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Trump says US is ending decades-old nuclear arms treaty with Russia

poweRob

poweRob

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Okay... Mueller investigation is winding up and probably start seeing movement after the election and VOILA! Trump starts acting like he's tough on Russia. Coincidence? :lol:

Expect an extraordinary amount of the republican deflection machine and trump's twitter account flailing about as they turn up the noise to eleven just after the election.

Trump says US is ending decades-old nuclear arms treaty with Russia

President Donald Trump announced Saturday that the US is pulling out of the landmark Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty with Russia, a decades-old agreement that has drawn the ire of the President.

"Russia has violated the agreement. They've been violating it for many years," Trump told reporters before boarding Air Force One to leave Nevada following a campaign rally.​
 
poweRob said:
Okay... Mueller investigation is winding up and probably start seeing movement after the election and VOILA! Trump starts acting like he's tough on Russia. Coincidence? :lol:
Click to expand...


I'd say you got it backwards, Obamafail let Putin take over Crimea, Putin told Obamafail to stop the missile defence system to NATO, and Obamafail stopped it. Putin told Obamafail to not help Ukraine with arms. Obamafail relied on Putin to insure him Syria got rid of their WMD's, Putin lied to Obamafail. Putin ran into Syria and told Obamafail to get out of his way. When Putin told Obamafail to jump Obamafail asked how high.

Remember the open mike, when I get reelected I can help Putin even more.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-election.html

Now to Rocket Ram. Obamafail did what to stop NK's nuke program. I'll tell you absolutely nothing, in fact under Obamafail Rocket Man was designing nukes and missiles right under Obamafal's nose and he did not do a ****ing thing.

Bone up on your history, you have a loss of memory
 
Letting Russia out of a deal is being tough? It's not like our arsenal is suffering.
 
Born Free said:
I'd say you got it backwards, Obamafail let Putin take over Crimea, Putin told Obamafail to stop the missile defence system to NATO, and Obamafail stopped it. Putin told Obamafail to not help Ukraine with arms. Obamafail relied on Putin to insure him Syria got rid of their WMD's, Putin lied to Obamafail. Putin ran into Syria and told Obamafail to get out of his way. When Putin told Obamafail to jump Obamafail asked how high.

Remember the open mike, when I get reelected I can help Putin even more.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-election.html

Now to Rocket Ram. Obamafail did what to stop NK's nuke program. I'll tell you absolutely nothing, in fact under Obamafail Rocket Man was designing nukes and missiles right under Obamafal's nose and he did not do a ****ing thing.

Bone up on your history, you have a loss of memory
Click to expand...

So Trump renegs on another nuclear arms agreement and somehow that's supposed to deter Iran, Russia and N. Korea from building nuclear weapons?!? How does that work exactly?

Well, if it's anything like NAFTA it will be renegotiated and end up being the same as the original treaty except with Trump's name on it. And it will cost taxpayers millions.
 
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Born Free said:
I'd say you got it backwards, Obamafail let Putin take over Crimea, Putin told Obamafail to stop the missile defence system to NATO, and Obamafail stopped it. Putin told Obamafail to not help Ukraine with arms. Obamafail relied on Putin to insure him Syria got rid of their WMD's, Putin lied to Obamafail. Putin ran into Syria and told Obamafail to get out of his way. When Putin told Obamafail to jump Obamafail asked how high.

Remember the open mike, when I get reelected I can help Putin even more.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-election.html

Now to Rocket Ram. Obamafail did what to stop NK's nuke program. I'll tell you absolutely nothing, in fact under Obamafail Rocket Man was designing nukes and missiles right under Obamafal's nose and he did not do a ****ing thing.

Bone up on your history, you have a loss of memory
Click to expand...

This treaty was signed by REAGAN. You know, a Republican President who actually knew how to be tough on Russia.

Or are you going to throw Reagan under the bus, too?
 
poweRob said:
Okay... Mueller investigation is winding up and probably start seeing movement after the election and VOILA! Trump starts acting like he's tough on Russia. Coincidence? :lol:
Click to expand...

Oh, so that's your spin? I thought you wanted to claim that "bad-tempered Trump is picking a fight with Russia! WW3!" yada yada yada.
Because that's what your side have done in the past, in these situations.

The Russians don't care so much about nuclear treaties like INF, because they face more vulnerability on the conventional front than from nukes.
 
Phys251 said:
This treaty was signed by REAGAN. You know, a Republican President who actually knew how to be tough on Russia.

Or are you going to throw Reagan under the bus, too?
Click to expand...

Ohh, you're suddenly acknowledging Reagan - the same guy who did the REAGAN TAX CUTS and the REAGAN DEFENSE BUILDUP - the exact same things Trump is doing.
How selective your memory is.

A treaty isn't worth preserving if the other side is violating it. Just like with tariffs - why keep low tariffs on your side if the other side has high tariffs against you?
Such agreements are only worthwhile if both sides comply!
 
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Moot said:
So Trump renegs on another nuclear arms agreement and somehow that's supposed to deter Iran, Russia and N. Korea from building nuclear weapons?!? How does that work exactly?

Well, if it's anything like NAFTA it will be renegotiated and end up being the same as the original treaty except with Trump's name on it. And it will cost taxpayers millions.
Click to expand...

Oh stop. Russia hasn't been a willing partner in this treaty for the last 3 years.
https://www.npr.org/2017/03/09/519499961/pentagon-confirms-russia-violated-nuclear-arms-treaty

Instead of withdrawing, they cheated and denied these violations while expecting the US to abide by the treary
 
sanman said:
Ohh, you're suddenly acknowledging Reagan - the same guy who did the REAGAN TAX CUTS and the REAGAN DEFENSE BUILDUP.
Click to expand...

Please stay on topic. We are talking about one of the good things he did, and that is to actually hold Russia accountable.

Now if you're not in favor of that, just let us know by saying you support tRump's effort to renege.
 
Phys251 said:
Please stay on topic. We are talking about one of the good things he did, and that is to actually hold Russia accountable.

Now if you're not in favor of that, just let us know by saying you support tRump's effort to renege.
Click to expand...

How sly of you to only quote part of my comments - the part you omitted is what neutralizes your rebuttal.

sanman said:
A treaty isn't worth preserving if the other side is violating it. Just like with tariffs - why keep low tariffs on your side if the other side has high tariffs against you?
Such agreements are only worthwhile if both sides comply!
Click to expand...
 
poweRob said:
Okay... Mueller investigation is winding up and probably start seeing movement after the election and VOILA! Trump starts acting like he's tough on Russia. Coincidence? :lol:

Expect an extraordinary amount of the republican deflection machine and trump's twitter account flailing about as they turn up the noise to eleven just after the election.

Trump says US is ending decades-old nuclear arms treaty with Russia

President Donald Trump announced Saturday that the US is pulling out of the landmark Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty with Russia, a decades-old agreement that has drawn the ire of the President.

"Russia has violated the agreement. They've been violating it for many years," Trump told reporters before boarding Air Force One to leave Nevada following a campaign rally.​
Click to expand...

https://www.debatepolitics.com/brea...dent-trump-pull-us-russia-missile-treaty.html
 
sanman said:
How sly of you to only quote part of my comments
Click to expand...
You support tRump and insist on the whole truth. :lamo

Do you really thing Reagan was stupid enough to sign a nuclear arms treaty with the Soviet Union without recognizing that they might renege on it? Jesus I miss the good old days where bending the knee to Russia was something that no President of either party even considered doing. Now tRump wants to turn America into Russia's little bitch. And a loud minority of Americans want to go right along with it.
 
Phys251 said:
This treaty was signed by REAGAN. You know, a Republican President who actually knew how to be tough on Russia.

Or are you going to throw Reagan under the bus, too?
Click to expand...

No just Obamafail which I was respond to:

Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
Okay... Mueller investigation is winding up and probably start seeing movement after the election and VOILA! Trump starts acting like he's tough on Russia. Coincidence?
 
Moot said:
So Trump renegs on another nuclear arms agreement and somehow that's supposed to deter Iran, Russia and N. Korea from building nuclear weapons?!? How does that work exactly?

Well, if it's anything like NAFTA it will be renegotiated and end up being the same as the original treaty except with Trump's name on it. And it will cost taxpayers millions.
Click to expand...

Sorry it's like this:

I'd say you got it backwards, Obamafail let Putin take over Crimea, Putin told Obamafail to stop the missile defence system to NATO, and Obamafail stopped it. Putin told Obamafail to not help Ukraine with arms. Obamafail relied on Putin to insure him Syria got rid of their WMD's, Putin lied to Obamafail. Putin ran into Syria and told Obamafail to get out of his way. When Putin told Obamafail to jump Obamafail asked how high.

Remember the open mike, when I get reelected I can help Putin even more.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-election.html

Now to Rocket Man. Obamafail did what to stop NK's nuke program. I'll tell you absolutely nothing, in fact under Obamafail Rocket Man was designing nukes and missiles right under Obamafal's nose and he did not do a ****ing thing.

Bone up on your history, you have a loss of memory
 
Born Free said:
Sorry it's like this:

I'd say you got it backwards, Obamafail let Putin take over Crimea, Putin told Obamafail to stop the missile defence system to NATO, and Obamafail stopped it. Putin told Obamafail to not help Ukraine with arms. Obamafail relied on Putin to insure him Syria got rid of their WMD's, Putin lied to Obamafail. Putin ran into Syria and told Obamafail to get out of his way. When Putin told Obamafail to jump Obamafail asked how high.

Remember the open mike, when I get reelected I can help Putin even more.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-election.html

Now to Rocket Man. Obamafail did what to stop NK's nuke program. I'll tell you absolutely nothing, in fact under Obamafail Rocket Man was designing nukes and missiles right under Obamafal's nose and he did not do a ****ing thing.

Bone up on your history, you have a loss of memory
Click to expand...

Wow, you've got ODS real bad. You can't even say his name without looking like a partisan hack. Sad.
 
Born Free said:
No just Obamafail which I was respond to:

Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
Okay... Mueller investigation is winding up and probably start seeing movement after the election and VOILA! Trump starts acting like he's tough on Russia. Coincidence?
Click to expand...

Was the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty as signed by President Reagan a good treaty, yes or no?
 
Fenton said:
Oh stop. Russia hasn't been a willing partner in this treaty for the last 3 years.
https://www.npr.org/2017/03/09/519499961/pentagon-confirms-russia-violated-nuclear-arms-treaty

Instead of withdrawing, they cheated and denied these violations while expecting the US to abide by the treary
Click to expand...
I'll stop when you stfu, how about that?


Ever since Bush reneged on the ABM treaty, I don't think Russia trusted the US to abide by any treaty or agreement after that...so they probably figured why should they?



"....On 13 December 2001, George W. Bush gave Russia notice of the United States' withdrawal from the treaty, in accordance with the clause that required six months' notice before terminating the pact—the first time in recent history that the United States has withdrawn from a major international arms treaty.[14] This led to the eventual creation of the American Missile Defense Agency.[15]

Supporters of the withdrawal argued that it was a necessity in order to test and build a limited National Missile Defense to protect the United States from nuclear blackmail by a rogue state. The withdrawal also had many critics. John Rhinelander, a negotiator of the ABM treaty, predicted that the withdrawal would be a "fatal blow" to the Non-Proliferation Treaty and would lead to a "world without effective legal constraints on nuclear proliferation." The construction of a missile defense system was also feared to enable the US to attack with a nuclear first strike.

Russia and the United States signed the Strategic Offensive Reductions Treaty in Moscow on 24 May 2002. This treaty mandates cuts in deployed strategic nuclear warheads, but without actually mandating cuts to total stockpiled warheads, and without any mechanism for enforcement.

"...On 1 March 2018, Russian president Vladimir Putin, in an address to the Federal Assembly, announced the development of a series of technologically new missile systems and stressed that those were designed as a response to U.S. withdrawal from the ABM Treaty.[16][17][18]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Ballistic_Missile_Treaty​
 
poweRob said:
Okay... Mueller investigation is winding up and probably start seeing movement after the election and VOILA! Trump starts acting like he's tough on Russia. Coincidence? :lol:

Expect an extraordinary amount of the republican deflection machine and trump's twitter account flailing about as they turn up the noise to eleven just after the election.

Trump says US is ending decades-old nuclear arms treaty with Russia

President Donald Trump announced Saturday that the US is pulling out of the landmark Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty with Russia, a decades-old agreement that has drawn the ire of the President.

"Russia has violated the agreement. They've been violating it for many years," Trump told reporters before boarding Air Force One to leave Nevada following a campaign rally.​
[/QUO

First the bitching is he has not done enough to punish Russia now he is doing too much. You do remember that 44 was asleep at the switch when Russia invaded Crimea. Zero consequences.
Click to expand...
 
poweRob said:
Okay... Mueller investigation is winding up and probably start seeing movement after the election and VOILA! Trump starts acting like he's tough on Russia. Coincidence? :lol:

Expect an extraordinary amount of the republican deflection machine and trump's twitter account flailing about as they turn up the noise to eleven just after the election.

Trump says US is ending decades-old nuclear arms treaty with Russia

President Donald Trump announced Saturday that the US is pulling out of the landmark Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty with Russia, a decades-old agreement that has drawn the ire of the President.

"Russia has violated the agreement. They've been violating it for many years," Trump told reporters before boarding Air Force One to leave Nevada following a campaign rally.​
Click to expand...

Wow, I actually agree with President Trump on this one, now what we do next will be interesting.
 
Phys251 said:
You support tRump and insist on the whole truth. :lamo

Do you really thing Reagan was stupid enough to sign a nuclear arms treaty with the Soviet Union without recognizing that they might renege on it? Jesus I miss the good old days where bending the knee to Russia was something that no President of either party even considered doing. Now tRump wants to turn America into Russia's little bitch. And a loud minority of Americans want to go right along with it.
Click to expand...

What kind of bait-and-switch selective flip-floppery is this? The OP claimed that pulling out of INF was Trump being tough on Russia - but only just in time to use it to fight off the Mueller investigation conclusions. Now you're claiming pulling out of INF is bending the knee to Russia? HOW?? :shock:
 
It's totally insane that US and Russia still have thousands of nukes.

First of course because of the catastrophic effect it can have on human civilization and the survival of the human race.

Secondly because it's totally unnecessary to have so many nukes. That a couple of hundred nukes would work just as fine for detterency.

Thirdly it a huge costs to maintain thousands of nukes.

Fourthly it also increase the risk of accident having so many nukes. There a “small” accident of “just” having a leakage of nuclear waste lead to a an over two billion dollar cost for the American taxpayers.

https://nordic.businessinsider.com/kitty-litter-nuclear-waste-accident-2016-8?r=US&IR=T

Fifthly Russia isn’t a stable democracy there you never now that happen after Putin. That the country can descend into internal turmoil there you have the risk that nukes will end up in the hands of warlords, terrorists and criminals. There having thousands of nukes increases that risk.

Sixthly it could be a bipartisan issue in US to reduce the number of nukes. Because urban liberal voter could be more idealistic and support a reduction because of that reason. While rural conservatives could have selfish reason to support a reduction of nukes. Because parts of rural America could be saved from nuclear holocaust if the worst happen and you had a nuclear war after that both Russia and USA had reduced the number of nukes to a couple of hundreds.

There I heard that one of the reason that you still have so many nukes after the cold war is that American congress didn’t want to pay enough money to help Russia with their disarmament of nukes. That is really stupid and short sighted if it's true. Because you afterwards ended up with Putin that just like other authoritarian leaders believe that having a lot of nukes will instill respect and fear.
 
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Trump will be a different President in 2019. Trump better focus more on domestic concerns instead of the ...break and fix doctrine of 2017-8.
 
Moot said:
Wow, you've got ODS real bad. You can't even say his name without looking like a partisan hack. Sad.
Click to expand...

He;s also cutting and pasting this post and using it in multiple threads.
 
Born Free said:
I'd say you got it backwards, Obamafail let Putin take over Crimea, Putin told Obamafail to stop the missile defence system to NATO, and Obamafail stopped it. Putin told Obamafail to not help Ukraine with arms. Obamafail relied on Putin to insure him Syria got rid of their WMD's, Putin lied to Obamafail. Putin ran into Syria and told Obamafail to get out of his way. When Putin told Obamafail to jump Obamafail asked how high.

Remember the open mike, when I get reelected I can help Putin even more.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...-election.html

Now to Rocket Ram. Obamafail did what to stop NK's nuke program. I'll tell you absolutely nothing, in fact under Obamafail Rocket Man was designing nukes and missiles right under Obamafal's nose and he did not do a ****ing thing.

Bone up on your history, you have a loss of memory
Click to expand...

The "open mike" event is a perfect example of how oblivious the American population is to diplomacy and how weakly positioned U.S. Presidents find themselves towards elections. Worse, our enemies and allies know this about our ignorant population and there have been examples where both have taken advantage of a President who can't make public decisions in the moment. This has largely been the case since the end of the Cold War and has exponentially gotten worse as GOP-led political extremism has come to define the American population. That being stated:

Your posts would be less distracting if you didn't reduce yourself to the Trumpian art of shallow denigration. Notice, that you respect Putin though. No sophomoric pet names for Putin? This is how one knows that he has allowed his irrational and confused hatred blind him.

There are for more to both items you brought up than "Obamafail." I will not digress here. And Trump's constant contradictions into his own National Security Strategy, especially when it comes to Russia and Western European allies, should not be something for you to celebrate. I will not digress here. In case you have completely missed this, even after Trump paraded himself around as the globe's savior while announcing that he saved us from the non-existent threat of nuclear war, "rocketman" still continues his missile program. So it's hard to chastize "Obamafail," when your goal is to obviously only glorify Trump who has managed to produce (and will continue to produce) the same result. I will not digress here.
 
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