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Thread: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

  1. #211
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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by Evilroddy View Post
    Ecofarm.

    Yup. But the map shows the tanker was never in the territorial waters of the U.K. until it was seized by the RMCs and also UK customs, fiscal, immigration or sanitary regulations do not apply on the high seas. No case.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    Freight is subject to customs. Contiguous Zone applies, not merely the Territorial Zone (or territorial waters in the 12m meaning).
    Last edited by ecofarm; 07-19-19 at 09:33 PM.

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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Freight is subject to customs. Contiguous Zone applies, not merely territorial zone.
    Ecofarm:

    Read the quote from your link. The infringement must occur on the state's territory or in its territorial waters. Sorry, your case is dead in the water.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    "At the heart of quantum mechanics is a rule that sometimes governs politicians or CEOs - as long as no one is watching, anything goes.
    ― Lawrence M. Krauss

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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by Evilroddy View Post
    Ecofarm:

    Read the quote from your link. The infringement must occur on the state's territory or in its territorial waters. Sorry, your case is dead in the water.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    The Contiguous Zone extends beyond territorial waters and includes customs jurisdiction.

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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The second boat is Liberian.
    That's a flag of convenience. I wonder who the real owners are.
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    I'm smart on the gun issue and what we need to do about it.

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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    The Contiguous Zone extends beyond territorial waters and includes customs jurisdiction.
    Ecofarm:

    Two points. The infringement must occur in the "territorial seas" in order for enforcement to apply in a contiguous zone and there was no violation until the ship was forcefully brought in to Gibraltar's waters by the RMC.

    This is all moot however because there is no contiguous zone around Gibraltar since even its territorial waters clash with Spain's and a CZ over 7.1 km would also clash with North African waters too. That is why the Straits of Gibraltar is an international waterway. So no case, I'm afraid.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    "At the heart of quantum mechanics is a rule that sometimes governs politicians or CEOs - as long as no one is watching, anything goes.
    ― Lawrence M. Krauss

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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by Evilroddy View Post
    Ecofarm:

    Two points. The infringement must occur in the "territorial seas" in order for enforcement to apply in a contiguous zone and there was no violation until the ship was forcefully brought in to Gibraltar's waters by the RMC.
    Territorial waters, not territorial sea. The territorial sea extends 12 nm, the contiguous zone extends 24 nm. That's twice the distance.

    You're conflating territorial waters, which include the contiguous and exclusive economic zones, and territorial sea, which extends only 12 nm.

    So, 24 nm out, twice as far as the territorial sea, is the contiguous zone which is part of territorial waters. In that zone, states have customs jurisdiction.

    This is all moot however because there is no contiguous zone around Gibraltar since even its territorial waters clash with Spain's and a CZ over 7.1 km would also clash with North African waters too. That is why the Straits of Gibraltar is an international waterway. So no case, I'm afraid.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    Location of apprehension is of convenience. The tanker had no legal route. That's why it was disguised and sailed around Africa to avoid the Suez Canal.

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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Territorial waters, not territorial sea. The territorial sea extends 12 nm, the contiguous zone extends 24 nm. That's twice the distance.

    You're conflating territorial waters, which include the contiguous and exclusive economic zones, and territorial sea, which extends only 12 nm.

    So, 24 nm out, twice as far as the territorial sea, is the contiguous zone which is part of territorial waters. In that zone, states have customs jurisdiction.



    Location of apprehension is of convenience. The tanker had no legal route. That's why it was disguised and sailed around Africa to avoid the Suez Canal.
    Ecofarm:

    image.jpg

    Do you see a contiguous zone? It can't exist because Gibraltar's surrounded by other countries' territorial waters. As to your interpretation go back and read the quote from your own source. You've got no case.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    "At the heart of quantum mechanics is a rule that sometimes governs politicians or CEOs - as long as no one is watching, anything goes.
    ― Lawrence M. Krauss

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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by Evilroddy View Post
    Ecofarm:

    image.jpg

    Do you see a contiguous zone? It can't exist because Gibraltar's surrounded by other countries' territorial waters. As to your interpretation go back and read the quote from your own source. You've got no case.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    The others have territorial waters illustrated but Gibraltar only has territorial seas illustrated. One can see the words are different. And one can see territorial waters consume all possible routes.

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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    The others have territorial waters illustrated but Gibraltar only has territorial seas illustrated. One can see the words are different. And one can see territorial waters consume all possible routes.
    Ecofarm.

    The different nomenclature is due to the fact that the "territorial seas" are disputed waters while the territorial waters are settled. And contiguous zones must be both overtly and explicitly claimed like the USA did in 1999 and cannot emanate from disputed waters. So, no case.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    "At the heart of quantum mechanics is a rule that sometimes governs politicians or CEOs - as long as no one is watching, anything goes.
    ― Lawrence M. Krauss

  10. #220
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    Re: Iran claims to have seized British oil tanker in strait of Hormuz

    Quote Originally Posted by Evilroddy View Post
    Ecofarm.

    The different nomenclature is due to the fact that the "territorial seas" are disputed waters while the territorial waters are settled. And contiguous zones must be both overtly and explicitly claimed like the USA did in 1999 and cannot eminate from disputed waters. So, no case.

    Cheers.
    Evilroddy.
    Territorial waters include the territorial sea, contiguous zone and exclusive economic zone. The contiguous zone extends for twice the distance of the territorial sea and in it a state has customs jurisdiction.

    Your map has an obvious flaw in either labeling or failing to uniformly illustrate.

    One can see that territorial waters consume all possible routes. One can see why Spain said, "hey", but that's between the EU.

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