• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Jeffrey Epstein bail ruling delayed as more accusers come forward

tres borrachos said:
Okay? Not sure what the last sentence means.
Click to expand...

It's kind of like when Kakko trys to get to the net, and gets crushed by Subban. He's not allowed to go there, but he tried anyway. (Then Hughes and Hall rush up ice and score like 3 goals in 4 seconds)
 
jmotivator said:
Yes, but you want to start jailing lawyers for defending the accused? You realize that is pretty crazy, right?
Click to expand...

Well, Trump wants to jail federal employees who were hired to investigate his campaign's ties to Russia, for crime of investigating him, so we are at that level of insanity. Republicans tried to say Hillary Clinton was a horrible person because she once represented a convicted child molester. The fact that she was assigned the case as a public defender, and the court denied her request to be excused from the case, was completely ignored. Hillary was just the worst person ever for being this guy's lawyer.

There's a line in the movie The Big Chill, wherein Mary Kay Place is asked why she had stopped being a public defender, and was now a corporate lawyer and her response was "I didn't know my clients would all be so, [pause] guilty". Most of the people charged with crimes, are guilty. The guilty FAR outnumber those wrongfully accused. One of the best and smartest lawyers I ever worked for said that when he was a young lawyer, he took every client that walked in the door, but quickly decided criminal law was not for him. He said "You walk down the street and every crook, drug dealer and rapist knows your name. Those aren't the kind of people I want to do business with or for.".

If you're a criminal lawyer, your clients are criminals, and nearly all of them are guilty. Prosecutors don't file cases they don't think they can win. It's a given.
 
jmotivator said:
Yes, but you want to start jailing lawyers for defending the accused? You realize that is pretty crazy, right?
Click to expand...
At this point, I'm willing to jail any-and-everyone that contributed to denying those dozens of girls justice for the crimes committed against them. If you don't start putting these guys and those that aid & abate them in jail, you'll continue to see the rich, connected, and privileged, evade the law.

It's clear to the most casual observer that the fix was in, and Acosta & Dershowitz were in the thick of it. So throw they keys away, as far as I'm concerned. And if Epstein's good friends Clinton & Trump were in on his dirty deeds, let them share a cell with the aforementioned.
 
Just out of curiousity did Epstein fly these young girls on Virgin Airlines?
 
Chomsky said:
At this point, I'm willing to jail any-and-everyone that contributed to denying those dozens of girls justice for the crimes committed against them. If you don't start putting these guys and those that aid & abate them in jail, you'll continue to see the rich, connected, and privileged, evade the law.

It's clear to the most casual observer that the fix was in, and Acosta & Dershowitz were in the thick of it. So throw they keys away, as far as I'm concerned. And if Epstein's good friends Clinton & Trump were in on his dirty deeds, let them share a cell with the aforementioned.
Click to expand...

Dershowitz' response to being implicated in having attended and participated in the sex parties was, 'those kids are prostitutes, who you gonna believe - the Harvard Law School Professor, or them kiddie hookers.' (paraphrased of course, but you get the idea)

Someone needs to tell Dersh that the public isn't stupid, and knows that some people study and become criminal law experts, in order to master the art of not getting caught.
 
jimbo said:
Yup. Ask Kathleen Willy. A desperate Clinton supporter who's husband had just taken a long dive into a shallow river. You help me, I'll help you. Kathleen didn't. Bill didn't. There were others. Reportedly Clinton used the Arkansas State Patrol as his own procurement agency. He also paid hundreds of thousands of hush money to some of the women.
Click to expand...

Kathleen Willey didn't know her husband had committed suicide when she met with Clinton, on the day in question so you're story has no validity. The rest your post is just right wing rumours and garbage, none of which is borne out by the evidence. Clinton is a scuzzbad husband and a low down hound dog, but there is no evidence at all that any of his sexual encounters were anything but consensual. There is enough true stuff to nail the guy on, but Republicans are never content to stick with the truth.

The tendency is to embellish, to add things that never happened, and to try to make Clinton into a monster. Then at the same time to dismiss every one of Trump's accusers as liars, when in fact, there is much evidence that Donald Trump really is a serial predator, rapist, and all around monster, when it comes to his relationships with women. Not one woman who has ever been involved with the man has a good thing to say about him. Melania and Baron are living with her parents, not at the White House. He spends no time with his grandchildren, and spent no time with his children when they were younger, except those creepy photos of him and Ivanka.
 
Dragonlady said:
Melania and Baron are living with her parents, not at the White House. He spends no time with his grandchildren, and spent no time with his children when they were younger, except those creepy photos of him and Ivanka.
Click to expand...

Unless you've been spending time in their bedroom, you have no idea where Melania sleeps. We all know Baron attends a private boarding school, home for weekends and the holidays. Brags about breakfasts with his dad, something most of his schoolmates have never done. He's close with his grandparents, particularly his grandmother, speaking to her daily. I did the same with my grandfather, and was thrilled to have him. All of Trump's kids grew up at home. You know nothing of their relationships. You know less of his relationships with his grandkids, just speculation. You never considered the value of extended family, or the reasons for keeping children out of the media.

Security demands keeping them all out of the limelight in today's screwed up world, but your vicarious gossiping desires demand their sacrifice. Sick witchy thoughts you've got there. So what if he avoids photo ops with the kids in his family? How is that any of your business? No one's family life is open to your partisan BS.

Six of my grandkids have never enjoyed breakfast with their dad. He's either been working, heading a trauma unit, or dead asleep. They love him anyway.
 
Chomsky said:
At this point, I'm willing to jail any-and-everyone that contributed to denying those dozens of girls justice for the crimes committed against them. If you don't start putting these guys and those that aid & abate them in jail, you'll continue to see the rich, connected, and privileged, evade the law.

It's clear to the most casual observer that the fix was in, and Acosta & Dershowitz were in the thick of it. So throw they keys away, as far as I'm concerned. And if Epstein's good friends Clinton & Trump were in on his dirty deeds, let them share a cell with the aforementioned.
Click to expand...

That is crazy. That is how a kangaroo court works, not a justice system.

Everyone is entitled to a defense. A system that holds the defense lawyer accountable for their clients actions only ensures that nobody gets a fair trial.

If Dershowitz is guilty then get the evidence and put him on trial. Your lynch mob mentality isn't helping anyone.
 
Dragonlady said:
Well, Trump wants to jail federal employees who were hired to investigate his campaign's ties to Russia, for crime of investigating him, so we are at that level of insanity. Republicans tried to say Hillary Clinton was a horrible person because she once represented a convicted child molester. The fact that she was assigned the case as a public defender, and the court denied her request to be excused from the case, was completely ignored. Hillary was just the worst person ever for being this guy's lawyer.

There's a line in the movie The Big Chill, wherein Mary Kay Place is asked why she had stopped being a public defender, and was now a corporate lawyer and her response was "I didn't know my clients would all be so, [pause] guilty". Most of the people charged with crimes, are guilty. The guilty FAR outnumber those wrongfully accused. One of the best and smartest lawyers I ever worked for said that when he was a young lawyer, he took every client that walked in the door, but quickly decided criminal law was not for him. He said "You walk down the street and every crook, drug dealer and rapist knows your name. Those aren't the kind of people I want to do business with or for.".

If you're a criminal lawyer, your clients are criminals, and nearly all of them are guilty. Prosecutors don't file cases they don't think they can win. It's a given.
Click to expand...

Well, that is a lie. But even if he wanted them jailed for merely "investigating him", the courts will not. If the investigators broke the law in the process of conducting the investigation then they should be tried in court.
 
Dragonlady said:
Kathleen Willey didn't know her husband had committed suicide when she met with Clinton, on the day in question so you're story has no validity. The rest your post is just right wing rumours and garbage, none of which is borne out by the evidence. Clinton is a scuzzbad husband and a low down hound dog, but there is no evidence at all that any of his sexual encounters were anything but consensual. There is enough true stuff to nail the guy on, but Republicans are never content to stick with the truth.

The tendency is to embellish, to add things that never happened, and to try to make Clinton into a monster. Then at the same time to dismiss every one of Trump's accusers as liars, when in fact, there is much evidence that Donald Trump really is a serial predator, rapist, and all around monster, when it comes to his relationships with women. Not one woman who has ever been involved with the man has a good thing to say about him. Melania and Baron are living with her parents, not at the White House. He spends no time with his grandchildren, and spent no time with his children when they were younger, except those creepy photos of him and Ivanka.
Click to expand...

Jones v Clinton offers plenty of evidence that his encounters were not consensual. Along with multiple perjury counts for Clinton.
 
Anthony60 said:
It's kind of like when Kakko trys to get to the net, and gets crushed by Subban. He's not allowed to go there, but he tried anyway. (Then Hughes and Hall rush up ice and score like 3 goals in 4 seconds)
Click to expand...

Ah, the fantasies of a disgruntled Devils fan. Better fiction that a bodice ripper.:mrgreen:
 
jmotivator said:
That is crazy. That is how a kangaroo court works, not a justice system.

Everyone is entitled to a defense. A system that holds the defense lawyer accountable for their clients actions only ensures that nobody gets a fair trial.

If Dershowitz is guilty then get the evidence and put him on trial. Your lynch mob mentality isn't helping anyone.
Click to expand...
No, that is exactly how kangaroo courts work. That was not justice. That was the rich/powerful/connected obstructing justice. And that's what I want to end. I can't imagine a better deterrent than to throw their asses in jail - sharing a cell with Epstein.
 
Chomsky said:
No, that is exactly how kangaroo courts work. That was not justice. That was the rich/powerful/connected obstructing justice. And that's what I want to end. I can't imagine a better deterrent than to throw their asses in jail - sharing a cell with Epstein.
Click to expand...

A bad trial is not an excuse for a plan that ensures all bad trials.

But let me try and reason with you again: Our constitution requires that the accused are afforded a fair trial with legal representation... so in your future, where a lawyer is charged as an accomplice for defending his client too well, a future Jeffrey Epstein would go free for lack of a lawyer to defend him, making a fair trial unobtainable.
 
jmotivator said:
A bad trial is not an excuse for a plan that ensures all bad trials.

But let me try and reason with you again: Our constitution requires that the accused are afforded a fair trial with legal representation... so in your future, where a lawyer is charged as an accomplice for defending his client too well, a future Jeffrey Epstein would go free for lack of a lawyer to defend him, making a fair trial unobtainable.
Click to expand...
Our Constitution promotes Justice, and you're supporting crooked individuals that obstructed Justice for nearly 50 underage victims. Brag all you want for your crooked Trumpian lawyer & FL AG turned Labor Secy, shield them as you wish; but the country is against you and the sickness you're trying to protect. I assure you the NY jury is going to see through the garbage your promoting, and rule for justice for the girls. Wanna bet? You can't even pretend that's not going to happen.
 
Chomsky said:
Our Constitution promotes Justice, and you're supporting crooked individuals that obstructed Justice for nearly 50 underage victims. Brag all you want for your crooked Trumpian lawyer & FL AG turned Labor Secy, shield them as you wish; but the country is against you and the sickness you're trying to protect. I assure you the NY jury is going to see through the garbage your promoting, and rule for justice for the girls. Wanna bet? You can't even pretend that's not going to happen.
Click to expand...

*sigh* You can't even stick to a coherent argument. :roll:

Question: Should the defense team defending Epstein today be thrown in jail?
 
jmotivator said:
*sigh* You can't even stick to a coherent argument. :roll:

Question: Should the defense team defending Epstein today be thrown in jail?
Click to expand...
If Epstein was in on the fix, yes - absolutely. I find it impossible to believe he was not (in on it).

And I'm not so sure about Dershowitz' claims of only getting massaged by legally women at Epstein's place, and his not knowing anything was going on. The same with Clinton & Trump. At the least, I'm sure they knew what Epstein was doing to those girls, and the recruitment that was taking place at Mar-a-Largo.

My argument is very coherent, and very consistent:

I believe Dershowitz was involved in fixing these cases with Acosta, and I'd like them to face justice and for the abused children to receive justice & closure.
 
Chomsky said:
If Epstein was in on the fix, yes - absolutely. I find it impossible to believe he was not (in on it).

And I'm not so sure about Dershowitz' claims of only getting massaged by legally women at Epstein's place, and his not knowing anything was going on. The same with Clinton & Trump. At the least, I'm sure they knew what Epstein was doing to those girls, and the recruitment that was taking place at Mar-a-Largo.

My argument is very coherent, and very consistent:

I believe Dershowitz was involved in fixing these cases with Acosta, and I'd like them to face justice and for the abused children to receive justice & closure.
Click to expand...

As I stated early on, if Dershowitz actually participated in illegal activities with or on behalf of Epstein then he should be brought up on charges, but what you have offered is just that you can't conceive of how Dershowitz could be innocent, so hang 'em.

You are taking the lynch mob mentality here and you are usually better than that.
 
jmotivator said:
As I stated early on, if Dershowitz actually participated in illegal activities with or on behalf of Epstein then he should be brought up on charges, but what you have offered is just that you can't conceive of how Dershowitz could be innocent, so hang 'em.
Click to expand...
Agreed.

You are taking the lynch mob mentality here and you are usually better than that.
Click to expand...
No, I'm tired of the government & Trump supporters constantly asking me to believe the highly unlikely. We know Acosta fixed Epstein's cases, all thirty-something of them, regardless of what he, Trump, and the government is telling us to believe. And it will be proven-out in NY. Without doubt.

And yes, when I say "hang 'em", I mean "hang 'em legally". Use the system that they denied those young girls. Make it work.

[It's also my hope a Dem President will investigate all this, letting the cards fall where they may, even (especially!) if it leads up to the Clinton. Because Trump surely won't (investigate it)]
 
Chomsky said:
Agreed.

No, I'm tired of the government & Trump supporters constantly asking me to believe the highly unlikely. We know Acosta fixed Epstein's cases, all thirty-something of them, regardless of what he, Trump, and the government is telling us to believe. And it will be proven-out in NY. Without doubt.

And yes, when I say "hang 'em", I mean "hang 'em legally". Use the system that they denied those young girls. Make it work.

[It's also my hope a Dem President will investigate all this, letting the cards fall where they may, even (especially!) if it leads up to the Clinton. Because Trump surely won't (investigate it)]
Click to expand...

You don't actually believe "let the cards fall where they may" Chomsky, so you can spare the key strokes. You have already determined who is guilty and what should be done, and even determined the proper bias of the administration necessary to reach your desired outcome.

Edit: How do you suppose a huge fund raiser for the Democrats managed to skate all the way through the 8 years of Obama without this being addressed?
 
jmotivator said:
You don't actually believe "let the cards fall where they may" Chomsky, so you can spare the key strokes. You have already determined who is guilty and what should be done, and even determined the proper bias of the administration necessary to reach your desired outcome.

Edit: How do you suppose a huge fund raiser for the Democrats managed to skate all the way through the 8 years of Obama without this being addressed?
Click to expand...
You'll need a better argument than that, jmotivator.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom