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13 arrested, 4 injured at Portland right wing rally: Police

Grand Mal said:
Protesting without permission? Yeah. That's my idea of liberalism, and my idea of America. Antifa, no. Not liberal. Not even close. But yeah, protest is damn near a civic duty in a liberal democracy.
Is asking for permission to protest your idea of America?
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Protesting is one thing, but the streets are for all. To use them, must have a permit.

Where does law and order fit in your world, or are you an anarchist?
 
madasheck said:
No. But walking down the streets wearing armor says what your intentions are.
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Armor is protection. I suppose you ridicule bycyclists wearing helets too?

Now look at Antifa. They hide their faces, because their intent is to break the law, and not be identified.
 
ludin said:
easy they shout down the freedom of others.
they loot attack and threaten people for voicing opinions that
are different than theirs.

They do not believe in free speech or other freedoms unless it is theirs.
They oppose any and all opposition to them with threat of force and use of force.

that pretty much is fascism to a tee.
fascism by definition.

dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy.

while they do not have dictatorial power they are using other methods to accomplish the same goals.
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They're anarchists. The opposite of dictators. You don't know what the hell you're talking about. Do you think anyone who opposes the expression of ideas they disagree with are fascists? Damn. You must be just making this all up as you go along.
Listen. Antifa are anarchists. That means they believe all government is an unnecessary evil. Fascists believe government should violently quash anarchists and anyone who looks like an anarchist. There's many reasons why Antifa needs to be opposed but calling them fascists is just stupid and counter to what you want to accomplish.
Not everyone on the lunatic fringe is a fascist.
 
madasheck said:
Of course you don't see the threat there.
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I see liberal stupidity, making words what they are not.

But then, your side uses code words, and forget that "words have meaning."
 
DiAnna said:
Then we saw entirely differently filmed coverage... and the courts apparently saw what I saw, because no one from "Antifa" was even arrested, let alone charged.

If you believe The Proud Boys is only a "frat club of beer-swilling misogynists", you have been willfully duped. Personally, I think you know exactly what it is; your choice, but you will eventually face judgment for the company you choose, and the beliefs you espouse. Trump will not always be in the WH giving aid and comfort to the neo-nazis and David Dukes of the world. :shrug:
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Seeing as Antifa uses black block tactics to keep themselves from being prosecuted. I'd have to suggest you widen your stance a least a bit.

They are as such, in my eyes. I don't know to what distance the other members take their dedication, though I do know that it's not even remotely to what you're suggesting.
The group isn't a white nationalist group, seeing as I and more than a few other non-white members exist. They aren't a Nazi group, seeing as they don't espouse Nazi ideals.

The vast majority of times they protest, or rally. It's a peaceful demonstration, and only gets violent when groups like antifa show up.
 
Lord of Planar said:
Protesting is one thing, but the streets are for all. To use them, must have a permit.

Where does law and order fit in your world, or are you an anarchist?
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I didn't realize that such a degree of obedience was a libertarian thing. I think you're a closet conservative who just likes how 'libertarian' sounds.
Law and order? Me? My motto on that subject is, "Question Authority." Always. And defy it when necessary.
 
Grand Mal said:
I didn't realize that such a degree of obedience was a libertarian thing. I think you're a closet conservative who just likes how 'libertarian' sounds.
Law and order? Me? My motto on that subject is, "Question Authority." Always. And defy it when necessary.
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You are speaking of Anarchy which is going beyond libertarian values.

Libertarians understand some laws are necessary.

A good libertarians effectively lives by the idea they are free to do as they wish, as long as they don't negatively impact others. Libertarians wouldn't do unpermitted take-overs of the streets that other people travel.
 
Ikari said:
I think that if your intent is to get into fights, cause vandalism, or in general put at risk the general welfare of the public, that you should stay at home regardless of what side you are on.
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Ok, something most of us agree with...Look at all the likes for your post. Makes my heart feel good knowing that despite our differences in politics, as Americans we can unite on this one issue.

:)
 
Lord of Planar said:
You are speaking of Anarchy which is going beyond libertarian values.

Libertarians understand some laws are necessary.

A good libertarians effectively lives by the idea they are free to do as they wish, as long as they don't negatively impact others. Libertarians wouldn't do unpermitted take-overs of the streets that other people travel.
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A good liberal has limited respect for government and even less for authority and will defy both when his conscience says defiance is needed. And he won't ask for permission.
So rest easy. Stay in the car. Liberals will take care of it.
 
Oborosen said:
Seeing as Antifa uses black block tactics to keep themselves from being prosecuted. I'd have to suggest you widen your stance a least a bit.

They are as such, in my eyes. I don't know to what distance the other members take their dedication, though I do know that it's not even remotely to what you're suggesting.
The group isn't a white nationalist group, seeing as I and more than a few other non-white members exist. They aren't a Nazi group, seeing as they don't espouse Nazi ideals.

The vast majority of times they protest, or rally. It's a peaceful demonstration, and only gets violent when groups like antifa show up.
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You've already made clear what you believe; own it. I really don't give a damn about your delusions and justifications at this point. You proudly proclaim your membership in a woman-hating, Jew-hating white nationalist organization. :shrug:

Oh, try Googling the Proud Boys New York Nine to see what happened to your boy McInnis, and why. I'm done here.
 
Grand Mal said:
A good liberal has limited respect for government and even less for authority and will defy both when his conscience says defiance is needed. And he won't ask for permission.
So rest easy. Stay in the car. Liberals will take care of it.
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Those are the excuses of people of little morals. Such actions are seldom necessary.

Rationalize much?

Do you really believe you have the right to disrupt the lives of innocent people who just want to go about their business?
 
The problem is those jackwagons always tend to plan their meetings in public places. Just once I wish they would all agree to meet out in the middle of nowhere...no cops, no JQP...just the idiots from the far left and the idiots from the far right...and have a party. Last man standing wins a Happenings coupon book and free Slushies for life.
 
Lord of Planar said:
Those are the excuses of people of little morals. Such actions are seldom necessary.

Rationalize much?

Do you really believe you have the right to disrupt the lives of innocent people who just want to go about their business?
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Morals? Is civil obedience a moral thing to you?
Damn. Do all libertarians think that? Tell you what I think about that- a man of good morals will defy government, defy authority, whenever he sees it overstepping it's bounds or sees that somebody's rights and freedom is being crowded. And if somebody else is inconvenienced, well, too bad. That's the price of freedom. Sometimes it's inconvenient.
'Course, in a strong fascist or communist state social order comes first. Civil obedience is paramount and maybe you can protest but get permission first. That how libertarians see society?
 
VanceMack said:
The problem is those jackwagons always tend to plan their meetings in public places. Just once I wish they would all agree to meet out in the middle of nowhere...no cops, no JQP...just the idiots from the far left and the idiots from the far right...and have a party. Last man standing wins a Happenings coupon book and free Slushies for life.
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If they managed to take each other out of the picture it might be a yuge step toward restoring normalcy to the discussion.
If we can keep that last man shut up.
 
Lord of Planar said:
Armor is protection. I suppose you ridicule bycyclists wearing helets too?

Now look at Antifa. They hide their faces, because their intent is to break the law, and not be identified.
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Well, at least they're not hiding on top of buildings over looking the protest with a cache of weapons like the Patriot Prayer did.
 
Anthony60 said:
How do you "defend" your city against free speech? How about not listening to them, instead of showing up with weapons and masks and beating people?
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Same could be said of the proud boys. No one has been able to tell me why they are in Portland. Couldn't they have just had their rally in their backyards in Florida?
 
DiAnna said:
You've already made clear what you believe; own it. I really don't give a damn about your delusions and justifications at this point. You proudly proclaim your membership in a woman-hating, Jew-hating white nationalist organization. :shrug:

Oh, try Googling the Proud Boys New York Nine to see what happened to your boy McInnis, and why. I'm done here.
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You're acting as though your own delusions should have a say here then?

The proud boys are not a woman hating, jew hating, or a white nationalist organization.
 
NeverTrump said:
And the fact that antifa wouldn't be there if not for the nazis seems to escape you.
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I agree, the National Socialist German Worker’s Party should stay home
 
Oborosen said:
You're acting as though your own delusions should have a say here then?

The proud boys are not a woman hating, jew hating, or a white nationalist organization.
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Yes. They are. Own it.
 
DiAnna said:
Yes. They are. Own it.
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Strange that doesn't seem to be an aspect of the groups goals, either on their site, or how they perform.

You mind supplying some information that helps to prove such a claim?
 
Oborosen said:
Strange that doesn't seem to be an aspect of the groups goals, either on their site, or how they perform.

You mind supplying some information that helps to prove such a claim?
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YOU are the one who must prove or disprove such a claim. YOU are the one who proudly claims to be a member of the "Proud Boys". You are the one who "OWNS IT". Done here.
 
DiAnna said:
YOU are the one who must prove or disprove such a claim. YOU are the one who proudly claims to be a member of the "Proud Boys". You are the one who "OWNS IT". Done here.
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And thank you for tucking tail and running like all the others do, when someone ask them to supply proof for their claims.

Gods it's easy to chase the likes of you off. All it seems I have to do is ask for proof, and you all just flee.
 
Oborosen said:
And thank you for tucking tail and running like all the others do, when someone ask them to supply proof for their claims.

Gods it's easy to chase the likes of you off. All it seems I have to do is ask for proof, and you all just flee.
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Is that an admission that you are just trolling? [Yeah, I think it was] Most people just roll their eyes when they see someone spout the kind of deceptive propaganda you've posted, but ignoring is also a valid response. "Proud Boys aren't neo-nazis"... yeah, right. No, really, really far far right.
 
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