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China retaliates with tariffs on $75 billion of US goods

Chomsky

Chomsky

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Beijing (CNN)The US-China trade war ratcheted up yet again on Friday, with Beijing unveiling a new round of retaliatory tariffs on about $75 billion worth of US goods.

China will place tariffs of 5% or 10% on US imports starting on September 1st, according to a statement posted by China's Finance Ministry.
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The Ministry also announced plans to resume tariffs on US imports of automobiles and automobile parts. The tariffs would be 25% or 5%, and would take effect on December 15th.
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The new tariffs will target 5,078 products, including soybeans, coffee, whiskey, seafood and crude oil.
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Source: (CNN) China retaliates with tariffs on $75 billion of US goods

I'm not sure what more can be said here. After getting Trump to blink & back down last week during U.S. crashing stock & bond markets, it seems China is now shifting gears and firmly taking the offense in escalating the trade & currency wars.

U.S. manufacturing has contracted for the first time in a decade, and the heightening trade war will only exasperate the contraction. The American consumer is keeping the economy afloat, but a contracting manufacturing sector will eventually trickle-down to less consumer spending. Obviously the manufacturing sector isn't as large a component of the U.S. economy as in days gone by, but it still is an important part of our economy.

It's my opinion that Trump has lost his self-inflicted trade war, and needs to declare victory and move on to something else. That is, if he wants to have an economy commensurate with his gaining re-election.

Additional relevance: For what it's worth, I just checked and the Dow is down nearly 600 pts and the yield curve just inverted again ... oh well ...
 
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Trade wars are easy to win.
 
There is going to be some economic pain as we challenge China and try to de-couple the economies. However, it must be done and the price must be paid. Trading with China and boosting their economy is like enabling the Nazis, China must be confronted and opposed if not just because of how they abuse on trade, but because they pose a major threat to global/national security, democracy and commit major human rights violations.
 
Trump is single-highhandedly destroying America.

It's almost as if he's acting in the interests of our enemies. Same could be said for Moscow Mitch McConnell.
 
Removing the ability of a president to unilaterally initiate a global trade war needs to be high on the list of the next congress. Enough of this ****.
 
The dow is -509 right now. Trump and his shills are going to make billions from stock purchases.
 
digsbe said:
There is going to be some economic pain as we challenge China and try to de-couple the economies. However, it must be done and the price must be paid. Trading with China and boosting their economy is like enabling the Nazis, China must be confronted and opposed if not just because of how they abuse on trade, but because they pose a major threat to global/national security, democracy and commit major human rights violations.
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Yes. No pain, no gain.
 
digsbe said:
There is going to be some economic pain as we challenge China and try to de-couple the economies. However, it must be done and the price must be paid. Trading with China and boosting their economy is like enabling the Nazis, China must be confronted and opposed if not just because of how they abuse on trade, but because they pose a major threat to global/national security, democracy and commit major human rights violations.
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You can't "decouple" from the global economy.
 
Helix said:
Removing the ability of a president to unilaterally initiate a global trade war needs to be high on the list of the next congress. Enough of this ****.
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You mean the do nothing congress should look the other way and allow China to keep ripping us off.
 
Helix said:
Removing the ability of a president to unilaterally initiate a global trade war needs to be high on the list of the next congress. Enough of this ****.
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Yep. Congress has ceded far too much power to the executive branch over the last decades. It's time to bring the power back to the people.
 
trixare4kids said:
You mean the do nothing congress should look the other way and allow China to keep ripping us off.
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I mean the unstable erratic nut in the White House needs to leave. Right message (in general terms), but the wrong messenger.

Trump is setting us up for an economic apocalypse, though the full effects will likely not take place until after he leaves office (I assume/hope in 2020).
 
digsbe said:
There is going to be some economic pain as we challenge China and try to de-couple the economies. However, it must be done and the price must be paid. Trading with China and boosting their economy is like enabling the Nazis, China must be confronted and opposed if not just because of how they abuse on trade, but because they pose a major threat to global/national security, democracy and commit major human rights violations.
Click to expand...
Trump's actions are not carefully planned out tactics. He's erratically lashing out without any plan, idea or concern for the ramifications.

International trade is complex and Trump doesn't have any appreciation for this complexity.
 
HenryChinaski said:
The dow is -509 right now. Trump and his shills are going to make billions from stock purchases.
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Yeah, it slowed and slightly reversed just after I posted - thankfully. In the short several minutes it took to compose my post, the Dow raced from 390 down to around 540 down! I was watching it live.
 
digsbe said:
There is going to be some economic pain....
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Trade wars are easy to win. Why would there be pain?

Sent from the Matrioshka in the WH Christmas tree.
 
Let's just capitulate, and go have lunch.
 
Chomsky said:
Source: (CNN) China retaliates with tariffs on $75 billion of US goods

I'm not sure what more can be said here. After getting Trump to blink & back down last week during U.S. crashing stock & bond markets, it seems China is now shifting gears and firmly taking the offense in escalating the trade & currency wars.

U.S. manufacturing has contracted for the first time in a decade, and the heightening trade war will only exasperate the contraction. The American consumer is keeping the economy afloat, but a contracting manufacturing sector will eventually trickle-down to less consumer spending. Obviously the manufacturing sector isn't as large a component of the U.S. economy as in days gone by, but it still is an important part of our economy.

It's my opinion that Trump has lost his self-inflicted trade war, and needs to declare victory and move on to something else. That is, if he wants to have an economy commensurate with his gaining re-election.

Additional relevance: For what it's worth, I just checked and the Dow is down nearly 600 pts and the yield curve just inverted again ... oh well ...
Click to expand...


No this trade war requires intestinal fortitude. That means dropping the hammer on the Chinese. A full cessation of trade with China. That means full court press of economic pressure, including selling military items to Taiwan and Japan and everyone else there. Playing dirty pool by helping the Uyghurs with intelligence and equipment, and disrupting the camps which they are held so they may escape. Publicly and vociferously supporting Hong Kong and Taiwan and declaring the single China policy null and void. That just the beginning. Everything short of a shooting war. Make it very uncomfortable for the Chinese.
 
MTAtech said:
Trump's actions are not carefully planned out tactics. He's erratically lashing out without any plan, idea or concern for the ramifications.

International trade is complex and Trump doesn't have any appreciation for this complexity.
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He's politically astute though, and sees the political danger he's in. What else could have gotten him to back-down against China last week? And now surprising to him I suspect, after he backs down China does a surprise escalation!

I don't think Trump knows how to react with his opponents being more bombastic than he, taking control of the situation away from him. We saw this with the way Nancy Pelosi slapped him around during the shutdown, taking the lead and controlling the situation.

Anyway, hate to see the country suffer, but better to suffer a little for the next year, if it frees us from suffering under Trump for four more additional years of him being unconstrained politically as a lame duck.
 
Chomsky said:
I mean the unstable erratic nut in the White House needs to leave. Right message (in general terms), but the wrong messenger.

Trump is setting us up for an economic apocalypse, though the full effects will likely not take place until after he leaves office (I assume/hope in 2020).
Click to expand...

There is no concrete proof that the above will happen... I remember when some from this forum predicted Trump would be removed from office by now because Russians...
Do you really think all the concern shown by Trump's comments this morning isn't just more poutrage?
 
Chomsky said:
He's politically astute though, and sees the political danger he's in. What else could have gotten him to back-down against China last week? And now surprising to him I suspect, after he backs down China now does a surprise escalation!

I don't think Trump knows how to react with his opponents being more bombastic than he, taking control of the situation away from him. We saw this with the way Nancy Pelosi slapped him around during the shutdown, taking the lead and controlling the situation.

Anyway, hate to see the country suffer, but better to suffer a little for the next year, if it frees us from suffering under Trump for four additional years of him being unconstrained politically as a lame duck.
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He's looking like he's in a panic -- the economy, that was his pillar of support, is faltering. The polls show an overwhelming level of disapproval.

Ironically, it's making him act even crazier, which loses more support. He'll be luck to survive a 25th Amendment vote of his cabinet. Pelosi is now openly discussing the "I" word.
 
China can endure much more economic pain than we Americans can, add in there's an election next year.

The Republicans in Congress better grow a pair and step on the madman in the WH, or the 2020 election will be a bloodbath for the GOP.. And I'm not just talking about in Washington DC.
 
PirateMk1 said:
No this trade war requires intestinal fortitude. That means dropping the hammer on the Chinese. A full cessation of trade with China. That means full court press of economic pressure, including selling military items to Taiwan and Japan and everyone else there. Playing dirty pool by helping the Uyghurs with intelligence and equipment, and disrupting the camps which they are held so they may escape. Publicly and vociferously supporting Hong Kong and Taiwan and declaring the single China policy null and void. That just the beginning. Everything short of a shooting war. Make it very uncomfortable for the Chinese.
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You are 100% correct...

They don't want Trump to win at anything though and if he doesn't win, the country loses, and you know what, that's OK with them.
**** China!
 
Chomsky said:
Yeah, it slowed and slightly reversed just after I posted - thankfully. In the short several minutes it took to compose my post, the Dow raced from 390 down to around 540 down! I was watching it live.
Click to expand...

Why are you nervous about the stock market volatility? Are you close to retirement? If so you know you can hedge your gains right? Volatility is good because price motion is how one profits from the markets and the larger the motion the larger the profit potential.
 
PirateMk1 said:
No this trade war requires intestinal fortitude. That means dropping the hammer on the Chinese. A full cessation of trade with China. That means full court press of economic pressure, including selling military items to Taiwan and Japan and everyone else there. Playing dirty pool by helping the Uyghurs with intelligence and equipment, and disrupting the camps which they are held so they may escape. Publicly and vociferously supporting Hong Kong and Taiwan and declaring the single China policy null and void. That just the beginning. Everything short of a shooting war. Make it very uncomfortable for the Chinese.
Click to expand...
Your suggestion will plunge the world into a depression worst than the great depression. You must feel you are isolated from the disastrous ramifications, but many will suffer untold miseries and worse, and I think you may be kidding yourself as to your being impervious to the effects or how little others will suffer.
 
SenorXm/Sirius said:
China can endure much more economic pain than we Americans can, add in there's an election next year.

The Republicans in Congress better grow a pair and step on the madman in the WH, or the 2020 election will be a bloodbath for the GOP.. And I'm not just talking about in Washington DC.
Click to expand...

He's sent all the grown-ups to the cornfield or they left. Now, all he has is acting sycophants, who yes him and tell him *that's a very good thing you did, Anthony.*
 
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