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Thread: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

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    Re: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by holbritter View Post
    I've told you why I believe they do. It's real life experiences, not studies by elites that I base my opinions on. I don't have to show anybody jack.
    And if you think prepping for those tests is not working at something and just a few hours on a Saturday, that's an insult to every student who worked their ass off to do well in order to get into the best college or university they could. You are the exact type of person who's opinion matters not.

    So go ahead and be for letting anyone who wants to, go to the prestigious University of Chicago. We'll see how long that lasts.
    You seem to be very, very confused.

    They’re not letting ‘anyone who wants to go’ in. They are selecting the cream of the crop (well, actually the cream of the typical UChicago ideal student, which is unlike most schools).

    And they have determined that SAT scores are not very helpful, and I can guarantee they are both smarter than you and know a tremendous amount more about their own admissions process than you.

    The college admissions packet for UofC is dozens of pages, and they clearly are looking at a ton more in each student than just a single number.

    They also recognize that the SAT is s huge barrier for good students that they would like to attract. Smart kids who don’t have mom and dad force them to take the exam ten times, kids who are first generation college students, rural kids and urban kids without the advantages of a top suburban school district and helicopter parents.
    Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

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    Re: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    You seem to be very, very confused.

    They’re not letting ‘anyone who wants to go’ in. They are selecting the cream of the crop (well, actually the cream of the typical UChicago ideal student, which is unlike most schools).

    And they have determined that SAT scores are not very helpful, and I can guarantee they are both smarter than you and know a tremendous amount more about their own admissions process than you.

    The college admissions packet for UofC is dozens of pages, and they clearly are looking at a ton more in each student than just a single number.

    They also recognize that the SAT is s huge barrier for good students that they would like to attract. Smart kids who don’t have mom and dad force them to take the exam ten times, kids who are first generation college students, rural kids and urban kids without the advantages of a top suburban school district and helicopter parents.
    If their decision is so smart why is it "sending a jolt through elite institutions of higher education as it becomes the first top-10 research university to join the test-optional movement."

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    Re: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

    For years I worked alongside a man who eventually became a department head at the college we worked at, but his PhD originated on a color laser printer. We went to high school together. He had attended college for a couple of semesters, but didn't graduate. Later he dated a woman who was a department head at the school. She hired him as an adjunct instructor. A few years later he became a full time associate professor. When she left for a different college he got her old job. So he became a department head. Eventually they divorced but he kept that job until he retired. I don't think she ever knew he didn't have a degree. The college never checked his background. It was a different department than mine so I wouldn't rat out an old school buddy. But it was a hoot watching the "academics" debate issues and policy with him, thinking all the while he was up there in the ivory tower with them. One of the gang. If they only knew.......

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    Re: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Waddy View Post
    For years I worked alongside a man who eventually became a department head at the college we worked at, but his PhD originated on a color laser printer. We went to high school together. He had attended college for a couple of semesters, but didn't graduate. Later he dated a woman who was a department head at the school. She hired him as an adjunct instructor. A few years later he became a full time associate professor. When she left for a different college he got her old job. So he became a department head. Eventually they divorced but he kept that job until he retired. I don't think she ever knew he didn't have a degree. The college never checked his background. It was a different department than mine so I wouldn't rat out an old school buddy. But it was a hoot watching the "academics" debate issues and policy with him, thinking all the while he was up there in the ivory tower with them. One of the gang. If they only knew.......
    You’re supposed to start those posts with

    Dear Penthouse:

    You’ll never believe this but...
    Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

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    Re: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Waddy View Post
    For years I worked alongside a man who eventually became a department head at the college we worked at, but his PhD originated on a color laser printer. We went to high school together. He had attended college for a couple of semesters, but didn't graduate. Later he dated a woman who was a department head at the school. She hired him as an adjunct instructor. A few years later he became a full time associate professor. When she left for a different college he got her old job. So he became a department head. Eventually they divorced but he kept that job until he retired. I don't think she ever knew he didn't have a degree. The college never checked his background. It was a different department than mine so I wouldn't rat out an old school buddy. But it was a hoot watching the "academics" debate issues and policy with him, thinking all the while he was up there in the ivory tower with them. One of the gang. If they only knew.......
    I'm not refuting your anecdote because I cannot; plus there're always exceptions to the rule. Besides, what would be the point of doing so if I could refute the anecdote?

    The man had whatever position and renown he had. How could whatever you say constitute "ratting him out?" The guy was either meeting/exceeding the expectations foisted upon him or he wasn't, and what degree(s) he lacked or had didn't have anything to do with that.

    I can say that his colleagues knew. Academics -- at least the "real" ones -- check-out, discuss, etc. one another's published works, and at some point, they're going to notice that the guy either isn't publishing and/or that he's publishing low-grade work (stuff they get published in a "random" journal rather than a highly acclaimed one). Upon seeing that, they'll know he's not, so to speak, "one of them."

    The exception being community colleges and, I suspect, for-profit institutions. At such places teaching (or something else) matters more than does research, grant proposal writing and publishing.
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    Those who jettison the epistemological standards of science are no longer in a position to use their intellectual product to make any claims about what is true of the world or to dispute the others’ claims about what is true. - Tooby & Cosmides

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    Re: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    What's the big deal? If the kids get in and they can't cut it they'll fall by the wayside.

    The OP played his hand though by going right to the "race" point.
    So, it's a money grab.

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    Re: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Chomsky View Post
    Well then, don't mind me. I'm still pissed UC dropped their excellent undergrad core curriculum, that was originally developed by Hutchinson himself.
    I'm all for a robust core curriculum, but, to be honest, the core requirements consist almost entirely of stuff one can master in high school. And, frankly, why wouldn't one do so? It affords one several fine options for college:
    • Finish in three years ---> This makes a lot of sense for anyone because the sooner one starts earning a decent salary, the sooner one can commence saving and investing, and given the time value of money, that one extra year makes a tidy difference later on. (Assuming $2400 invested over the course of that first year, 40 years from the end of this year, assuming 5% returns, one will be ~$16K ahead of where one'd have been were one to have commenced working and saving one year later, making that one year worth, in total, ~$16K more than whatever one collected in cash wages. That's not bad as goes getting value from graduating one year early, and that's without figuring the avoided costs of tuition, room, board, books, etc.)
    • Take the standard four years but do it at the markedly less aggressive pace of 12 credit hours per semester (rather than 15).
    • Take the standard four years, taking 15 hours per semester, but "beef up" by doing an non-symbiotic minor, taking a hodgepodge of classes that one simply finds interesting, double majoring
    • Take a more aggressive route and do a double degree (BS + BA), earn a BS + graduate degree in four rather than five years, or do a 3+3 (BA + JD) in six years or five, depending on the pace one sets for oneself.



    I say the core, particularly to the extent it covers the thinking found in "The Great Books," can be done in high school because inasmuch as we were required to take Latin or Greek plus English, theology and history, a lot of the classic writers works were supplemental reading for those classes. For instance if one to Latin, by sophomore year's final term, one was reading original Roman writers and writing essays (in English) on them much as one would for anything one read in English class. It was more of the same in junior and senior year, except that the essays were written in Latin. Since one took Latin, however, one was in an English section that read the same stuff the kids who took Greek did, but one read it in translation. History and theology covered other classic authors works, one's not "hit" in Latin, Greek or English classes, and, again, in translation.

    Science and math didn't place much of an emphasis on supplemental reading, but we still had it there. Over the course of a year and a half in calculus, we read parts of Principia and Euler's treatise on differential calculus. Each term too, our teachers would find some sort of mathematical or science esoterica for us to read and write a short paper about. I know we were actually expected to understand much of those works -- and rarely past the first few paragraphs did I -- but if one handed in the paper that showed some sort of good effort at trying to make sense of what one'd read, one got full marks for it.

    I think the point, insofar as so much of how we were taught was about confidence building, was just to get us comfortable reading that sort of stuff and to get us used to forging ahead as best we could when faced with uncertainty and seemingly insuperable hurdles. I'm not sure what I think of that sort of pedagogy, but it's what the teachers did and we came through it none the worse for wear, as they say.
    Donald Trump was the dumbest goddamn student I ever had. - William T. Kelley
    Those who jettison the epistemological standards of science are no longer in a position to use their intellectual product to make any claims about what is true of the world or to dispute the others’ claims about what is true. - Tooby & Cosmides

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    Re: University of Chicago eliminates SAT/ACT requirement

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So, it's a money grab.

    Sent from my SM-T587P using Tapatalk
    I have no idea their intent. Could be a talent grab to try and grab smart kids that don't test well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    The sad fact is that having a pedophile win is better than having a Democrat in office.
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    Perhaps words yourself more plainly.

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