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Judiciary chair wants vote on special counsel bill next week

Cardinal said:
It's the acting AG's place to send the report on. Yes, a Congress could subpoena the report, but that would require a Democratic-controlled Congress. But then, a Democratic-controlled Congress was always an entirely different topic anyway.

Short of a Congressional subpoena, if Congress got the report outside of the acting AG's decision to send the report on, then they would have acquired the report outside of the proper process. In other words, they would have gotten it from the SC and Mueller would then be under some serious legal liability.
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And as past history has shown, can be read into the Congressional Record, same as the Pentagon Papers were.
Could all or a portion be leaked. My money is on yes.
 
Hatuey said:
Trump has made more bipartisanship happen in 1 week than Obama did in 8 years.

We should all be happy about this.

:lol:
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Maybe your comment was facetious but the interesting thing is, it's all true. That's how much everyone is starting to want to distance themselves from Trump. Misery loves company. Politics makes strange bedfellows. And Trump is a colossal asshole and a danger to this country, and you and I both know behind the scenes, the Republicans are playing nicey nice with the Dems, knowing at this point there's a better chance than not that the Dems will regain the House, and knowing that even love of party doesn't trump having a madman in the White House, playing with nukes.
 
I have one question about Trump & his apparent paranoia about the Mueller probe: what is he guilty of that he's so afraid of it coming out? If he was not guilty of one or more 'high crimes & misdemeanors' he should be welcoming such a professional investigation. He's acting guilty.
 
Fearandloathing said:
I don't want to dismiss it as impossible, but it would be the political equivalent of launching nukes. There's no turning back. He can stay ahead of the process likely for years (if he can get re-elected) however it would be the end of the United States of America as we know it. People don't react much to the term "constitutional crisis" but pause there and think about a land 100% divided, and well armed.

Nixon was talked out of a melt down...and from reports it took some doing. But I look at some of the people around Nixon at the time and at Trump's people and stop there.....
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By the way, I just want to make it clear that I agree with everybody regarding the consequences of such a an extreme (and way more plausible than it has any right to be) hypothetical scenario.

I'm just illustrating that based on everything I've researched and learned over the course of the past year, the barriers between Trump and the complete breakdown of the rule of law and democratic principles are much fewer and thinner than a lot of people appreciate.

Nearly all of the safeguards I assumed were laws actually turned out to be gentlemen's agreements...or "norms"...this entire time. I learned that what's been holding the concept of democracy together hasn't been law, but the idea that the people running the show actually want Democracy. It taught me why we have such a hilariously difficult time bringing democracy to countries that don't want it. If you don't want democracy, you can't be made to abide by it or protect it.
 
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WCH said:
No he can't stop the investigation by firing anyone.. What he can do is pardon everyone involve [even himself if necessary] That will kill the investigation.
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He can't pardon anyone Mueller refers to the NY AG's office for prosecution.

I'd like to see Trump pardon himself after a criminal conviction.
 
Lerxst said:
He can't pardon anyone Mueller refers to the NY AG's office for prosecution.

I'd like to see Trump pardon himself after a criminal conviction.
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Arrrrggghh. It's not the AG's office. It's the Federal Southern District of New York.
 
Cardinal said:
Arrrrggghh. It's not the AG's office. It's the Federal Southern District of New York.
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I'm not talking about Federal prosecution. I"m talking about the people that the NY AG is going after in partnership with Mueller. Mueller and Schniederman are hand in hand on this deal, ad hoc if not officially.

Schneiderman is more than willing to go after anyone violating state law within the scope of this investigation. All Mueller has to do is present him with the information and a state case can be pursued.
 
Lerxst said:
I'm not talking about Federal prosecution. I"m talking about the people that the NY AG is going after in partnership with Mueller. Mueller and Schniederman are hand in hand on this deal, ad hoc if not officially.

Schneiderman is more than willing to go after anyone violating state law within the scope of this investigation. All Mueller has to do is present him with the information and a state case can be pursued.
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Oh, right, okay. I'm just not actually familiar with the details of that investigation yet.
 
Cardinal said:
By the way, I just want to make it clear that I agree with everybody regarding the consequences of such a an extreme (and way more plausible than it has any right to be) hypothetical scenario.

I'm just illustrating that based on everything I've researched and learned over the course of the past year, the barriers between Trump and the complete breakdown of the rule of law and democratic principles are much fewer and thinner than a lot of people appreciate.

Nearly all of the safeguards I assumed were laws actually turned out to be gentlemen's agreements...or "norms"...this entire time. I learned that what's been holding the concept of democracy together hasn't been law, but the idea that the people running the show actually want Democracy. It taught me why we have such a hilariously difficult time bringing democracy to countries that don't want it. If you don't want democracy, you can't be made to abide by it or protect it.
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I wrote a paper on that in poly sci - a retrospect of the Vietnam war. I have said for ages that Americans naturally believe everybody else in the world wants what you have. Most look at the US system and run, and that I believe has a lot to do with how easily rebel groups can rise and take hold. It also touched on a work I had read where the author, a military man, said Castro would never have gotten anywhere if the US simply left. They were propping up the Batista regime which, once gone would have leg to a military democracy and eventual elections.

It has been said that Asia loves communism, not true. Asians love totalitarian government. I have known students who can't wait to get out Canada so they can feel "safe" in the shadow of the Forbidden city. Whether Americans like it or not, Japan is a monarchy because the people want it.

Last evening the CBC aired a program called "Ideas" and this week was looking at a new form of democracy and letting go of what they were calling the "liberal democracy" in other words a democracy without a social safety net and a limited party system like the one party system the US started with and now popular in places like Russia. And this movement is resonating with the same people who voted Trump, who voter Brixit and like that.

It would be the ultimate irony to be the lone liberal democracy left on the continent, or perhaps world. I am kind of glad of my age, I think there is going to be a lot stuff I don't want to see
 
Lerxst said:
He can't pardon anyone Mueller refers to the NY AG's office for prosecution.

I'd like to see Trump pardon himself after a criminal conviction.
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Want a really "fun" scenario?

  1. Mr. Trump is indicted, tried, and convicted of "Murder 1".
  2. The House beings in a "Bill of Impeachment" considers it, and passes it on a vote of 435 to 0.
  3. The "Bill of Impeachment" goes to the Senate and the Senate, on a snap vote votes
    • 33 to convict, and
    • 18 to acquit;
  4. The vote fails to convict because 33 is only 64.71% and it would require 66.66+% to convict.
  5. The courts of the District of Columbia grant New York's extradition request.
  6. The capitol of the United States of America moves temporarily to Ossining NY.
 
TU Curmudgeon said:
Want a really "fun" scenario?

  1. Mr. Trump is indicted, tried, and convicted of "Murder 1".
  2. The House beings in a "Bill of Impeachment" considers it, and passes it on a vote of 435 to 0.
  3. The "Bill of Impeachment" goes to the Senate and the Senate, on a snap vote votes
    • 33 to convict, and
    • 18 to acquit;
  4. The vote fails to convict because 33 is only 64.71% and it would require 66.66+% to convict.
  5. The courts of the District of Columbia grant New York's extradition request.
  6. The capitol of the United States of America moves temporarily to Ossining NY.
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Ummm you blowin my mind, TU.
 
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