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Federal government shuts down after Senate talks fail

Lord of Planar said:
Yep, the democrats are 100% to blame for the shutdown. The DACA still has two months before it needs renewal.
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What I find incredible is that Trump told them how to grant amnesty to the millions of the illegals currently "in-house".

All he's asking is that the policies that created the current situation be remedied.

The folks that are currently here and that are under the threat of being expelled are looking at one idea from Trump that is proposing a permanent legalization of their presence. The other idea from the Dems proposes maintaining the former, extra legal, situation that can be revoked at any moment.

Once again, the Democrats depend on their weak minded supporters to believe their lies in the face of rational, logical alternatives that are actually helpful for those that need the help.
 
A passage in the FIRE AND FURY book describes what led to this shutdown perfectly.

Politics had seemed to become, even well before the ago of Trump, a mortal affair. It was now zero-sum: When one side profited, another lost. One side's victory was another's death. The old notion that politics was a trader's game, an understanding that somebody else had something you wanted - a vote, goodwill, old-fashioned patronage- and that in the end the only issue was cost, had gone out of fashion. Now it was a battle between good and evil.
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That seems to sum up the state of Washington politics perfectly.
 
Fletch said:
Do you always answer a question with a question?
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So, Mexico isn't paying for the wall, right?

Just curious because that's what Trump campaigned on. And from your previous post, we know that you care about that. So, how do you feel about Trump campaigning on Mexico paying for the wall, and now you have to pay for it?

Not sure what Trump's kerfluffle is, since Mexico is supposed to pay.. it's what he campaigned on. Right, we care about that?? Or, was everything he campaigned on a bunch of BS?
 
Fletch said:
What the polss say doesn't matter. Its what the facts say that counts. DACA has nothing to do with funding the government. Democrats want it included as a price for funding the government. So it is they who are shutting the government down. You guys care more about people here illegally than you do about American citizens. That's whats going on.
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Sorry, the reason the CR was done in December to go to January was to have time to resolve the DACA issue. Everyone knew it was a condition precedent. Trump sabotaged the two deals that would have solved the problem.

The Republicans actually like the CR process because it keeps spending in check.

I do agree what the polls say right now doesn't matter, but what they say one week from now is the whole ball game. We will see where this goes..... but this will likely fall on Trump for his complete inability to lead (which means he has to deal with Democrats). Other than the few that think Trump can do know wrong, this will go on Trump and then the Republicans.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Do you really believe that republicants will refuse to cave on DACA? Those slime balls are busy drafting DACA as we speak because polls and Trump know that it is currently popular (a must do thing). Sure, the republicants will add this and that to "their" DACA bill (claiming it to be immigration reform - titled as something other than DACA) but a DACA bill (coverting up to 25% of current "illegal" immigrants to legal status) will be passed with few, if any, major strings attached and the demorats know this to be true.
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Didn't happen yet.

Trump sent Lindsay and Little Dick packing.

Trump must have a wall to sign an acceptable agreement.

No signature, no agreement.

Nobody can EVER win a negotiation if they are not willing just walk away. that possibility exists and THAT is why Little Dick Durbin is playing so dirty.

He knows he has an agreement ready to go and he's burning it up. He's an ideologue with no interest in those he claims to be working for. He is using them to advance a political goal.

He is the lowest grade of scum there is in Washington DC and THAT is saying something!
 
EnigmaO01 said:
Or I will be one of those the boy who cried wolf things.

I believe our credit rating was downgraded last time this happened? Not sure that is nothing as it ends up costing us more.
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The USA is printing the "coin of the realm" used by the world.
 
Fletch said:
What the polss say doesn't matter. Its what the facts say that counts. DACA has nothing to do with funding the government. Democrats want it included as a price for funding the government. So it is they who are shutting the government down. You guys care more about people here illegally than you do about American citizens. That's whats going on.
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Sorry. Y'all just gutted tax revenue with the tax bill.

You don't care about the government being able to fund itself. You want no government employees except cops and soldiers.

So why aren't you cheering about all the money you're saving every day the feds are shut down?
 
Greenbeard said:
And these incompetents couldn't get 60, could they? Hence their astounding inability to keep their own government open.



You're going to run with the narrative that the Dems oppose funding CHIP? After the GOP Congress let its funding lapse for the first time in its history months ago so they could dangle those kids' health as a bargaining chip the following year? Disgusting.
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Well, that is what actually happened.

The Democrats had the chance to vote in favor of funding CHiP and they refused to do so.

How do YOU explain this refusal?
 
Captain Adverse said:
"Currently popular" with who? Not me.

The people who find it "popular" never voted Republican and didn't vote for Trump.

That said, people should realize that Trump himself is not against DACA. He isn't and never was a "racist," despite all efforts to label him one.

He just wants to use it as leverage to get his own immigration goals passed.
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That is, after all, what a compromise is.
 
Greenbeard said:
The deal-maker can't get deals done. This has been glaringly apparent for the entirety of the past year. His pathetic failure to keep his own government open with unified control is just the cherry on top.

It was a nice hail mary from disillusioned voters who bought into the fabricated image, but it's time to admit the mistake and do better next time.
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How's your 401K doing?
 
code1211 said:
Well, that is what actually happened.

The Democrats had the chance to vote in favor of funding CHiP and they refused to do so.

How do YOU explain this refusal?
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That's an easy one to explain. The GOP let the program lapse in order to use it as a bargaining chip. disgusting GOP politics 101.
 
code1211 said:
Well, that is what actually happened.

The Democrats had the chance to vote in favor of funding CHiP and they refused to do so.

How do YOU explain this refusal?
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What happened is that the GOP defunded one of the most bipartisanly popular programs in existence so they could hold the kids hostage months later. As I said, disgusting.
 
upsideguy said:
Sorry, the reason the CR was done in December to go to January was to have time to resolve the DACA issue. Everyone knew it was a condition precedent. Trump sabotaged the two deals that would have solved the problem.

The Republicans actually like the CR process because it keeps spending in check.

I do agree what the polls say right now doesn't matter, but what they say one week from now is the whole ball game. We will see where this goes..... but this will likely fall on Trump for his complete inability to lead (which means he has to deal with Democrats). Other than the few that think Trump can do know wrong, this will go on Trump and then the Republicans.
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The democrats will come out on the short end of the stick on this one. DACA has nothing to do with funding the government. When there is a bill on the table to fund the government and the dems refuse to do so because they care more about people here illegally than they do American citizens, they will have to fold. That said, just because the dems have the losing hand doesn't mean the GOP wont be bluffed into folding first, however.
 
code1211 said:
The Republicans have been working against Trump since he rode the escalator down to announce he was going to run.
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oh sure; that's why he is in the White House :roll: .................
 
What if...? said:
Sorry. Y'all just gutted tax revenue with the tax bill.

You don't care about the government being able to fund itself. You want no government employees except cops and soldiers.

So why aren't you cheering about all the money you're saving every day the feds are shut down?
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The government shutting down for a few days doesn't bother me one way or another. The point being discussed is WHY it is being shut down and who is responsible. Dems are responsible, they just lack the guts to admit it.
 
code1211 said:
Didn't happen yet.

Trump sent Lindsay and Little Dick packing.

Trump must have a wall to sign an acceptable agreement.

No signature, no agreement.

Nobody can EVER win a negotiation if they are not willing just walk away. that possibility exists and THAT is why Little Dick Durbin is playing so dirty.

He knows he has an agreement ready to go and he's burning it up. He's an ideologue with no interest in those he claims to be working for. He is using them to advance a political goal.

He is the lowest grade of scum there is in Washington DC and THAT is saying something!
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Wait two months (max) and you will see it for yourself.
 
Greenbeard said:
Here's an empirical data point for you, buddy: he's one year in with majorities in both chambers of Congress and the government is closed.

Pretending he's even a bad deal-maker would be vastly overstating his abilities.
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DJI up from about 18,000 to about 26,000 since the election. The fastest, biggest run up in history.

The Dems and you, apparently, don't seem to like that nearly 8 Trillion dollars of wealth have been created for the American people since the election.

I personally saw a 2.5% increase in "take home" on my most recent paycheck. My 401K is rising at a rate that I thought was impossible a couple years back.

The Dems oppose what is good for American individuals. Things like increased personal wealth, increased take home, increased opportunity, increased jobs, increased household incomes and renewal of CHIP.

Trump wants to MAGA. Democrats, and some Republicans, what to Make America Average Again. They really need to copyright that slogan...

I've got a feeling most Americans want to be great again. I suppose we'll find out which goal is preferred by most in November.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
DACA is popular according to many opinion polls - "dreamers" have been successfully sold as potential super-citizens by the MSM. Rest assured that there will be no distinction made using Obama's magic date of arriving as a minor before 6/15/07 rendering a 2 year old illegal immigrant arriving on 6/16/07 deportable. I also fully expect a DAPA component to be added - we simply can't have "dreamy" minors living here without legalizing their currently illegal guardians.

Trump just wants to say that he "won". If that means DACA and DAPA come along with funding the Great Wall of Trump (which he claimed that Mexico would pay for, BTW) then so be it (which is why he "extended" Obama's DACA EO). Trump has been telling republicant congress critters to pass anything and to call it immigration reform to get that Great Wall of Trump "win".
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Trump is re-framing the debate.

This is a high profile method to do just that.
 
code1211 said:
DJI up from about 18,000 to about 26,000 since the election. The fastest, biggest run up in history.

The Dems and you, apparently, don't seem to like that nearly 8 Trillion dollars of wealth have been created for the American people since the election.

I personally saw a 2.5% increase in "take home" on my most recent paycheck. My 401K is rising at a rate that I thought was impossible a couple years back.

The Dems oppose what is good for American individuals. Things like increased personal wealth, increased take home, increased opportunity, increased jobs, increased household incomes and renewal of CHIP.

Trump wants to MAGA. Democrats, and some Republicans, what to Make America Average Again. They really need to copyright that slogan...

I've got a feeling most Americans want to be great again. I suppose we'll find out which goal is preferred by most in November.
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What does this have to do with the GOP trying to strip health insurance from children to strengthen a bargaining hand?
 
Greenbeard said:
Great, so shutting down the government is Trump making a good deal.

Run with that.
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Actually, Schumer shut down the government. The Republicans offered a deal that was filled with programs the Dems claim to support.

So, if you're looking for someone to condemn...
 
Winston said:
Trump shares culpability for the shutdown. To pretend he doesn't is asinine.

They had bipartisan legislation worked out & Trump rejected it. Trump should learn how to compromise and not see the world in a black & white "who's winning and who's losing." lens. To view the world that way is puerile and one dimensional.
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What was that bi-partisan legislation?

Was there actually a bill brought before either house of Congress?

Was the entire group of 6 legislators who met with Trump and were instructed to hammer out a deal on DACA involved in the back room deal cooked up by Lindsay and Little Dick?

Do you have any idea at all what you're talking about?
 
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