U.S. budget deficit balloons to $739 billion despite tariff revenue

Bullseye said:

Not true, data shows income tax revenues are increasing.

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You aren't looking at the data.

If we compare fiscal year 2019 with fiscal year 2018, the U.S. Treasury took in $50 billion more than it did at the same point in time last year. Spending has increased by $250 billion in the same period.

Conservative said:

That is bull****, what matters is the debt, trending deficit downwards only makes the debt less and we still paid debt service on the 9.3 trillion dollars Obama added to the debt. You have no idea what you are talking about with regards to the Obama results, four straight years of trillion dollar deficits and you want to tout deficit reductions?? What effect did sequester have on the deficit? What did Obama do to lower the deficit? Don't expect an answer because people like you are to indoctrinated to realize how foolish the left is making you look

Interesting how the calendar and results don't support anything you claim which is why people like you are a waste of time.

What Ended the Great Recession?

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Of course sequestration helped , but NO ONE liked it. Republicans and Democrats negotiated a compromise and Obama signed it. Both parties felt like they lost something but the country gained.

I'm not going to research everything that was done to get us out of the recession but one big item was avoiding the collapse of the auto industry. The federal bailout of General Motors Co, Chrysler and parts suppliers in 2009 saved 1.5 million U.S. jobs and preserved $105.3 billion in personal and social insurance tax collections. The Center for Automotive Research said the study did not take into account the benefits of preserving the pensions of almost 600,000 GM and Chrysler retirees as well as industry research and development jobs. It also did not account for the psychological impact the collapse of GM and Chrysler would have had on the U.S. industrial base.

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Kushinator said:

You aren't looking at the data.

If we compare fiscal year 2019 with fiscal year 2018, the U.S. Treasury took in $50 billion more than it did at the same point in time last year. Spending has increased by $250 billion in the same period.

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Funny, that's not what the treasury monthly summary tells me.

Conservative said:

You are so right, results don't matter because perception and your opinion trump reality

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Yeah, buddy. I showed you the results in black and white. You didn't like the facts so you deny them and began hurling insults. You're getting your behind handed to you in this thread, but just like trump, when you don't like the facts you create your own reality and keep on counterpunching with cheap insults and lies. Pathetic behavior.

Bullseye said:

Funny, that's not what the treasury monthly summary tells me.

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You either don't know how to read the data, or failed to actually read it. Either way... well, you know.

Everything i stated can be confirmed if you familiarized yourself with Table 2. Summary of Budget and Off-Budget Results and Financing of the U.S. Government, May 2019 and Other Periods



:2wave:

Kushinator said:

You either don't know how to read the data, or failed to actually read it. Either way... well, you know.

Everything i stated can be confirmed if you familiarized yourself with Table 2. Summary of Budget and Off-Budget Results and Financing of the U.S. Government, May 2019 and Other Periods

:2wave:

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So, I see
"current fiscal year to date: 2,274.902, . comparable period prior fiscal year(2018): 2,224,526. Which is higher?

Kushinator said:

Are you serious?

Deficits during the Obama administration were primarily driven by the global financial crisis and the pending recession. Such a fiscal reality is justifiable given the severity of the situation. It is not... in any possible way... justifiable to grow deficits with the unemployment rate below 4%.



It does matter quite a bit with respect to the economic and financial situation of the both the U.S. and the world. The only hypocrisy you've highlighted is your own.

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Yawn, government spending is and has been out of control. Both parties are guilty as hell.

Bullseye said:

So, I see
"current fiscal year to date: 2,274.902, . comparable period prior fiscal year(2018): 2,224,526. Which is higher?

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Do you know how to read?

Kushinator said:

You aren't looking at the data.

If we compare fiscal year 2019 with fiscal year 2018, the U.S. Treasury took in $50 billion more than it did at the same point in time last year. Spending has increased by $250 billion in the same period.

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My point stands, as revenue has grown by 2.23% and expenditures have grown by 8.3%.

The Republican party attempting to claim they are fiscal conservatives, by any stretch of the imagination, is pure bull****.

RedAkston said:

Yawn, government spending is and has been out of control. Both parties are guilty as hell.

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Sure.

But both parties don't cut taxes in conjunction with massive spending increases during periods of full employment.

Hence, the hypocrisy flows through you given your statements in this thread.

Kushinator said:

The Republican party attempting to claim they are fiscal conservatives, by any stretch of the imagination, is pure bull****.

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There are a handful that still are fiscal conservatives, but the overwhelming majority aren't. They are politicians and they lie to serve their own purpose. A politician of any stripe is just as bad as a politician of any other stripe.

RedAkston said:

There are a handful that still are fiscal conservatives, but the overwhelming majority aren't. They are politicians and they lie to serve their own purpose. A politician of any stripe is just as bad as a politician of any other stripe.

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I don't see any on the GOP side (good 'ol Rand aside). Anyone who supports such a massive tax cut with less than 4% unemployment is not a fiscal conservative.

Kushinator said:

Sure.

But both parties don't cut taxes in conjunction with massive spending increases during periods of full employment.

Hence, the hypocrisy flows through you given your statements in this thread.

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There's no hypocrisy here Kush. I've always had a problem with government spending, doesn't matter who is in the White House or who is doing the spending. The Republicans have failed to cut spending, period. Overall spending was cut under Obama more than under Trump, and it's all still too much spending.

Kushinator said:

I don't see any on the GOP side (good 'ol Rand aside). Anyone who supports such a massive tax cut with less than 4% unemployment is not a fiscal conservative.

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The tax cut wasn't about cutting spending, it was about investment, job growth and a tax break for most taxpayers. It was successful, but if they don't cut spending (which they haven't in a meaningful way), what's the point? The national debt is out of control and neither side seems to give 2 ****s about it.

RedAkston said:

There's no hypocrisy here Kush. I've always had a problem with government spending, doesn't matter who is in the White House or who is doing the spending. The Republicans have failed to cut spending, period. Overall spending was cut under Obama more than under Trump, and it's all still too much spending.

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We should expect government spending to increase during turbulent economic times. Even a minor recession in 2020/2021 is going to blow a massive hole in the budget. Are we going to run a $2 trillion deficit in such a scenario... because that's where we are heading.

You call out people who oppose current fiscal policy of the GOP, even though they have an extremely valid point. It wreaks of hypocrisy. Well, unless you believe deficits and spending should have been even greater than what they were between 2008 and 2012.

RedAkston said:

The tax cut wasn't about cutting spending, it was about investment, job growth and a tax break for most taxpayers. It was successful, but if they don't cut spending (which they haven't in a meaningful way), what's the point? The national debt is out of control and neither side seems to give 2 ****s about it.

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The tax cut has yet to generate enough economic activity via investment, job growth, gains in disposable income, etc... to justify the cost at this stage of the economic cycle. Nominal revenue growth is well below that of real output. If you measure success by maintaining the baseline, then perhaps you have a point. I don't, and therefore disagree.

We can't reduce spending in any meaningful way without impacting the state of the current economy. Both parties are playing fiscal chicken.

RedAkston said:

The tax cut wasn't about cutting spending, it was about investment, job growth and a tax break for most taxpayers. It was successful, but if they don't cut spending (which they haven't in a meaningful way), what's the point? The national debt is out of control and neither side seems to give 2 ****s about it.

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How was the tax cut successful?

As far as investment goes most of the "investment" was in stock buybacks and we still had the worst stock market performance in 2018 since 2008.

If we look at job growth, during Obama's second term we averaged 217,000 per month. Trump's average had been in the 190 thousands, but so far this year we are at 164,000.

Yes, most people got a small income tax cut but now that has been wiped out by tariffs. Wealthy people are still ahead because they got much bigger dollar amounts from the income tax break but the tariffs don't impact them much more than they impact the average Joe who is falling behind.

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Bullseye said:

Not true, data shows income tax revenues are increasing.


This think is dated November of 2017, it's a BS "estimate" not factual information.

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It's probably too optimistic. It doesn't figure in the recession coming in 2020.

George50 said:

Strange that you don't seem to understand that when we are in the worst recession since the great depression and the unemployment rate is 10% that when people are unemployed they don't pay taxes and corporations are in much the same boat and their tax payments go down too. Then the government has to pay unemployment and other benefits to all these people who are out of work due to no fault of their own driving spending up. Can't you understand simple math? Less revenue and more expense gives higher debt. The recession is why we had 4 years of trillion dollar deficits. When Trump took over the deficit was a fraction of that and the economy was doing well. Now we have trillion dollar deficits again WITHOUT a recession.

During Obama's administration the first year had jumped from 0.5 to an incredible 1.4 trillion debt added. Why? The recession obviously. When Obama left we were at 0.6 trillion. Now we are back up at 1.1 trillion and no recession

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No, here is what you don't understand the calendar refutes your belief that it was Obama that brought us out of recession when the reality what it was TARP. The Obama stimulus saw employment drop to 138 million from 142 million by the end of 2009 and recovered to 139 million in January 2010. The record at the time was 146 million in January 2008.

You cannot name for us any legislation that Obama authored that brought us out of recession in June 2009 and since you and the radicals want to blame Bush for the 2009 deficit it certainly wasn't Obama then that generated those results. The worst recession since the Great Depression was a marketing tool created by the left that fooled good people like you just like the economic results are ignored.

Obama authored the worst recovery in modern history, lost the House in 2010 and 2012 then the Congress in 2014 as the American people didn't feel that Obama economic successes you claim existed. Now tell me why you are trying to prop up the failed 842 billion stimulus passed in January 2009 and why you are ignoring the official results including the 9.3 trillion dollar debt created by 4 straight years of trillion dollar deficits, then sequester and a Republican Congress. Obama was a likable person and that is all that seems to matter to you and others.

George50 said:

Of course sequestration helped , but NO ONE liked it. Republicans and Democrats negotiated a compromise and Obama signed it. Both parties felt like they lost something but the country gained.

I'm not going to research everything that was done to get us out of the recession but one big item was avoiding the collapse of the auto industry. The federal bailout of General Motors Co, Chrysler and parts suppliers in 2009 saved 1.5 million U.S. jobs and preserved $105.3 billion in personal and social insurance tax collections. The Center for Automotive Research said the study did not take into account the benefits of preserving the pensions of almost 600,000 GM and Chrysler retirees as well as industry research and development jobs. It also did not account for the psychological impact the collapse of GM and Chrysler would have had on the U.S. industrial base.

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Please post to the official site that measures SAVED jobs and how do you know the bail out of the auto industry saved jobs? Americans lost billions of dollars on that gov't take over of the auto industry but you want to buy the rhetoric and ignore the results. What Obama and liberals always do is kick the can down the road and ignore the private sector. Solving the financial crisis is something neither you or Obama understood nor do you understand that some company would have taken over GM because of the massive size and numbers of autos on the road. Keep buying what you are being told, keep ignoring the calendar as to when the recession ended, and by all means keep ignoring the economic results of Obama which left the country with a 20 trillion dollar debt, a 9.3% U-6 rate, generated only 4.2 trillion in GDP growth which included the stimulus spending, and as history will show the worst recover in modern history

lurchadams said:

Yeah, buddy. I showed you the results in black and white. You didn't like the facts so you deny them and began hurling insults. You're getting your behind handed to you in this thread, but just like trump, when you don't like the facts you create your own reality and keep on counterpunching with cheap insults and lies. Pathetic behavior.

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No, you showed your biased and partisan opinions of the so called facts but no context. You want badly to believe what you are told when negative against Trump but never research to verify the accuracy or even the context

iguanaman said:

It's probably too optimistic. It doesn't figure in the recession coming in 2020.

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Keep praying for failure and that so called recession prediction in 2020 without ever offering an alternative or plan to prevent it. you believe raising taxes is going to prevent a recession and why do you believe we are going to go into recession in 2020? What is the Democratic Economic plan to prevent a recession and which Democratic Presidential Candidate is going to reduce spending and prevent a recession?

George50 said:

How was the tax cut successful?

As far as investment goes most of the "investment" was in stock buybacks and we still had the worst stock market performance in 2018 since 2008.

If we look at job growth, during Obama's second term we averaged 217,000 per month. Trump's average had been in the 190 thousands, but so far this year we are at 164,000.

Yes, most people got a small income tax cut but now that has been wiped out by tariffs. Wealthy people are still ahead because they got much bigger dollar amounts from the income tax break but the tariffs don't impact them much more than they impact the average Joe who is falling behind.

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Let me help you, how has the tax cuts helped, refute these results. With population growth, inflation, and that booming Obama economy can you explain to us all how GDP dollar growth dropped the last two years of the Obama term?

1. GDP Growth 2013 to 2018

2013 16784.9
2014 17521.7 736.8
2015 18129.3 607.6
2016 18707.2 577.9
2017 19485.4 778.2
2018 20494.1 1008.7

2016 GDP growth 1.6% annual vs 2.9% 2018 with those terrible tax cuts, 3.2% January thru March 2019

Unemployment Rate 4.7% January 2017 vs. 3.6% today

Employed 152 million January 2017 to 157 million today

U-6 in January 2017 9.3% vs 7.3% today?

Part time for economic reasons, 5.7 million January 2017 vs. 4.6 million today?

African American unemployment 7.7% vs. 6.7% today?

Remember those wonderful Obama years leaving Trump with a 1.6% GDP growth, declining GDP dollars and let's not forget adding 9.3 trillion to the debt with much of that gov't spending in those GDP numbers

Then let's not forget the gloom and doom predictions by the left and the April results
U.S. employers added 263,000 jobs in April again beating Wall Street's expectations and the 3,2% GDP Growth in the first qtr. Of 2019, likely quelling some fears about an impending economic slowdown.

Conservative said:

No, you showed your biased and partisan opinions of the so called facts but no context. You want badly to believe what you are told when negative against Trump but never research to verify the accuracy or even the context

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What I provided you was factual reporting. Although left of center for stories they pick, Media Bias/Fact Check rates Business Insider "factual" in their reporting:

See below:

Business Insider - Media Bias/Fact Check

Overall, we rate Business Insider Left-Center Biased based on story selection that leans left and High for factual reporting due to proper sourcing and a clean fact check record.

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So here's another source: Forbes Magazine.

Trump's Twin Deficits Are Exploding

Candidate Trump campaigned on wiping out the yearly federal deficit, the governments $19 trillion in total debt and reducing the trade deficit. Reality is harsher than campaigning, especially when President Trump signed a huge corporate tax cut (which contained a minor cut for individuals). This has led to the federal deficit on track to reach $1 trillion per year.

Trump has talked loudly but delivered little real results when it comes to impacting trade. Under his watch the trade deficit has grown over $100 billion, going from $502 billion in 2016 to $621 billion in 2018, an increase of 19%. The deficit for Goods has increased $140 billion from $751 billion to $891 billion. At its current pace, the Goods deficit could also hit $1 trillion in 2020

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Meanwhile, you have yet to provide any other source to refute these facts other than your complaining about mine.

Bye.

lurchadams said:

What I provided you was factual reporting. Although left of center for stories they pick, Media Bias/Fact Check rates Business Insider "factual" in their reporting:

See below:

Business Insider - Media Bias/Fact Check



So here's another source: Forbes Magazine.



But keep your blinders on and keep deluding yourself. It seems to be working for you!

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The numbers I post come from bea.gov, bls.gov, Treasury.org none of which resonate with you and all are official data. You certainly are loyal to the liberal ideology yet have never posted any official data to support your claims. The blinders are all yours as apparently you don't understand the role of the federal gov't and how federal bureaucrats without term limits buy votes using your tax dollars. Apparently that is OK with you regardless of the official results

Still waiting for a valid reason to vote for a Democrat as here are the reasons I will be happily voting for Trump. All official data from the sources I cited, refute them

1. GDP Growth 2013 to 2018

2013 16784.9
2014 17521.7 736.8
2015 18129.3 607.6
2016 18707.2 577.9
2017 19485.4 778.2
2018 20494.1 1008.7

2016 GDP growth 1.6% annual vs 2.9% 2018 with those terrible tax cuts, 3.2% January thru March 2019

Unemployment Rate 4.7% January 2017 vs. 3.6% today

Employed 152 million January 2017 to 157 million today

U-6 in January 2017 9.3% vs 7.3% today?

Part time for economic reasons, 5.7 million January 2017 vs. 4.6 million today?

African American unemployment 7.7% vs. 6.7% today?

Remember those wonderful Obama years leaving Trump with a 1.6% GDP growth, declining GDP dollars and let's not forget adding 9.3 trillion to the debt with much of that gov't spending in those GDP numbers

Then let's not forget the gloom and doom predictions by the left and the April results, U.S. employers added 263,000 jobs in April again beating Wall Street's expectations and the 3,2% GDP Growth in the first qtr. Of 2019, likely quelling some fears about an impending economic slowdown.

iguanaman said:

It's probably too optimistic. It doesn't figure in the recession coming in 2020.

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LOL, only if Trump loses.