• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

California governor pardons 5 men facing deportation

Kreton said:
The guy who gave the pardons was a democrat and is being vilified.

When Trump pardons you right wing partisans were applauding it. Even when the idea of Trump pardoning is floated you people applaud.

But a democrat does the same thing an you people lose your minds.
Click to expand...

Again, it's WHY he pardoned them. He is responsible for keeping Californians safe and he disregarded that sacred duty so that he could piss off Donald Trump. Brown is not worthy of the office.
 
JacksinPA said:
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/po...rnor-pardons-5-men-facing-deportation-n861706

SAN FRANCISCO — California Gov. Jerry Brown on Friday pardoned five ex-convicts facing deportation, including two whose families fled the Khmer Rouge regime in Cambodia four decades ago.

The pardons don't automatically stop deportation proceedings, but eliminate the state convictions federal authorities based their deportation decisions on. That gives the men's lawyers strong legal arguments before immigration judges to try to prevent the deportations.
=====================================================
The Donald is not happy about this.
Click to expand...

lol...take that Trumpet.
 
:lamo

Dear sweet baby hay Zeus. And the leftists in this country cant IMAGINE why their communities mare so ****ed up.

-Chhan was convicted of two counts of misdemeanor domestic violence in 2002.
-Pheach was convicted of possessing drugs and obstructing a police officer in 2005 and served six months in jail.
-Daniel Maher, who was convicted in 1995 of kidnapping, robbery and being a felon in possession of a firearm and served five years in prison.
-Daniel Mena and Francisco Acevedo Alaniz, but their home countries were not immediately known. Mena was convicted in 2003 of possessing illegal drugs.

The term cutting off your nose to spite your face comes to play. You are so invested in your hatred of Trump that you celebrate keeping and releasing these types of folk back into your communities.

Good job!
 
Kreton said:
Again with your dishonesty.

Again you lie.

Again you avoid the question.

This is why so many people on here believe you just troll.
Click to expand...

The ones that do are afraid to engage me, because they know I will embarress the **** out of them.
 
apdst said:
The ones that do are afraid to engage me, because they know I will embarress the **** out of them.
Click to expand...

You have never embarrassed anyone except yourself. Go back and answer the question in relation to the thread and stop avoiding and derailing.

Again with your dishonesty.

Again you lie.

Again you avoid the question.
 
Kreton said:
You have never embarrassed anyone except yourself. Go back and answer the question in relation to the thread and stop avoiding and derailing.

Again with your dishonesty.

Again you lie.

Again you avoid the question.
Click to expand...

Yes I have. Apparently, you're included in that number since you're so hell bent on posting vitriol.

You should know by now, I don't play the "gotcha" game.
 
Kreton said:
The guy who gave the pardons was a democrat and is being vilified.

When Trump pardons you right wing partisans were applauding it. Even when the idea of Trump pardoning is floated you people applaud.

But a democrat does the same thing an you people lose your minds.
Click to expand...

The guy Trump pardoned was a veteran. These guys that Brown pardoned are wife beaters, armed robbers, and a car thief. I can see why he pardoned them. His goal is to do as much to piss the right off as possible, regardless of the damage they might do to anyone else.
 
trixare4kids said:
That's exactly what he did! He told the federal government, specifically the Trump administration, that "we're, CA.'s in charge of immigration matters" and there's nuttin' you can do about it.
Click to expand...

Actually no he didn't deportation are federal charges not state. He gave them pardons for no reason.
If anything they just plead guilty to the crimes they committed which means teycwill still get deported.

State governments have no legal authority over immigration.
 
Kreton said:
The guy who gave the pardons was a democrat and is being vilified.

When Trump pardons you right wing partisans were applauding it. Even when the idea of Trump pardoning is floated you people applaud.

But a democrat does the same thing an you people lose your minds.
Click to expand...

His pardon is meaningless. It will not protect them from deportation.
 
ludin said:
Actually no he didn't deportation are federal charges not state. He gave them pardons for no reason.
If anything they just plead guilty to the crimes they committed which means teycwill still get deported.

State governments have no legal authority over immigration.
Click to expand...

I seriously disagree. Jerry Brown does not do things for "no reason". He thumbed his nose at the federal government with political purpose in mind.
 
NonoBadDog said:
The guy Trump pardoned was a veteran. These guys that Brown pardoned are wife beaters, armed robbers, and a car thief. I can see why he pardoned them. His goal is to do as much to piss the right off as possible, regardless of the damage they might do to anyone else.
Click to expand...

There is no one doing more damage than Trump. You are just too blinded by your partisanship to pay enough attention.
 
Kreton said:
There is no one doing more damage than Trump. You are just too blinded by your partisanship to pay enough attention.
Click to expand...

Really what is so worse now than before?
Nothing.
 
Kreton said:
There is no one doing more damage than Trump. You are just too blinded by your partisanship to pay enough attention.
Click to expand...

I suspected that all you would have to offer is TDS rhetoric.
 
Kal'Stang said:
Pardons if accepted means they accept guilt. So no, it won't be a strong case for their lawyers. If anything Brown just ensured that they will be deported.
Click to expand...

Nice try, except that the persons pardoned have already be found guilty and have served time. The pardons merely serve to expunge their records, protecting their residency should they ever get stopped for a traffic violate. My guess is we will see some more of this to protect law abiding and productive members of our society.... and, to let Trump know his power has limits. Besides, it is a state matter.

apdst said:
He pardoned people convicted of serious crimes, for kidnapping and robbery and for beating their wives.

Nice guys he let back on the streets, just to make a political statement.
Click to expand...

....more than 20 years ago.... time has been served. The pardon only served to expunge the record (from a practical standpoint) to protect their residency status.
 
Last edited:
upsideguy said:
Nice try, except that the persons pardoned have already be found guilty and have served time. The pardons merely serve to expunge their records and thus protect their residency. My guess is we will see some more of this to let Trump know his power has limits. Besides, it is a state matter.
Click to expand...

Illegal immigration is not a state matter. Its a federal matter. And pardons do not expunge records, it merely seals them so that regular joe blows like you and me cannot access the records, the federal government may still access them. Also pardons can be issued at any time, even before a conviction in court has happened.
 
VanceMack said:
:lamo

Dear sweet baby hay Zeus. And the leftists in this country cant IMAGINE why their communities mare so ****ed up.

-Chhan was convicted of two counts of misdemeanor domestic violence in 2002.
-Pheach was convicted of possessing drugs and obstructing a police officer in 2005 and served six months in jail.
-Daniel Maher, who was convicted in 1995 of kidnapping, robbery and being a felon in possession of a firearm and served five years in prison.
-Daniel Mena and Francisco Acevedo Alaniz, but their home countries were not immediately known. Mena was convicted in 2003 of possessing illegal drugs.

The term cutting off your nose to spite your face comes to play. You are so invested in your hatred of Trump that you celebrate keeping and releasing these types of folk back into your communities.

Good job!
Click to expand...

First degrees should go first!
 
Kal'Stang said:
Illegal immigration is not a state matter. Its a federal matter. And pardons do not expunge records, it merely seals them so that regular joe blows like you and me cannot access the records, the federal government may still access them. Also pardons can be issued at any time, even before a conviction in court has happened.
Click to expand...

Entry into the Union, is also a federal matter. All foreign nationals in the US should have a federal id. A simple fee or fine, can make that happen via applied Capitalism.
 
upsideguy said:
The pardon only served to expunge the record (from a practical standpoint) to protect their residency status.
Click to expand...
Pardons do not expunge the record.
 
Taylor said:
Pardons do not expunge the record.
Click to expand...

As you will note I described it as from a "practical standpoint"; "as if". The pardon, however, absolves you of a crime and returns your status to as if the crime never happened. IOW, these men are no longer criminals. They would be relieved of the prospect (from a practical standpoint) of being picked-up and deported if stopped for a traffic infraction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon
 
upsideguy said:
Nice try, except that the persons pardoned have already be found guilty and have served time. The pardons merely serve to expunge their records, protecting their residency should they ever get stopped for a traffic violate. My guess is we will see some more of this to protect law abiding and productive members of our society.... and, to let Trump know his power has limits. Besides, it is a state matter.
....more than 20 years ago.... time has been served. The pardon only served to expunge the record (from a practical standpoint) to protect their residency status.
Click to expand...

They have no residency status. This won't protect them from anything. If anything, it called attention to these individuals.

Four people are just a fraction of those who fall into this category -- people here illegally who have also committed crimes and served time. This is a case where the governor (a) didn't think about this, and just wanted to continue to rack up more pardons for his 'legacy', or (b) wanted to give the federal government the middle finger. Either of which is not good governance.
 
Kal'Stang said:
Illegal immigration is not a state matter. Its a federal matter. And pardons do not expunge records, it merely seals them so that regular joe blows like you and me cannot access the records, the federal government may still access them. Also pardons can be issued at any time, even before a conviction in court has happened.
Click to expand...

The pardon absolves people of a crime, making someone that was once a felon, no longer a felon. The conviction is eradicated from the record. This will protect these individuals from needlessly being caught up in system of deportation.

https://definitions.uslegal.com/p/pardon/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon

Immigration maybe a federal matter, but these pardons are a state matter as they were state crimes. If cleaning up the records of these individuals moves them to the back the ICE priority list, kudos to Jerry Brown for using his powers in the spirit of fairness and justice.

States do, indeed, have the right (and even the obligation) to use their powers to protect their citizens from the wrath of a tyrannical federal government.
 
Last edited:
upsideguy said:
The pardon absolves people of a crime, making someone that was once a felon, no longer a felon. The conviction is eradicated from the record. This will protect these individuals from needlessly being caught up in system of deportation.

https://definitions.uslegal.com/p/pardon/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon

Immigration maybe a federal matter, but these pardons are a state matter as they were state crimes. If cleaning up the records of these individuals moves them to the back the ICE priority list, kudos to Jerry Brown for using his powers in the spirit of fairness and justice.

States do, indeed, have the right (and even the obligation) to use their powers to protect their citizens from the wrath of a tyrannical federal government.
Click to expand...

Guess California is different. :shrug: Tell me, what did these men do that proved "exemplary behavior"?

However it should be noted that it doesn't "absolve" people of a crime. It merely "forgives" the crime. Your own article states that.

But lets face facts here. The only reason that Brown is doing this has absolutely nothing to do with the actual reasons for Pardons. He's simply doing it to thumb his nose at Trump and federal law.

BTW, you talk about spirit of fairness and justice....where is the spirit of fairness and justice in letting illegals stay in the US even though many people have gone through the proper channels and are now living in the US legally? Where's the fairness in pardoning convicted felons just to thumb your nose at your political opponent and the law?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom