• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

US judge suspends deportations of reunited immigrant families

phattonez said:
https://www.aol.com/article/news/20...ions-of-reunited-immigrant-families/23483178/



Unbelievable. This judge unilaterally decides that we cannot enforce immigration law while there's a crisis brewing at the southern border. Our judiciary is out of control, and it's about time that the president quits doing the will of these unelected tyrants and starts carrying out the will of the people.
Click to expand...



“Unbelievable.”

No. It is believable and “it” is true. You should find it quite believable since you find the judiciary “out of control” and “tyrannical”. What else kind of decision would you expect?

“This judge unilaterally decides”

Any single judge’s decision, by definition, is unilateral. Therefore, you must believe that we should change our entire judicial system to require that any court decision be by joint judicial review.


“that we cannot enforce immigration law”

That’s a bit of an overstatement. It’s only a ONE WEEK stay to give deportees legal representatives time to prepare their case. The government is deporting people so fast there is no time to prepare a proper defense in due process, which the Constitution affords.

“while there's a crisis brewing at the southern border.”

I guess by “brewing crisis” you mean it is not yet an actual and present crisis. Perhaps that there are more illegal immigrants coming from India and China is a crisis. Or, that might also be a brewing crisis from your perspective.

“Our judiciary is out of control,”

A one week stay means our entire judiciary is out of control? Really? That’s your evidence to support such an unfounded claim?

”and it's about time that the president quits doing the will of these unelected tyrants”

Trump is selecting many of these “unelected tyrants”.

“and starts carrying out the will of the people.”

I think what you really mean to say is “the will of the electorate” because “the people” voted against Trump.

BTW, Homeland Security raised no objection to the judge’s decision. However, they did object to an April 2018 SCOTUS ruling against a deportation law as being vague regarding definition of criminality. More unelected, tyrannical, out-of-control judiciary but at least not unilateral.
 
We had a similar situation in Orange County, CA with some large homeless encampments that became a serious eyesore and health hazard. One was right at the Orange County courthouse. After people demanded something be done, the police attempted to get involved, but a judge blocked their enforcement, and after some negotiation amongst themselves and the lawyers representing the homeless, they agreed that they could be moved along only if the government provided housing for at least a month at first, and offered these people the full spectrum of public services.

Only after that was offered (not necessarily accepted, mind you, a significant number of these people don't want help) they were permitted to clear out the encampments.

Plenty felt like the judge overstepped, but what he did was help to develop a process to achieve the goal without violating anyone's rights, and those encampments have been cleaned up and kept clear since.

One hopes the judge handling these children's situation is as even keeled.
 
The Mark said:
You do if the asylum claim line is so full they don't let you in, so in desperation you cross illegally.
Click to expand...

You don't get to break our laws because of desperation.
 
WillyPete said:
We had a similar situation in Orange County, CA with some large homeless encampments that became a serious eyesore and health hazard. One was right at the Orange County courthouse. After people demanded something be done, the police attempted to get involved, but a judge blocked their enforcement, and after some negotiation amongst themselves and the lawyers representing the homeless, they agreed that they could be moved along only if the government provided housing for at least a month at first, and offered these people the full spectrum of public services.

Only after that was offered (not necessarily accepted, mind you, a significant number of these people don't want help) they were permitted to clear out the encampments.

Plenty felt like the judge overstepped, but what he did was help to develop a process to achieve the goal without violating anyone's rights, and those encampments have been cleaned up and kept clear since.

One hopes the judge handling these children's situation is as even keeled.
Click to expand...

That judge absolutely overstepped. There are anti-loitering laws for a reason, and homeowners, the ones who pay taxes, deserve to have the laws enforced in their cities.
 
phattonez said:
That judge absolutely overstepped. There are anti-loitering laws for a reason, and homeowners, the ones who pay taxes, deserve to have the laws enforced in their cities.
Click to expand...

Ok, so if they had moved them along into your neighborhood, that would have been a better result than what happened?
 
WillyPete said:
Ok, so if they had moved them along into your neighborhood, that would have been a better result than what happened?
Click to expand...

No. What would have been a better result would be to clean out the drugs, arrest those involved with it (cleans up at least 50% of the problem right there), and to get the rest into private charities, public assistance, or simply away. We have plenty of programs to deal with this problem, but refusing to address the reality of the issue, which is that it's mostly drugs, causes it to linger.
 
phattonez said:
No. What would have been a better result would be to clean out the drugs, arrest those involved with it (cleans up at least 50% of the problem right there), and to get the rest into private charities, public assistance, or simply away. We have plenty of programs to deal with this problem, but refusing to address the reality of the issue, which is that it's mostly drugs, causes it to linger.
Click to expand...

So the ones that don't want assistance can hang out on your stoop in sunny Simplyawayville, CA.

They weren't able to provide enough beds at the beginning to cover the encampment, so that doesn't sound like "plenty of programs" to me. They had to negotiate that for a couple weeks. Nevermind that some of these programs (especially drug rehab sites) are profit driven, with some even trucking in addicts from out of state, to soak the state government for funding.

I don't mean to distract from the OP, but it's a similar issue where some cling to a simple "solution," because they aren't interested in understanding a complicated reality.
 
WillyPete said:
So the ones that don't want assistance can hang out on your stoop in sunny Simplyawayville, CA.
Click to expand...

Should we be helping those who refuse help?

They weren't able to provide enough beds at the beginning to cover the encampment, so that doesn't sound like "plenty of programs" to me. They had to negotiate that for a couple weeks. Nevermind that some of these programs (especially drug rehab sites) are profit driven, with some even trucking in addicts from out of state, to soak the state government for funding.

I don't mean to distract from the OP, but it's a similar issue where some cling to a simple "solution," because they aren't interested in understanding a complicated reality.
Click to expand...

It isn't complicated. Get serious about getting the drugs out of there and most of the problem goes away overnight.
 
phattonez said:
Should we be helping those who refuse help?

It isn't complicated. Get serious about getting the drugs out of there and most of the problem goes away overnight.
Click to expand...

And to **** with the rest anyhow, right?
 
phattonez said:
It's a serious question. Should we help those who refuse help? Why?
Click to expand...

Wow. It's like Jesus is talking to me directly.

Morally, because they are often the ones who need it most.

Legally, because most of them are U.S. citizens, and they are just as entitled as anyone else.
 
WillyPete said:
Wow. It's like Jesus is talking to me directly.
Click to expand...

I suspect you don't really know what Jesus thought about this. How do I know? This is what is taught in the New Testament: "He who does not work, neither shall he eat."

Morally, because they are often the ones who need it most.

Legally, because most of them are U.S. citizens, and they are just as entitled as anyone else.
Click to expand...

Nothing in our laws says that we must help those who refuse help. If we have people who refuse to work, refuse to even get help, then we're fully entitled to not help them.
 
phattonez said:
I suspect you don't really know what Jesus thought about this. How do I know? This is what is taught in the New Testament: "He who does not work, neither shall he eat."



Nothing in our laws says that we must help those who refuse help. If we have people who refuse to work, refuse to even get help, then we're fully entitled to not help them.
Click to expand...

LOL! No, we don't know what Jesus thought about that because that's allegedly Paul speaking in that epistle, not Christ.

Wow. Just wow.
 
Tanngrisnir said:
LOL! No, we don't know what Jesus thought about that because that's allegedly Paul speaking in that epistle, not Christ.

Wow. Just wow.
Click to expand...

Note: Christ did not write any books of the Bible.
 
Tanngrisnir said:
Note: no one claimed he did. Nice dodge.
Click to expand...

What dodge? Why are the reported words of Christ above the writings of Paul? Were not both written by men? How do you discard one and accept the other? Or, in this case, how do you dismiss the words of Paul in favor of what you think Christ would think (with no basis, I might add).
 
phattonez said:
What dodge? Why are the reported words of Christ above the writings of Paul? Were not both written by men? How do you discard one and accept the other? Or, in this case, how do you dismiss the words of Paul in favor of what you think Christ would think (with no basis, I might add).
Click to expand...

I'm not the one who's doing that. You're saying you know what Christ thought about something because Paul wrote something down.
 
Tanngrisnir said:
I'm not the one who's doing that. You're saying you know what Christ thought about something because Paul wrote something down.
Click to expand...

So your perspective is nihilism. Great. What's your point?
 
phattonez said:
https://www.aol.com/article/news/20...ions-of-reunited-immigrant-families/23483178/



Unbelievable. This judge unilaterally decides that we cannot enforce immigration law while there's a crisis brewing at the southern border. Our judiciary is out of control, and it's about time that the president quits doing the will of these unelected tyrants and starts carrying out the will of the people.
Click to expand...

Really opie?

Crisis at the southern border? Which crisis- the one being caused by this president to the beat of his hateful base's drum?

If anyone is out of control, it is Donald Trump in carrying out the will of the racists in this country which make up his base.

You and your profile picture is a bad joke and an abomination of anything religious!
 
Last edited:
Tanngrisnir said:
No, it's not.

My point was showing your dishonesty in how you tried to support your claim.

And you missed it.
Click to expand...

What did I say that was dishonest? Let's hear it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom