops in jail for shooting a suspect, so often. It makes them hesitate to use deadly force. That's why the Odessa shooter was able to drive 20 miles before he was terminated.

This is where you say, "neh, let's just ban guns".
Click to expand...

Thirty states currently have the death penalty, has it helped stop gun violence? I doubt that 'arming more citizens' would help stop gun violence, if anything it would exacerbate it. "Soft targets" in Texas aren't soft. These recent terrorists attacks were not in gun free zones. The police responded to the Walmart shooting in El Paso within minutes. The first 911 call was received at 10:39, and law enforcement was on the scene by 10:45. In Dayton, Ohio the response was even swifter with police officers returning fire with the gunman than that, it was under a minute.
 
apdst said:
Allowing people to be able to defend themselves will reduce crime.
Click to expand...

Not likely, but at least they would be more free to try stop a (violent?) crime in progress. The problem is that criminals do not obey laws while most crime victims do. Creating a "gun free zone" without providing any means to enforce that restriction is like posting speed limit signs without having any highway patrol officers.
 
HumblePi said:
Thirty states currently have the death penalty, has it helped stop gun violence? I doubt that 'arming more citizens' would help stop gun violence, if anything it would exacerbate it. "Soft targets" in Texas aren't soft. These recent terrorists attacks were not in gun free zones. The police responded to the Walmart shooting in El Paso within minutes. The first 911 call was received at 10:39, and law enforcement was on the scene by 10:45. In Dayton, Ohio the response was even swifter with police officers returning fire with the gunman than that, it was under a minute.
Click to expand...

I said use the death penalty more.

The El Paso police didn't arrive until after the shooter left.

The Dayton police response time was an exception, not the rule. No matter how fast the cops arrive, they're still minutes away when seconds count.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Not likely, but at least they would be more free to try stop a (violent?) crime in progress. The problem is that criminals do not obey laws while most crime victims do. Creating a "gun free zone" without providing any means to enforce that restriction is like posting speed limit signs without having any highway patrol officers.
Click to expand...

It's been proven that disarmed citizens can't stop violent crimes.
 
apdst said:
I said use the death penalty more.

The El Paso police didn't arrive until after the shooter left.

The Dayton police response time was an exception, not the rule. No matter how fast the cops arrive, they're still minutes away when seconds count.
Click to expand...

A total of 25 death row inmates were executed in the United States in 2018; of whom 23 died by lethal injection and two, in Tennessee, by electrocution, marking the first calendar year since 2000 in which more than one inmate was executed in that way.

The first 911 call was received at 10:39, and law enforcement was on the scene by 1045. The suspect was in custody 21 minutes later, at 11:06. This is a strong response from the El Paso law enforcement community, and they deserve credit for what they accomplished. Your claim is an absolute outright lie.

How do you propose, as you've stated, that police should be more "trained to stop the threat"?
 
Last edited:
Texas is now even better state with updated firearm laws? If so, this should be done by every state, ASAP.

I can't see how any country is better with such addiction to carry guns. Maybe I'm a bit naive, because I think that guns are scary things. Here (in small country) whole police force shoot around 10 times / year (total and population is 5,5 million; in 10 years 112 shots and 7 dead (shot by police). This shooting for me is just what I can see in movies or TV shows, outside of this "entertainment" I have zero experience related to shootings. I'm just trying to say how rare it is here. I know we have some criminals with guns, but never seen those in anywhere and I can't even remember when someone get shot at school (I know one, but it happened long long time ago).

Guess what, I'm happy without guns - I don't want people with guns around at all. It's better this way, but seems like some of you guys really don't get it (European's way to think about guns). If this American gun-happy-culture is superior to all different systems out there - why people in EU don't change firearm laws too? Don't you ever ask why US is only place with this kind of mentality? (and if it's better than others why so?). I really like to know logical explanation and how this can be good for Americans. For now, I'm pretty sure that negatives out weight positives.
 
HumblePi said:
Texas loosens firearm laws hours after the state's latest mass shooting left 7 dead

A series of new firearm laws go into effect in Texas on Sunday, just hours after a shooting left seven people dead in the western part of the state.
The laws will further loosen gun restrictions in a state that's had four of the 10 deadliest mass shootings in modern US history, including the El Paso shooting last month, when a gunman stormed a Walmart and killed 22 people.
The new measures were all passed during the 2019 legislative session, which ended in June.

Texas gun laws: Weapons will be allowed in churches and on school grounds - CNN
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Allowing more people to have more guns in more public places is certainly not going to reduce the number of terrorists in this country.
Click to expand...

On the "International Click-Bait Scale" the headline of the article rates at least an 85.

PS - I realize that you didn't write the headline so don't think that I am castigating you for something that you didn't do.
 
HumblePi said:
A total of 25 death row inmates were executed in the United States in 2018; of whom 23 died by lethal injection and two, in Tennessee, by electrocution, marking the first calendar year since 2000 in which more than one inmate was executed in that way.

The first 911 call was received at 10:39, and law enforcement was on the scene by 1045. The suspect was in custody 21 minutes later, at 11:06. This is a strong response from the El Paso law enforcement community, and they deserve credit for what they accomplished. Your claim is an absolute outright lie.

How do you propose, as you've stated, that police should be more "trained to stop the threat"?
Click to expand...

There are 2,629 inmates on death row. 23 is about 1%. We need that number up around 90%, with more death sentences and fewer life sentences.

Nope! No lie!...

Responding officers had made it to scene just six minutes after the attack was reported, but none ultimately fired their weapons. The gunman surrendered to police “without incident” outside the store

Everything We Know About the El Paso Walmart Shooting
Click to expand...

When seconds count, the cops are minutes away.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom