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Trump says he ‘never said’ Mexico would pay for the wall. But he did – a lot

Lursa said:
You mean, like paying the contractor building an extension on your house in advance and then seeing what happens?

:lamo

And we get criticized for making comments on the intelligence of The Donald's followers :roll:
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If building an addition lowers expenses great, what does that have to do with the wall? Walls work and will cut down illegal entry into this country, that cuts illegal expenses
 
Deuce said:
I'm against the wall because it will be wasteful. Improving border security can be done better, for cheaper. You don't want that. Why? I know why Trump wants the wall. He wants a vanity project, something permanent to put his name on. But you? What do you get from such waste?
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How many billions of dollars has been put into border security? the border below San Diego works and works wherever it is implemented. You just don't like Trump and that is your problem and the country's. There is no justification for not trying the wall and then you can criticize him if it doesn't work
 
Conservative said:
If building an addition lowers expenses great, what does that have to do with the wall? Walls work and will cut down illegal entry into this country, that cuts illegal expenses
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Er no...they walked away when you paid them in advance. You got nuthin'

Your example had us building the wall and expecting reimbursement...like the same fool that paid in advance for a home addition.
 
Lursa said:
Er no...they walked away when you paid them in advance. You got nuthin'

Your example had us building the wall and expecting reimbursement...like the same fool that paid in advance for a home addition.
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I don't expect anything other than a reduction in illegal immigration expenses. Why don't you tell me why this is such a big issue for you? Bet it is all about Trump because you have no idea what you are talking about. Couldn't care less if Mexico pays for the wall, do care about the fiscal and physical costs of illegal immigration none of which resonates with you
 
Deuce said:
No, I'm afraid of dumping hundreds of billions more in debt onto my grandchildren with little benefit.
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Don't worry the wall isn't going to cost "hundreds of billions" and your grand kids wont be taxed to provide education and medical care and etcetera for half of El Salvador , Honduras, and Guatemala. The wall will very likely SAVE your grandkids money. And who knows they may be saved from having a fatal head on wreck with a drunk illegal alien like happen in Dallas last week. We have entirely too many angel moms and dads and that is preventable. The BP says they need them so illegals will be slowed and the BP has increased time to respond and stop the incursion attempt .We have barriers on a portion of the border and where they are illegal immigration is reduced.
 
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Trump lied again? YAWN...
 
Lursa said:
That's off topic. The title of the thread is "Trump says he ‘never said’ Mexico would pay for the wall. But he did – a lot"

And a wall (now it's a 'barrier') is what that $5.7 payment from Mexico is supposed to be for.

This is the discussion.
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A wall is a barrier. A barrier can be a wall. get a grip.

I knew Mexico would never write us a check for the wall. I always figured from the first time Trump mentioned a wall it was a catch all phrase for border security which include properly built walls where needed. I assumed some type of border tax would pay for it the same way we have toll roads and toll bridges. If the money is available from the better trade deal Trump negotiated that is fine as well.

I still would like to see a border tax on all people working in this country that are not citizens or immigrants. I would also like to see a charge or fee for entering into our country. let the people coming here pay for the manpower to run background checks and issue work or student visas. I have to pay to get into most federal parks these people entering our country need to realize it is time to pay as well. Nothing is free. Why should I pay so these people can come visit or work in my country. To hell with that.
 
Conservative said:
You lefties won't give up will you, you think Republicans benefit from illegals? Get back to me when you support the wall and I will blame Trump if Mexico doesn't pay for it then celebrate when the dike is plugged and costs for illegal immigration drops helping lower the deficit and debt? Amazing isn't it how the largest blue state in the country gave Hillary a 4 million vote win, allows for sanctuary cities, illegals to have a valid driver's license yet you blame business. That is nothing but partisanship on your part and turning a blind eye to what the Democratic Party has done
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Since you believe no republicans hire illegals, enjoy the wage depression they represent, don't believe Orrin Hatch tried to get the employer sanctions removed from Reagan's amnesty weeks after passage, I have no more time for you.

I only converse with people that live in the same world I do.

And you obviously can't explain how regular taxpayers don't end up paying for trumps wall.
 
TU Curmudgeon said:
From Global News

Trump says he ‘never said’ Mexico would pay for the wall. But he did – a lot
​

U.S. President Donald Trump is doubling down on claims that Mexico was paying for the proposed border wall between their two countries, saying he “never meant they’re going to write out a cheque.”

Trump reiterated his claim that Mexico is paying for the wall via the new, un-ratified Canada-U.S.-Mexico Trade Agreement (CUSMA) while speaking to reporters at the White House before visiting the Texas border town of McAllen on the 20th day of a partial government shutdown.

Trump has held out for $5.7 billion in partial wall funding during talks with congressional leaders to reopen the government. Democrats have held steadfast in their opposition to providing any money for a border wall.

...

In fact, in October 2016, during the height of the 2016 presidential campaign, Trump released a document called “Donald Trump’s Contract with the American Voter,” in which he said Mexico would “reimburse” the U.S. for the “full cost of the wall.”

In a separate plan presented to the Washington Post during the campaign, he suggested he would cut off access for Mexican immigrants who send money home to their families until Mexico made a “one-time payment” of billions of dollars for the wall. (The plan was regarded as likely illegal, the Washington Post reported.)

COMMENT:-

It's perfectly obvious that when Mr. Trump said "pay" he didn't mean "pay" but rather he meant "pay" that that when he said "one time payment" he didn't mean "write a cheque" he meant "will send several boxcars full of cash".

On the other hand, can we REALLY be sure that the so-called "Donald Trump" that was campaigning is the same person as the so-called "Donald Trump" who is currently purporting to be the President of the United States of America? Isn't **T*H*E** **T*R*U*T*H** that the so-called "Donald Trump" you see/hear today is actually a mind-controlled doppelganger that is being operated by the Deep State for the benefit of their Lizard People masters?
​
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SIAP. Just wonderin' how much Mexico will have to pay for the wall?
 
buck said:
Earlier in the conversation, I stated that I didn't think the wall was a great idea.. However, you seem to be indicating if it won't be 100% successful, why bother trying.

Not all criminals are caught and many get away every day. So why have laws at all?
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No. I just want to see employers sanctioned.

As the law says they should be.

They never have.

Do it with heavy fines and rewards and it wouldn't even cost much. Maybe even be a net gain.

End the draw. Nobody would hire them if they knew it would cost them $5000 a head and that the $500 reward per head would get them turned in.

This would punish those exploiting the illegals and harming their fellow Americans. The REAL criminals in this equation.
 
Conservative said:
Where is that "HUNDREDS of BILLIONS"coming from? This truly is embarrassing that so many including you are so poorly informed. 5 billion dollars will re-open the govt. and couldn't care less whether or not Mexico pays for it for the cost of illegals is somewhere between 50 and 300 billion a year annually so cutting that expense is the goal and if it doesn't work then you truly have something to blame Trump for not speculation and media tabloid politics
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Ask Facebook or Google. They already know where the illegals are and who is hiring them. The NSA too, but they won't admit it.

Algorithms could easily find them in a matter of days. Get the employers. Make them pay for the enforcement with fines.

The spectre of being bankrupted will put an end to the hiring of illegal labor.

Without the draw of jobs, they'll self deport. They did after the housing crash.
 
Conservative said:
I don't expect anything other than a reduction in illegal immigration expenses. Why don't you tell me why this is such a big issue for you? Bet it is all about Trump because you have no idea what you are talking about. Couldn't care less if Mexico pays for the wall, do care about the fiscal and physical costs of illegal immigration none of which resonates with you
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Going after employers can start in months or less. The wall will take years to build. Will have to be manned during construction so the sappers don't wreck it before the sensors and guards are in place.

His many billions will illegals cost us in the time it takes to build a wall?

You have lost what little credibility on government expense with your casual call for billions for something that might work. Years from now.

While not even having a harsh word for the American criminals who hire illegals.
 
What if...? said:
Since you believe no republicans hire illegals, enjoy the wage depression they represent, don't believe Orrin Hatch tried to get the employer sanctions removed from Reagan's amnesty weeks after passage, I have no more time for you.

I only converse with people that live in the same world I do.

And you obviously can't explain how regular taxpayers don't end up paying for trumps wall.
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And if you believe it is only Republicans and that the state of California politicians don't remain in office because of this issue, you are indeed very naive. If it is Republican businesses that hire illegals the Republican Party would benefit and historical results show Democrats benefiting from the Hispanic population and there is no way California gives Hillary a 4 million vote win if illegals favor the Republicans. Why is it cost reductions are never factored into yours or the leftwing arguments it is always about expense only. Reducing illegal immigration pays for the costs

Where you live is in forums where most of the people support what you want to believe.
 
What if...? said:
Going after employers can start in months or less. The wall will take years to build. Will have to be manned during construction so the sappers don't wreck it before the sensors and guards are in place.

His many billions will illegals cost us in the time it takes to build a wall?

You have lost what little credibility on government expense with your casual call for billions for something that might work. Years from now.

While not even having a harsh word for the American criminals who hire illegals.
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Have you ever run a business? I have and employed over 1200 employees, I had to jump through hoops to make sure all employees were legal so this isn't the big major issue you think it is especially when it comes to party. My credibility isn't at stake, yours is.

You want to blame Trump for almost every issue without giving him the tools to be held accountable, a budget for example and now a wall. You now blame him for a broken promise of Mexico paying for a wall that doesn't exist. So now it is blaming Trump for not having a wall. So predictable and so little credibility you have

Billions have already been thrown at the problem when the reality is walls work, they work in San Diego and wherever implemented. CNN found that out and refused to report the story.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...order-wall-would-work/?utm_term=.b80dc36083cd

https://www.jpost.com/American-Poli...ion-CNN-refused-to-air-pro-wall-report-577119
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
A wall is a barrier. A barrier can be a wall. get a grip.

I knew Mexico would never write us a check for the wall. I always figured from the first time Trump mentioned a wall it was a catch all phrase for border security which include properly built walls where needed. I assumed some type of border tax would pay for it the same way we have toll roads and toll bridges. If the money is available from the better trade deal Trump negotiated that is fine as well.

I still would like to see a border tax on all people working in this country that are not citizens or immigrants. I would also like to see a charge or fee for entering into our country. let the people coming here pay for the manpower to run background checks and issue work or student visas. I have to pay to get into most federal parks these people entering our country need to realize it is time to pay as well. Nothing is free. Why should I pay so these people can come visit or work in my country. To hell with that.
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How does the money get to wall building from Mexico and not American taxpayers?

Nobody can explain why a border tax won't just be paid by taxpayers in increased prices like all other taxes get passed on to consumers.

Maybe some businesses will enjoy some benefit. But that benefit won't lower prices. It'll just end up as profits.

Maybe trump.just means Mexico will fund the transition from illegal to legal employees. So those American criminals are made whole from their loss of that cheap labor.

THAT would he in keeping with modern conservatism.
 
TU Curmudgeon said:
From Global News

Trump says he ‘never said’ Mexico would pay for the wall. But he did – a lot
​

U.S. President Donald Trump is doubling down on claims that Mexico was paying for the proposed border wall between their two countries, saying he “never meant they’re going to write out a cheque.”

Trump reiterated his claim that Mexico is paying for the wall via the new, un-ratified Canada-U.S.-Mexico Trade Agreement (CUSMA) while speaking to reporters at the White House before visiting the Texas border town of McAllen on the 20th day of a partial government shutdown.

Trump has held out for $5.7 billion in partial wall funding during talks with congressional leaders to reopen the government. Democrats have held steadfast in their opposition to providing any money for a border wall.

...

In fact, in October 2016, during the height of the 2016 presidential campaign, Trump released a document called “Donald Trump’s Contract with the American Voter,” in which he said Mexico would “reimburse” the U.S. for the “full cost of the wall.”

In a separate plan presented to the Washington Post during the campaign, he suggested he would cut off access for Mexican immigrants who send money home to their families until Mexico made a “one-time payment” of billions of dollars for the wall. (The plan was regarded as likely illegal, the Washington Post reported.)

COMMENT:-

It's perfectly obvious that when Mr. Trump said "pay" he didn't mean "pay" but rather he meant "pay" that that when he said "one time payment" he didn't mean "write a cheque" he meant "will send several boxcars full of cash".

On the other hand, can we REALLY be sure that the so-called "Donald Trump" that was campaigning is the same person as the so-called "Donald Trump" who is currently purporting to be the President of the United States of America? Isn't **T*H*E** **T*R*U*T*H** that the so-called "Donald Trump" you see/hear today is actually a mind-controlled doppelganger that is being operated by the Deep State for the benefit of their Lizard People masters?
​
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Interesting. In all your years of watching and partaking in politics, how many politicians do you know of who always told the truth? 1? 2 maybe?
Yet when Obama said stupid crap...it was accepted that politicians lie.
When allot of politicians sad stupid crap...do you fly into an uproar over each instance? Doubtful...

Ya Trump said Mexico would pay for the wall. Do I think he always meant the profits from the new trade deal would pay for it? Not really.
But you miss the point here. What were the people at the Trump rallies chanting...I mean other than "Lock her up!"...
"BUILD THAT WALL!"
People don't really care where the money comes from. And I doubt many people actually believed Mexico would pony-up for it.
They want a wall. They voted for a wall. Walls happen to work.
Its not "racist" nor is it "immoral". Its a security measure wanted by people who feel threatened by illegal migration, and by the criminal element.
Let's do try to not forget that Mexico is 'Murder Central'. It is a good idea to curtail migration from 'Murder Central'.

But its Trump who's backing the wall. That alone makes it all abhorrent to way too many people.
These people put their pure hatred of Trump, ahead of the safety of their fellow citizens.
Nothing is beneath these fine, hate-filled souls, as evidenced at the Kavanaugh hearings.
 
What if...? said:
Ask Facebook or Google. They already know where the illegals are and who is hiring them. The NSA too, but they won't admit it.

Algorithms could easily find them in a matter of days. Get the employers. Make them pay for the enforcement with fines.

The spectre of being bankrupted will put an end to the hiring of illegal labor.

Without the draw of jobs, they'll self deport. They did after the housing crash.
Click to expand...

There are already laws on the books to prevent illegal hiring but just like a typical liberal you want more laws that aren't enforced. Plug the dike and there are no people to deport
 
Conservative said:
And if you believe it is only Republicans and that the state of California politicians don't remain in office because of this issue, you are indeed very naive. If it is Republican businesses that hire illegals the Republican Party would benefit and historical results show Democrats benefiting from the Hispanic population and there is no way California gives Hillary a 4 million vote win if illegals favor the Republicans. Why is it cost reductions are never factored into yours or the leftwing arguments it is always about expense only. Reducing illegal immigration pays for the costs

Where you live is in forums where most of the people support what you want to believe.
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AAAAND still ducking an actual response.

Go after employers first and then get back to me if that doesn't work.

Do the cheap, immediate thing now. Ask for wall money if that doesn't work.

Fiscal ****ing responsibility.

If you have a fire use an extinguisher.

Don't spend years and billions diverting a river to put it out.
 
What if...? said:
AAAAND still ducking an actual response.

Go after employers first and then get back to me if that doesn't work.

Do the cheap, immediate thing now. Ask for wall money if that doesn't work.

Fiscal ****ing responsibility.

If you have a fire use an extinguisher.

Don't spend years and billions diverting a river to put it out.
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No, you do both, stop the flow and there are no employers to go after. You have given no logical reason not to support a wall as this is all about Trump. 5 billion dollars is cheap when talking about a 4.4 TRILLION dollar govt. If the wall fails you believe 5 billion is going to prevent people from getting welfare checks?
 
What if...? said:
No. I just want to see employers sanctioned.

As the law says they should be.

They never have.

Do it with heavy fines and rewards and it wouldn't even cost much. Maybe even be a net gain.

End the draw. Nobody would hire them if they knew it would cost them $5000 a head and that the $500 reward per head would get them turned in.

This would punish those exploiting the illegals and harming their fellow Americans. The REAL criminals in this equation.
Click to expand...
What sanction do you propose for illegal Social Security card usage by undocumenteds to work in the US? That those Social Security benefits will eventually have to be paid by the US?
 
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What if...? said:
Ask Facebook or Google. They already know where the illegals are and who is hiring them. The NSA too, but they won't admit it.

Algorithms could easily find them in a matter of days. Get the employers. Make them pay for the enforcement with fines.

The spectre of being bankrupted will put an end to the hiring of illegal labor.

Without the draw of jobs, they'll self deport. They did after the housing crash.
Click to expand...

Precisely what I have argued since day one, conveniently ignored by everyone and anyone who insists they give a damn about our country.

42 pages of arguing about the president lying when he is on tape repeatedly lying. How conservatives can defend this is beyond me.
 
Conservative said:
Have you ever run a business? I have and employed over 1200 employees, I had to jump through hoops to make sure all employees were legal so this isn't the big major issue you think it is especially when it comes to party. My credibility isn't at stake, yours is.

You want to blame Trump for almost every issue without giving him the tools to be held accountable, a budget for example and now a wall. You now blame him for a broken promise of Mexico paying for a wall that doesn't exist. So now it is blaming Trump for not having a wall. So predictable and so little credibility you have

Billions have already been thrown at the problem when the reality is walls work, they work in San Diego and wherever implemented. CNN found that out and refused to report the story.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...order-wall-would-work/?utm_term=.b80dc36083cd

https://www.jpost.com/American-Poli...ion-CNN-refused-to-air-pro-wall-report-577119
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Does it hurt when you contort to make these arguments?

You obviously tried to make a point that employers aren't a big issue because you had to Jump through hoops. With a side of republicans don't hire illegals.

They work on farms and in meat and milk operations in red states. Red states. You are pretending that republican donors don't use illegal labor when they certainly do. If it was all democrats republicans would have gone after them decades ago.

Yours is a vapid position, based only on an ever shifting set of YOUR criteria. Cherry picked to make the point you want to make while ignoring any countering aspects.
 
cabse5 said:
What sanction do you propose for illegal Social Security card usage by undocumenteds to work in the US? That those Social Security benefits will eventually have to be paid by the US.
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Anyone caught using an illegal social security card suffers immediate deportation. Anyone here illegally suffers immediate deportation. Anyone caught hiring illegals suffers immediate legal consequences with mandatory minimums.
 
Conservative said:
There are already laws on the books to prevent illegal hiring but just like a typical liberal you want more laws that aren't enforced. Plug the dike and there are no people to deport
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I have been calling for enforcement of existing laws. To you. Over and over.

Drain the reservoir and you don't need a dike. See how easy that was? Its because you are arguing from stupid.
 
Obscurity said:
Anyone caught using an illegal social security card suffers immediate deportation. Anyone here illegally suffers immediate deportation. Anyone caught hiring illegals suffers immediate legal consequences with mandatory minimums.
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Algorithms can catch the misused social security numbers in seconds. As well as those just paying them under the table.

Mandate e-verify for every employee. Pretty simple.

Have you noticed that the law and order party has no interest whatsoever in enforcing THESE laws? Except on ONE side of the equation, of course.
 
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