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President Trump proposes launching state-run media network

Do you realize what would happen to the American economy if defence spending was cut by 40% so that it was equal to the defence spending of the next three largest defence spenders?

Well think how much more of that impact would happen if the US defence spending was cut by 50+% with the Russians taken out of the equation.

The American Left are a coalition of special interests, and it seems like the NATO lobby have embedded themselves into that coalition. The Left's pliability serves NATO well - call it Affirmative Action for Europeans.
 
Why bother?
Your have very limited knowledge of US politics and current need and information.

So in other words, you have no case to make. You're relying on innuendo and false allegations to ram war down everyone else's throats.
 
You're doubling down on this? We don't use upper and lower houses. We have a House and Senate. They are entirely different than the bicameral systems you clearly have in mind. Maybe you're thinking of some bitch beaten India? Indira Ghandi maybe? But she was shot so I guess that doesn't count.

Lol, it's crazy how much you can tell from a person's choice of words.

Speaking of yourself, I see. Ethnic-baiting me shows what your "liberalism" is all about. Maybe you should say that to Kamala Harris too, since you probably don't know where her parents are from.

The House of Representatives are a larger lower house, and the Senate are the smaller upper house. The US Senate is fully elected, unlike a British House of Lords which is appointed, and I think that makes the American setup an improvement over previous systems. My mentioning of the Senate as an "upper house" was to point out that the Dems didn't make a clean-sweep of Congress. Trump & GOP are right to feel that they out-performed past historical trends, because the fact that the Republicans held the Senate is better than the results of most other Congressional mid-terms.
 
So in other words, you have no case to make. You're relying on innuendo and false allegations to ram war down everyone else's throats.

And that post shows inability to comprehend English.
 
Speaking of yourself, I see. Ethnic-baiting me shows what your "liberalism" is all about. Maybe you should say that to Kamala Harris too, since you probably don't know where her parents are from.

The House of Representatives are a larger lower house, and the Senate are the smaller upper house. The US Senate is fully elected, unlike a British House of Lords which is appointed, and I think that makes the American setup an improvement over previous systems. My mentioning of the Senate as an "upper house" was to point out that the Dems didn't make a clean-sweep of Congress. Trump & GOP are right to feel that they out-performed past historical trends, because the fact that the Republicans held the Senate is better than the results of most other Congressional mid-terms.

Homey don't think so.
You had that huge COTUS debacle.
Don't discuss what you can't understand.
 
I see that, not only do you not know what "methodology" is, you don't know what "nebulous" means.
Apparently you don't see since I provided a definition of methodology that that fits my comment.

TU Curmudgeon said:
The "accusation" (although I prefer "statement") was (and you'll pardon me if I paraphrase down to the appropriate level) "Your objections are crap." and that isn't in the least bit "nebulous".
Paraphrase down to a level you'll understand - although I realize it's impossible to write with crayons on the internet. My point was you presented an alleged study for an unidentified source that made some supposed conclusions.


By the way


neb·u·lous
/ˈnebyələs/
adjective
adjective: nebulous
in the form of a cloud or haze; hazy.
"a giant nebulous glow"
synonyms:
indistinct, indefinite, unclear, vague, hazy, cloudy, fuzzy, misty, blurred, blurry, foggy; More
faint, shadowy, obscure, formless, amorphous

"the figure was nebulous"
antonyms:
clear
(of a concept or idea) unclear, vague, or ill-defined.
"nebulous concepts like quality of life"
synonyms:
vague, ill-defined, unclear, hazy, uncertain, indefinite, indeterminate, imprecise, unformed, muddled, confused, ambiguous
"nebulous ideas"
antonyms:
well defined
another term for nebular.
 
How can a nation where the people are fully convinced that "The Other Guy" is **W*R*O*N*G**!!!" (even if 'The Other Guy' is saying the same thing as 'Our Guy') possibly be "confused?

Sometimes the answer to a political question is clear. Usually there are no absolutes to anything especially in politics. We have checks and balances installed in our constitution for a reason. I wouldn't want to live under
Republican or Democratic government ALL the time. Our various news media calls our government to task regardless of what kind of government it is. Its probably an unfounded fear that ALL of our news media could be taken over by rich powerful people on the left or right. If that could happen it would probably upset both of us. People need to learn how to talk across a political divide instead of just yelling and hurling insults.

We can hopefully agree that right before elections there are vast amounts of political gymnastics and mis information campaigns to try to influence our vote.
 
faux sure would lose a lot of viewers

The Trump Propaganda network

the poorly educated, misinformed, bigoted, racist trump supporters would flock to it.
 
The American Left are a coalition of special interests, and it seems like the NATO lobby have embedded themselves into that coalition. The Left's pliability serves NATO well - call it Affirmative Action for Europeans.

"The American Left" is about as "left-wing" as the Conservative Party of Canada.
 
So in other words, you have no case to make. You're relying on innuendo and false allegations to ram war down everyone else's throats.

Isn't that the "traditional" way to do it?

"Conservatives" venerate "tradition", don't they?

Why would you expect a "Conservative" to start using "direct, simple, unambiguous statements" and "truthful allegations" rather than sticking with "tradition"?
 
Homey don't think so.
You had that huge COTUS debacle.
Don't discuss what you can't understand.

I know that this is both irrelevant and irreverent, but whenever I see "COTUS" and think about Mr. Trump's threats to shut down the US government if it doesn't do what he tells it to do, I keep wondering if we are (should that happen) going to see a headline like

TRUMP's
COTUS INTERRUPTUS

PS - Sorry about that, but now that I've gotten rid of it, it's your problem.
 
Apparently you don't see since I provided a definition of methodology that that fits my comment.

Paraphrase down to a level you'll understand - although I realize it's impossible to write with crayons on the internet. My point was you presented an alleged study for an unidentified source that made some supposed conclusions.

I said that I "recalled" such a study, and admitted that I didn't have a link to it any longer.

You might also note that I did, when it was suggested that my recollection was faulty, present links to other studies that showed (essentially) the same thing. I suppose that it was only accidental that you failed to acknowledge that fact, so you are forgiven.

PS - Your original objections were, and still are, crap.
 
YOU might spend a little time and try and grasp my "position". This is actually what I was asking for - documentation.

Really?

Your original post didn't ask for documentation, it merely said that the study was invalid because you didn't know where it came from.

Now that you do have some relevant documentation (and I still cannot recall where the original study that I recalled came from), what is your position on the substance of the findings?

I'll help you out there and summarize the findings - "People tend to think that stuff that they get from a source that has a reputation for agreeing with the position that those people hold is 'less biased' than they do for stuff that they get from a source that has a reputation for disagreeing with the position that those people hold AND that is independent of what the stuff is or whether or not it is actually biased."

PS - Did you know that one really obscure way of asking for documentation is "Do you have a link to support that statement?"?
 
I know that this is both irrelevant and irreverent, but whenever I see "COTUS" and think about Mr. Trump's threats to shut down the US government if it doesn't do what he tells it to do, I keep wondering if we are (should that happen) going to see a headline like

TRUMP's
COTUS INTERRUPTUS

PS - Sorry about that, but now that I've gotten rid of it, it's your problem.
I call him SCROTUS - So Called Ruler Of The US.
 
Sometimes the answer to a political question is clear. Usually there are no absolutes to anything especially in politics. We have checks and balances installed in our constitution for a reason. I wouldn't want to live under
Republican or Democratic government ALL the time.

On the other hand, you don't appear to have any objection to living under a government that alternates between "The MORE Reactionary Wing of the American Oligarchic Capitalist Party" and "The LESS Reactionary Wing of the American Oligarchic Capitalist Party"

Our various news media calls our government to task regardless of what kind of government it is.

Make that "Some of our various ..." and you've got a deal.

Its probably an unfounded fear that ALL of our news media could be taken over by rich powerful people on the left or right. If that could happen it would probably upset both of us.

True, all that would be "taken over" would be significant sectors.

People need to learn how to talk across a political divide instead of just yelling and hurling insults.

Are you advocating the complete destruction of "American Politics As We Know It"!!!

We can hopefully agree that right before elections there are vast amounts of political gymnastics and mis information campaigns to try to influence our vote.

We most certainly can, and that "right before" period extends for approximately 1,461 days,

There is, in fact, no such time as "between elections" in the United States of America any longer.
 
Really?

Your original post didn't ask for documentation, it merely said that the study was invalid because you didn't know where it came from.
Ok, and that wasn't just a teensy clue?

TU Curmudgeon said:
Now that you do have some relevant documentation (and I still cannot recall where the original study that I recalled came from), what is your position on the substance of the findings?
A massive yaaaaaaaawwwnnnnnnnn. Pretty much what I expected from the source you chose.

TU Curmudgeon said:
I'll help you out there and summarize the findings - "People tend to think that stuff that they get from a source that has a reputation for agreeing with the position that those people hold is 'less biased' than they do for stuff that they get from a source that has a reputation for disagreeing with the position that those people hold AND that is independent of what the stuff is or whether or not it is actually biased."
Yeah, if you hand someone a document and say "read the conservative trash" they're going to agree with you. Similarly for liberal information. People tend to believe what agrees with the current beliefs - it's called confirmation bias. But commonsense says in a balanced environment pro-left and pro-right biases should be roughly equal and that is definitely NOT the case in the Main Stream Media. They whine and cry about "free press" but totally ignore its adjunct - fair press.
TU Curmudegeon said:
PS - Did you know that one really obscure way of asking for documentation is "Do you have a link to support that statement?"?
Do you know that saying "I forget where this comes from" kinda negates the idea of asking for a link.
 
Ok, and that wasn't just a teensy clue?

While it is quite possible for an astute reader to (correctly) read "Please provide some evidence to back up your position." as "That's bull ****!", it is much less likely that one would read "That's bull****!" as "Please provide some evidence to back up your position.".

I merely took your post (which translates as "That's bull****!") to mean exactly what it implied.

A massive yaaaaaaaawwwnnnnnnnn. Pretty much what I expected from the source you chose.

TRANSLATION - "Thanks, but that data doesn't say what I want to hear, so I won't pay any attention to it."

Yeah, if you hand someone a document and say "read the conservative trash" they're going to agree with you. Similarly for liberal information.

And, of course, since you haven't bothered to find out how the study was conducted, you have reached the conclusion that it was conducted in that manner based on what? Let me guess, the basis for your conclusion is "I want to dismiss the findings and if the study was conducted in a highly prejudicial manner then I can dismiss the findings, so that must mean that the study was conducted in a highly prejudicial manner. As proof of that, I have dismissed the findings of the study and I always dismiss the findings of studies conducted in a highly prejudicial manner which means that the studies were conducted in a highly prejudicial manner because I have dismissed the findings of the study."

People tend to believe what agrees with the current beliefs - it's called confirmation bias.

November Sierra Sierra.

And what do you call it when "Person A" WILL believe "Statement B" provided that it comes from a source that "Person A" knows generally DOES support the views that "Person A" holds, but WILL NOT believe the IDENTICAL "Statement B" if it comes from a source that "Person A" knows generally DOES NOT support the views that "Person A" holds? In other words, whether what "Person A" hears is "what they want to hear" depending MORE on where they hear it from and LESS on what it is that they hear.

But commonsense says in a balanced environment pro-left and pro-right biases should be roughly equal and that is definitely NOT the case in the Main Stream Media.

In a world where the "mission" of the media was to provide information and enlightened comment so that the consumers of the media output could make up their own minds in an intelligent and rational manner, I would agree with your first half completely.

Unfortunately that is NOT the world we live in. The "mission" of the media is to make as much money for the owners of the media as possible and that has nothing whatsoever to do with "balance" and one hell of a lot to do with "market share". "Unbalanced coverage" has a MUCH better ROI than "balanced coverage" because people do NOT want to hear that what they believe is absolute crap.

They whine and cry about "free press" but totally ignore its adjunct - fair press.

You might benefit from actually reading what was in the general circulation media at the time of the American Revolution. You might also want to extend that survey to the eras both before and after the American Revolution. In fact, if you look at the actual history of the media, the amount of "fair" press today is likely to be roughly at the same level as it was at the time of the American Revolution (which is to say "damn little").

Do you know that saying "I forget where this comes from" kinda negates the idea of asking for a link.

True, but it does not negate "I find that interesting, could you try and find it again for me. Thanks."

PS - As an example of "believing absolute crap because it comes from a source that supports what I believe in", you might want to contact the Student Christian Movement to see if they still have their records from their 1964 (I think) International Conference that was held in Cleveland and ask them to send you the (approximately 200 page long) report on the "focus group" that had as its topic "Mass Media, Public Opinion, and Politics" and which ran the campaign to force the SCM to reverse the decision to bar the admission of the "North Korean Christian Students Association" delegation (I think that that was the name the "focus group" used to describe the non-existent delegation [if not, it's close]) to see how fast a group of intelligent and educated people can be convinced of the reality of something that even ten minutes of thought would have shown was totally bogus.
 
While it is quite possible for an astute reader to (correctly) read "Please provide some evidence to back up your position." as "That's bull ****!", it is much less likely that one would read "That's bull****!" as "Please provide some evidence to back up your position.".

I merely took your post (which translates as "That's bull****!") to mean exactly what it implied.



TRANSLATION - "Thanks, but that data doesn't say what I want to hear, so I won't pay any attention to it."



And, of course, since you haven't bothered to find out how the study was conducted, you have reached the conclusion that it was conducted in that manner based on what? Let me guess, the basis for your conclusion is "I want to dismiss the findings and if the study was conducted in a highly prejudicial manner then I can dismiss the findings, so that must mean that the study was conducted in a highly prejudicial manner. As proof of that, I have dismissed the findings of the study and I always dismiss the findings of studies conducted in a highly prejudicial manner which means that the studies were conducted in a highly prejudicial manner because I have dismissed the findings of the study."



November Sierra Sierra.

And what do you call it when "Person A" WILL believe "Statement B" provided that it comes from a source that "Person A" knows generally DOES support the views that "Person A" holds, but WILL NOT believe the IDENTICAL "Statement B" if it comes from a source that "Person A" knows generally DOES NOT support the views that "Person A" holds? In other words, whether what "Person A" hears is "what they want to hear" depending MORE on where they hear it from and LESS on what it is that they hear.



In a world where the "mission" of the media was to provide information and enlightened comment so that the consumers of the media output could make up their own minds in an intelligent and rational manner, I would agree with your first half completely.

Unfortunately that is NOT the world we live in. The "mission" of the media is to make as much money for the owners of the media as possible and that has nothing whatsoever to do with "balance" and one hell of a lot to do with "market share". "Unbalanced coverage" has a MUCH better ROI than "balanced coverage" because people do NOT want to hear that what they believe is absolute crap.



You might benefit from actually reading what was in the general circulation media at the time of the American Revolution. You might also want to extend that survey to the eras both before and after the American Revolution. In fact, if you look at the actual history of the media, the amount of "fair" press today is likely to be roughly at the same level as it was at the time of the American Revolution (which is to say "damn little").



True, but it does not negate "I find that interesting, could you try and find it again for me. Thanks."

PS - As an example of "believing absolute crap because it comes from a source that supports what I believe in", you might want to contact the Student Christian Movement to see if they still have their records from their 1964 (I think) International Conference that was held in Cleveland and ask them to send you the (approximately 200 page long) report on the "focus group" that had as its topic "Mass Media, Public Opinion, and Politics" and which ran the campaign to force the SCM to reverse the decision to bar the admission of the "North Korean Christian Students Association" delegation (I think that that was the name the "focus group" used to describe the non-existent delegation [if not, it's close]) to see how fast a group of intelligent and educated people can be convinced of the reality of something that even ten minutes of thought would have shown was totally bogus.
When you can't dazzle me with brilliance you attempt to bury me with bull****. Give it a break TU.
 
[h=1]President Trump proposes launching state-run media network[/h]
if there was an remaining doubt that this guy is an autocrat with totalitarian ambitions, this should put a rest to those doubts.

I am looking forward to conservatives here, with their free market ideology, twisting themselves into pretzels defending the government getting into the news business to compete against private news services.

We already have a state run media. It’s called Fox. And we also have some of Fox’s ‘journalists’ running the government. It’s a win win! :roll:
 
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