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America may soon face its biggest labor strike in decades

jet57 said:
The Teamsters'll win too. UPS is huge and the company's not going to give everything to FedEX. UPS management has always - always - liked to play hardball. The last big one was in '93 I think. We all went out to 17th street in S.F. where may local is, and many other locals came as well to help those guys walk the boards day and night. The Teamsters beat'em then too. Now is not the time to messin around with labor.
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My biggest concern is how much of a wage increase will be passed on to the consumers.
By my personal observation, UPS workers are all about business, don't slack, run from truck to door. May be future cost savings are to be had once they perfect a drone system.
 
danielpalos said:
lol. Hello Mrs. Scrooge. We allegedly have a booming economy and full employment, for now. Why the need to pinch pennies, now?
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1. It's called "supply and demand".

2. Are you ready for prices on common goods to go up?
 
roguenuke said:
And reality is that these companies need to adjust to give the workers more in this sort of environment. When you have low unemployment, that makes it an employees' market, meaning if the companies want to keep the best workers, maximize their profits, they are going to have to take some "losses", make some adjustments, in order to ensure their business actually runs efficiently.
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The companies aren't making more money because their rates increased. They're making more money because business volume increased. Along with the increase in business, there's an increase in operating costs. The cost per mile/per pound to haul freight stayed the same.
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
Why should they not try to get as much as they possibly can? Next thing you will be pushing for increasing the min wage to something that is more fair
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If they're going on strike against something, it should be ELD's, wait times at shippers/receivers, the 30 minute rule and the 34 hour rule.

They're going to make more money because of the increase in freight volume. Plus, the transportation industry is already 50,000 drivers short.
 
apdst said:
The companies aren't making more money because their rates increased. They're making more money because business volume increased. Along with the increase in business, there's an increase in operating costs. The cost per mile/per pound to haul freight stayed the same.
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I never mentioned their rates increasing. Adjustments do not just have to be in rate hikes (although that is generally what many companies try to default to, wrongly). There is a calculation of how much the public, consumers will accept an increase in price for a specific product or service. If such a hike will not suffice to maximizing profits, sometimes some internal decrease in pay need to happen in order to continue to run efficiently while maintaining maximum profits (which does not necessarily mean the most profits they have ever made).
 
Renae said:
Yes, they are. What caused the auto industry in Detroit to go from the pinnacle of work success to needing bail outs? Bad choices and unions. Mostly Unions. What's the biggest driver of city and state budgetary shortfalls? Union demands.
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Yep. PERS is doing more to cause budget cuts in our schools than anything else. If you think that PERS is fair, consider my neighbor who's a cashier for the county and when she retires, her monthly pay goes UP.
 
Renae said:
Yes, they are. What caused the auto industry in Detroit to go from the pinnacle of work success to needing bail outs? Bad choices and unions. Mostly Unions. What's the biggest driver of city and state budgetary shortfalls? Union demands.
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LOL. The fact that the US car companies were making POS cars in the 70's and 80's and the Japanese came along with cars that were 10x better had nothing to do with the US companies decline? Right? The decision to make crappy cars was the Unions call, not the management?

Like I said. Brainwashed...
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
Bad management not unions

As for city and state budgets, the biggest issue there are the voters. If they do not throw out the bad management, it is their fault, not the fault of people seeking higher wages and benefits
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That's a complete lie. Teacher's unions striking was the cause of this and NOTHING else. They held our children's education hostage in order to get a retirement package that is FAR past anything reasonable.
 
faithful_servant said:
That's a complete lie. Teacher's unions striking was the cause of this and NOTHING else. They held our children's education hostage in order to get a retirement package that is FAR past anything reasonable.
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Then perhaps voters should have told the politicians to hold out longer or they would be voted out next election
 
Renae said:
Yes, they are. What caused the auto industry in Detroit to go from the pinnacle of work success to needing bail outs? Bad choices and unions. Mostly Unions. What's the biggest driver of city and state budgetary shortfalls? Union demands.
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Pension liability is a big part of the problem there.

Unions are not inherently evil. There is nothing more free market than a bunch of people getting together to negotiate their employment contract. Some unions have done stupid things and some management have accepted insane terms but that is not a indictment of unions as a whole.
 
Gaius46 said:
Pension liability is a big part of the problem there.

Unions are not inherently evil. There is nothing more free market than a bunch of people getting together to negotiate their employment contract. Some unions have done stupid things and some management have accepted insane terms but that is not a indictment of unions as a whole.
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Unions, when there is a bad business or practice, make sense, but as a rule they tend to be parasites that kill the host (employer) rather than working with them for a long term success.
 
SenorXm/Sirius said:
LOL. The fact that the US car companies were making POS cars in the 70's and 80's and the Japanese came along with cars that were 10x better had nothing to do with the US companies decline? Right? The decision to make crappy cars was the Unions call, not the management?

Like I said. Brainwashed...
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The auto collapse I'm speaking of was this century.
 
SenorXm/Sirius said:
LOL. The fact that the US car companies were making POS cars in the 70's and 80's and the Japanese came along with cars that were 10x better had nothing to do with the US companies decline? Right? The decision to make crappy cars was the Unions call, not the management?

Like I said. Brainwashed...
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Sadly, they are still paying for the sentiment while they made great strides. It seems to be very convenient to bring up the 70's and 80's as an excuse.
 
roguenuke said:
I never mentioned their rates increasing. Adjustments do not just have to be in rate hikes (although that is generally what many companies try to default to, wrongly). There is a calculation of how much the public, consumers will accept an increase in price for a specific product or service. If such a hike will not suffice to maximizing profits, sometimes some internal decrease in pay need to happen in order to continue to run efficiently while maintaining maximum profits (which does not necessarily mean the most profits they have ever made).
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Cutting into the profit margin is the wrong approach. It would make more sense to lay off some people and give everyone else a raise.
 
apdst said:
Cutting into the profit margin is the wrong approach. It would make more sense to lay off some people and give everyone else a raise.
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Laying off people could easily cut into the profit margin itself, by making things less efficient, which could lead to a profit loss. All such decisions affect potential profits.
 
bearpoker said:
What, you expect Renae to actually debate? She doesn't. She just states her opinion loudly. Facts are immaterial.
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Quite used to those that post an OP without analyzing the underlying facts.
 
roguenuke said:
Laying off people could easily cut into the profit margin itself, by making things less efficient, which could lead to a profit loss. All such decisions affect potential profits.
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For the short term, maybe.

Bottomline: a booming economy doesn't signal automatic pay raises. It doesn't work that way.
 
apdst said:
For the short term, maybe.

Bottomline: a booming economy doesn't signal automatic pay raises. It doesn't work that way.
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It generally does though, for most businesses. Not all businesses will last or are going to survive a "booming economy". But in general, if a business is doing good, within a booming economy, there is little way they are going to get by without giving some pay raises. It is simply economics. Because other places are going to be looking for workers eventually and in order to draw them away from their current jobs, they are going to have to offer "more" of something.
 
Renae said:
Yeah... don't blame the unions for demanding wages and benefits beyond the capacity for reasonable economics. Blame everyone else...
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And yet companies make poor choices that ruin their business all day, every day. In many cases it ruins our entire market, just look at the last economic crashes, all related to business making bad choices. You ignore 99% of those too.

But when a union AND its management make terrible choices (and this is well documented) you blame it all on the workers? Good lord, you really are 100% for big corporations, and want to crap on the little guys/employees. It's nakedly spelled out here.

Just because one union (and it's management) ruin it for themselves, you think what...all unions are to be opposed? Lol. So all corporations should also be opposed? because they do this every day all day.

Employees have every right to compete in a capitalist marketplace by marshaling their one and only power, their numbers. Corporations hold nearly every single remaining card.
To suggest that employees should just STFU is so Republican.

I just watched a documentary last night about how big corporate movie studios went down to New Zealand and got the New Zealand government to prevent them from certain unionization activities, so that movie studies could keep paying that much lower wages than their (U.S. and other developed nation) counterparts. Right wing...willing to use the government as long as it's to take advantage of employees.
 
Mach said:
And yet companies make poor choices that ruin their business all day, every day. In many cases it ruins our entire market, just look at the last economic crashes, all related to business making bad choices. You ignore 99% of those too.

But when a union AND its management make terrible choices (and this is well documented) you blame it all on the workers? Good lord, you really are 100% for big corporations, and want to crap on the little guys/employees. It's nakedly spelled out here.

Just because one union (and it's management) ruin it for themselves, you think what...all unions are to be opposed? Lol. So all corporations should also be opposed? because they do this every day all day.

Employees have every right to compete in a capitalist marketplace by marshaling their one and only power, their numbers. Corporations hold nearly every single remaining card.
To suggest that employees should just STFU is so Republican.

I just watched a documentary last night about how big corporate movie studios went down to New Zealand and got the New Zealand government to prevent them from certain unionization activities, so that movie studies could keep paying that much lower wages than their (U.S. and other developed nation) counterparts. Right wing...willing to use the government as long as it's to take advantage of employees.
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I'm for sustainable economics and find Unions are antithetical to that goal.
 
Renae said:
I'm for sustainable economics and find Unions are antithetical to that goal.
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sounds communist to me

Not wanting people to maximize their own person returns for sustained economics
 
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