• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Trump pushed postmaster general to double rates on Amazon, other firms

Packages from Amazon and other online retailers are a profit business for the company. It is the other crap that is causing problems. This could be a death blow to the US Postal Service.

The irony could be, that the USPS goes bankrupt, and Amazon buys up its packages business at 10 cents on the dollar..

You say that like it would be a bad thing, if I knew that would be the end result I would likely have to cheer on Trump on this, however I doubt we would be that lucky and the end result would likely be me having to pay more for my Amazon Prime. Hopefully with summer coming up he will start playing more golf.
 
Full title: Trump personally pushed postmaster general to double rates on Amazon, other firms

Nothing to see here. Just the President of the United States trying to use the powers of his office to punish Jeff Bezos because the Washington Post publishes negative articles about him.

Yep, everything is a-okay.





https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.8022f8998bfa

It will be said that Obama did this too. He did not. It will be said that Obama publicly attacked Fox News, but voicing criticism is not the same as using the office of the White House to create policy that monetarily punishes a media outlet just for publishing negatives articles about him, which is what's happening here.

It will be said you most likely didn't understand this part from your link;

*and other firms to ship packages,*

Trump wants to up the rates on all firms that ship packagea.
 
Only if you're prepared to pay for the next "too-big-to-fail" incident. The USPS has a minus of approx. $15 to $20 billion right now; it's been operating in negative numbers for the last 11 or 12 years. You know that the government (means us, the tax payers) bail-out is only a matter of time.

I've been for privatising the USPS for a long time; however, their Union is extremely "powerful". If Trump could bust their monopoly (by Senate "decree", no one is allowed to deliver mail to a mail box except for the USPS), I'm all for it.

Read an interesting article by the economist because of Trump's recent executive order:


"Competition from the likes of UPS, FedEx and DHL means that USPS is unlikely ever to make enough money to plug its massive pension and health-care deficits, which together exceed $100bn.

On April 12th President Donald Trump set up a task force to examine USPS’s finances. His motives are fishy. He dislikes Amazon, whose founder, Jeff Bezos, also owns the Washington Post, a newspaper that is critical of Mr Trump. The president says Amazon is charged too little by the post office for delivery of its goods (a claim that is impossible to assess fully because the contract is private). The task force is made up of administration officials, not independent experts. But if it takes its job seriously, it should recommend privatising USPS and relaxing its monopoly power.

One reason such a reform would benefit the public is that Congress is incapable of managing the changes the post office badly needs. In recent years politicians have blocked plans to close obsolete facilities and to end costly Saturday deliveries. Democrats side with unions who say reform is unnecessary. Republicans worry about triggering a public bail-out of pension and health-care liabilities. Politicians have struggled with the most basic tasks, such as filling seats on USPS’s board.

European countries have shown that market forces improve postal markets (see article). Every member of the EU allows at least some competition for postal delivery. Competition has spurred innovation and efficiency. Since Germany privatised Deutsche Post in 1995, the firm has expanded massively.

... Britain privatised Royal Mail in 2013, allowing it to raise capital and evolve free from political meddling. Compare that with America, where private couriers are not even allowed access to the public’s letterboxes.

... The government should assume USPS’s legacy pension and health-care deficits, to make it more attractive to investors, and also placate workers by giving them shares in the new company.
Republicans would need to accept that the government should not pull the rug out from underneath retirees, and realise that if taxpayers do not foot the bill for their benefits, consumers will have to instead.
Democrats would need to concede that the purpose of policy is to benefit the public, not to justify the existence of government jobs and state-owned organisations. Privatisation might not be what Mr Trump intends. But a large dose of the free market is what the post office needs most."

https://www.economist.com/leaders/2018/04/19/why-americas-post-office-should-be-privatised

All completely irrelevant in light of trump's personal vendetta against Jeff Bezos and the Washington Post.
 
If your stocks pay dividends, they are listed on your tax returns.

How do you know what Trump lists on his tax returns, by the way. Have you seen them? Nobody else has.

We don’t know what he is invested in, but there is no tax form that lists out someone’s stock holdings. If you are aware of such a form, then offer it up.

As for dividends, Trump could be invested in Amazon and you would never know it from a tax return.

Come back when you can name an IRS form that lists someone’s stock holdings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Other Presidents have tried to go around Congress to get done what they want to get done. But I'm not sure in the last 20 years I remember one of them singling out a specific corporation to do that to. Do you? I also don't remember any of those Presidents waging a very public war against said company.

You'd think Trump would be smart enough to know too that if they raised Amazon's shipping rate, Amazon would pass it on to the consumers. But for some reason, he isn't.

Trump hasn't singled out a company. Amazing how many miss or ignore what they should be reading. From the link;

*and other firms to ship packages,*
 
Other Presidents have tried to go around Congress to get done what they want to get done. But I'm not sure in the last 20 years I remember one of them singling out a specific corporation to do that to. Do you? I also don't remember any of those Presidents waging a very public war against said company.

You'd think Trump would be smart enough to know too that if they raised Amazon's shipping rate, Amazon would pass it on to the consumers. But for some reason, he isn't.

I gave up a while back trying to figure out why Trump does or says anything that he does or says. If Trump did in fact order the increase in rates to apply to only Amazon, then that would be a flagrant violation of the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amendment, and maybe could even be argued as a violation of the 8th Amendment. In other words, it could be an impeachable offense if he both ordered it, and it actually occurred.
 

Thank ya ma'am. I found this part of the article in The Hill, to be rather contrarian to what Trump is claiming:

The president's demands came despite counsel from close advisers and top Postal Service employees that Amazon, the largest shipper of packages through USPS, actually helps keep it afloat financially.
 

Yup, it's all right there, from the first link;

*President Trump has reportedly urged the U.S. postmaster general to double shipping rates for Amazon.com and other companies amid months of his continued criticism that the online retailer is costing the Postal Service "billions" of dollars in revenue.*

"urged" is not ordered and "and other companies" in not singling anyone out. Amazing how some deliberately ignore salient gacts.
 
We don’t know what he is invested in, but there is no tax form that lists out someone’s stock holdings. If you are aware of such a form, then offer it up.

As for dividends, Trump could be invested in Amazon and you would never know it from a tax return.

Come back when you can name an IRS form that lists someone’s stock holdings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Holy fuzz buckets - I just read your sig and laughed my ass off.
 
This is another of those cases where there's something I very much dislike going on, but those making a big deal about this take it two steps too far with their criticisms so instead I'm stuck having to deal with those before appearing to agree with such nonsense.

No, I'm not in favor of a President mucking around with the private sector. The issue here is that he's mucking around with the private sector by changing up things within the federal government. If he's taking a broad action, if that action is within his purview (i'll be honest, I don't know about the Postal Service to know what area of government has more control over it), and it's for a legitimate reason (i.e. there's been internal government reviews and findings that discover that the business model that the USPS operates under breaks when it's used in the manner it's used by the various large scale shipment based retailers); that is reasonable. If his reasoning for it is that he just FEELS like it hurts brick and morter stores...So what? That's not a legitimate and reasonable reason to change things up with the USPS, it's not the place nor the purpose of the President to try and protect one type of business over another, especially based off gut feelings.

However, I can't get on board with the information we have that this is some kind of highly unethical attempt to punish a media outlet. The articles and posters are desperately trying to act like this is just about Amazon, but from the very first paragraph quoted: "double the rate the Postal Service charges Amazon.com and other firms". If those other firms are not tied to the Washington Post and Amazon, but are rather simply other major mail order retailers, then the declaration of this being aimed specifically at punishing or in retaliation to the Washington Post is specious and assumptive at best while being presented as unquestionable fact.

Trump doing this specifically due to a vendetta against the Washington Post, and targetting Amazong singularly, would be an astounding piece of wrong doing that would have me furious and potentially calling for impeachment for unethical misuse of the office. However, it's being treated by some of these articles and some people as if that is absolutely, indisputably, what is happening here....and that's frankly not the case. And until there's actual evidence, not just rampant speculation by a frothing horde looking to pounce upon everything in the worst case possible without any attempt at thought or objectivity, I'm not going to join some zealotry fueled mob for Trumps head on this issue. What's more, those foolish enough to be hammering on about this bull**** simply actually give Trump cover for the actual problematic things he's done in this regard, because this stupid ****ery has to be dealt with first OR ends up getting the greater attention despite it being the political equivalent of gossip.
 
We have no clue what Trump is invested in, he has refused to release his Tax returns.

The people who need to know have seen his tax returns. Someone else’s taxes are none of your business
 
Full title: Trump personally pushed postmaster general to double rates on Amazon, other firms

Nothing to see here. Just the President of the United States trying to use the powers of his office to punish Jeff Bezos because the Washington Post publishes negative articles about him.

Yep, everything is a-okay.





https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.8022f8998bfa

It will be said that Obama did this too. He did not. It will be said that Obama publicly attacked Fox News, but voicing criticism is not the same as using the office of the White House to create policy that monetarily punishes a media outlet just for publishing negatives articles about him, which is what's happening here.

Very Nixonian of him.........
 
Using his power to "mess" with companies he has a beef with, like WaPo, Amazon and then conveniently adding "other firms" to mask his intent reeks of abuse of power to punish those with opposing views or exercising the right of a people to have a free press. Like Nixon it appears he is compiling an enemies list.
 
I'm sorry, but if this story turns out to be true, it's another massive, and I mean, MASSIVE concern people should have about Trump.

The President should not ever engage in this sort of behavior. It's sick and immoral.

No, Obama never did this that I'm aware of. Not even close. What would be the reaction if it came out that Obama ordered his Postmaster General to raise the shipping rates on Hobby Lobby?

Don't be sorry - you are absolutely right.
 
We don’t know what he is invested in, but there is no tax form that lists out someone’s stock holdings. If you are aware of such a form, then offer it up.

As for dividends, Trump could be invested in Amazon and you would never know it from a tax return.

Come back when you can name an IRS form that lists someone’s stock holdings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Schedule B, and form 1040. If you have more than $1500 in dividend income, you need to complete Schedule B, which lists every company that paid you a dividend on your stock holding. I gather you don't own any stocks after all. If you did, you would know this. You would have received a 1099 from the company that you hold stock in, and have to report the income.

You can see a copy of Schedule B here in the event you ever actually do have investments. Anyone who has them is already fully aware of this form, the need to list the names of the stocks you own, and individually list the income you received from each stock.

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040sb.pdf
 
I gave up a while back trying to figure out why Trump does or says anything that he does or says. If Trump did in fact order the increase in rates to apply to only Amazon, then that would be a flagrant violation of the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amendment, and maybe could even be argued as a violation of the 8th Amendment. In other words, it could be an impeachable offense if he both ordered it, and it actually occurred.

I agree Beau. This is on the hairy edge of an impeachable offense. This is what got Nixon in trouble.

Good thing the Postmaster General cares enough about the Constitution to resist him.
 
This is another of those cases where there's something I very much dislike going on, but those making a big deal about this take it two steps too far with their criticisms so instead I'm stuck having to deal with those before appearing to agree with such nonsense.

No, I'm not in favor of a President mucking around with the private sector. The issue here is that he's mucking around with the private sector by changing up things within the federal government. If he's taking a broad action, if that action is within his purview (i'll be honest, I don't know about the Postal Service to know what area of government has more control over it), and it's for a legitimate reason (i.e. there's been internal government reviews and findings that discover that the business model that the USPS operates under breaks when it's used in the manner it's used by the various large scale shipment based retailers); that is reasonable. If his reasoning for it is that he just FEELS like it hurts brick and morter stores...So what? That's not a legitimate and reasonable reason to change things up with the USPS, it's not the place nor the purpose of the President to try and protect one type of business over another, especially based off gut feelings.

However, I can't get on board with the information we have that this is some kind of highly unethical attempt to punish a media outlet. The articles and posters are desperately trying to act like this is just about Amazon, but from the very first paragraph quoted: "double the rate the Postal Service charges Amazon.com and other firms". If those other firms are not tied to the Washington Post and Amazon, but are rather simply other major mail order retailers, then the declaration of this being aimed specifically at punishing or in retaliation to the Washington Post is specious and assumptive at best while being presented as unquestionable fact.

Trump doing this specifically due to a vendetta against the Washington Post, and targetting Amazong singularly, would be an astounding piece of wrong doing that would have me furious and potentially calling for impeachment for unethical misuse of the office. However, it's being treated by some of these articles and some people as if that is absolutely, indisputably, what is happening here....and that's frankly not the case. And until there's actual evidence, not just rampant speculation by a frothing horde looking to pounce upon everything in the worst case possible without any attempt at thought or objectivity, I'm not going to join some zealotry fueled mob for Trumps head on this issue. What's more, those foolish enough to be hammering on about this bull**** simply actually give Trump cover for the actual problematic things he's done in this regard, because this stupid ****ery has to be dealt with first OR ends up getting the greater attention despite it being the political equivalent of gossip.


It's a fair question to identify the other firms to determine if Trump has a vendetta against them as well. My money says yes. It perfectly fits his petty vindictive nature and his blatant lack of ethics..
 
Thank ya ma'am. I found this part of the article in The Hill, to be rather contrarian to what Trump is claiming:

Yes, Amazon added $7 billion to the post revenues in 2017. And they are damn glad to have the agreement with Amazon that they have, for that very reason.

Fortune did a good article on this a few weeks ago that you may enjoy. I hope you can read it! From the article:

The Post Office brought in $19.5 billion from shipping packages like Amazon’s last year, one of the few bright spots in a balance sheet marked by a $1.9 billion decline in revenue from first-class mail. Mail delivery that shrank by 5 billion pieces (4%), but package shipments rose by 589 million (11.4%). Package revenues were also up by about $2.1 billion year over year.

Donald Trump Says Amazon Is Costing the Post Office. It'''s Not | Fortune
 
I gave up a while back trying to figure out why Trump does or says anything that he does or says. If Trump did in fact order the increase in rates to apply to only Amazon, then that would be a flagrant violation of the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amendment, and maybe could even be argued as a violation of the 8th Amendment. In other words, it could be an impeachable offense if he both ordered it, and it actually occurred.

Agree with this


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
It's a fair question to identify the other firms to determine if Trump has a vendetta against them as well. My money says yes. It perfectly fits his petty vindictive nature and his blatant lack of ethics..

Absolutely a fair question. Hard to know the answer since Trump only Tweets about Amazon. Interestingly enough, he's never criticized anyone else.
 
Yup, it's all right there, from the first link;

*President Trump has reportedly urged the U.S. postmaster general to double shipping rates for Amazon.com and other companies amid months of his continued criticism that the online retailer is costing the Postal Service "billions" of dollars in revenue.*

"urged" is not ordered and "and other companies" in not singling anyone out. Amazing how some deliberately ignore salient gacts.

No idea why you posted this to me., quoting my post to Beau who said he couldn't read the Wapo article.

No idea what a gact is either. But I'm sure I don't want to.

If you know who the other firms are that Trump is talking about, please share with the class. Nobody else knows, and he has never mentioned anyone except Amazon.
 
Absolutely a fair question. Hard to know the answer since Trump only Tweets about Amazon. Interestingly enough, he's never criticized anyone else.

Yeah pretty amazing. Plus Trump is so jelly. Bezos is the wealthiest man in the world and he EARNED his.
 
Yeah pretty amazing. Plus Trump is so jelly. Bezos is the wealthiest man in the world and he EARNED his.

Jeff Bezos was born to a teenage mother. He started out life poor. He got into Princeton, where he had a perfect GPA, after being valedictorian of his high school. With his brains, ingenuity, ability to get people to like him, and hard ass work, he's now one of the richest men in the world. And like you said, he earned it. Trump can't relate to that. He inherited his wealth.

You'd think that people would respect Bezos for what he did, which is the biggest American dream one could achieve, but they don't - because Trump is jealous of him, they hate him too.

#Sad
 
It's a fair question to identify the other firms to determine if Trump has a vendetta against them as well. My money says yes. It perfectly fits his petty vindictive nature and his blatant lack of ethics..

Or maybe not. From Bloomberg:

"Amazon relies on the Postal Service for the so-called last mile (delivery from warehouses to customers’ homes) on as many as 40 percent of all U.S. orders, according to analysts’ estimates. While the relationship is mutually beneficial, it saves Amazon as much as $2.6 billion a year versus rates charged by independent couriers such as United Parcel Service Inc. and FedEx Corp., analysts say."
 
Back
Top Bottom