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Net neutrality comments mostly came from bots and fake email addresses, Pew finds

The Mark said:
The internet is not a democracy, but is rather at tool which can be used to further democratic efforts, especially those often called "grass roots".

It's much easier to communicate ideas and messages using the internet than with any prior form of communication.
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Indeed. But the Democracy has actually lasted a while without the internet.

But it brings up a pretty interesting question I heard yesterday that made me think of this argument: If we assume that the Internet is such a necessity in American Democracy, and that giving an ISP potential control over political content access is a bad, then should Net Neutrality be applied to even larger internet outlets that serve far more customers than even the largest ISP? In other words, would NN supporters support similar FCC regulations for Search Engines and Social Media sites?
 
The Mark said:
I know for sure that I've left unique comments with the FCC.

But that doesn't mean people who signed on to a prewritten comment have invalid opinions.
It seems like it'd be hard to determine which of these identical comments are completely fake, when we have likely real comments (or at least agreement with a prewritten comment) identical in large numbers as well.

I mean, unless you contact everyone who left a comment, and even then some of those individuals might not remember signing something online.
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Yeah, hard to say for sure, but when people hear "bot" they tend to think of a machine multiplying the power of just one or two individuals (the programmers). But actually, there are lots of agencies who send like-minded people prepared statements and ask them to sign their name and click a button, or who host a website for people to do the same. So while each of those identical statements is indeed identical, like-minded voters have sent each one.

In principle, it ought to be easy to tell whether a person sent a comment, or a machine. The article does make this all-important point:

This doesn't delegitimize the public comments, Pew says. "Nor is there anything inherently wrong or sinister about bulk filing of comments," the researchers say in the report. "This analysis simply highlights the scale at which digital tools are being brought to bear in the long-standing practice of commenting on proposed government rules."
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In other words, it appears that people are busy enough to prefer sending a statement someone else prepared, as long as the general message is that same.
 
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jmotivator said:
Indeed. But the Democracy has actually lasted a while without the internet.

But it brings up a pretty interesting question I heard yesterday that made me think of this argument: If we assume that the Internet is such a necessity in American Democracy, and that giving an ISP potential control over political content access is a bad, then should Net Neutrality be applied to even larger internet outlets that serve far more customers than even the largest ISP? In other words, would NN supporters support similar FCC regulations for Search Engines and Social Media sites?
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Part of the reason we're in the trouble we are is because social media sites tailor the content you see and that is suggested to you to what you're interested in, which perpetuates a feeling of inclusiveness and belonging when none actually exists.

We're going to have to reckon with the unreality bubbles some currently live in at some point, although I think Trump is one example of that already happening.

As for search engines, I don't know that I fully trust them either, but they're what we have right now.
I think on non-political topics they are probably ok, but I worry that political topics are or will be suppressed if they do not fit what that search engine company wants.
It could be done subtly to - just push that pesky story onto the 2nd or 3rd page of results.

Maybe I'm paranoid.
 
CMPancake said:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech...and-fake-email-addresses-pew-finds/904439001/

Repealing Net Neutrality: An idea so popular, Anti-Net Neutrality supporters have to create fake bots to support it.



On top of this, the random DDoS attacks six months ago on the FCC website to shut down sending public comments to the FCC (which the FCC refused to cooperate with investigations into the DDoS attacks) and of course presenting the repeal of Net Neutrality during Thanksgiving to avoid massive public backlash it paints a very clear admission of guilt that the FCC knows that repealing Net Neutrality will harm consumers and only stand to benefit a handful of Telecom companies that can control what you can access on the internet.
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It might just be me, but hasn't the internet grown and expanded pretty well without the regulation mandated by net neutrality?

Why is this needed?
 
code1211 said:
It might just be me, but hasn't the internet grown and expanded pretty well without the regulation mandated by net neutrality?
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Internet within the United States has not grown or expanded nearly as well as it has in other countries that give NN reverence like South Korea, Norway, and Switzerland. Among first world nations, the United States ranks near the bottom in speed, and that's mostly at the fault of ISPs because they refuse to improve service due to the fact that many of them face no competition in most of the country.

code1211 said:
Why is this needed?
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Why are any laws needed? Why are speed limits needed? Why are fire codes needed? Why does the state forbid water companies from forcing customers to pay extra for "premium water" or else they'll have to settle for Flint Michigan water? The protections are absolutely important to protect consumers from shady business practices.
 
code1211 said:
It might just be me, but hasn't the internet grown and expanded pretty well without the regulation mandated by net neutrality?

Why is this needed?
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To end me paying $100 a month for internet access, when I only use $10 dollars worth, the other $90 of my bill is to subsidize the users who use more than $100 a month.
 
CMPancake said:
Internet within the United States has not grown or expanded nearly as well as it has in other countries that give NN reverence like South Korea, Norway, and Switzerland. Among first world nations, the United States ranks near the bottom in speed, and that's mostly at the fault of ISPs because they refuse to improve service due to the fact that many of them face no competition in most of the country.



Why are any laws needed? Why are speed limits needed? Why are fire codes needed? Why does the state forbid water companies from forcing customers to pay extra for "premium water" or else they'll have to settle for Flint Michigan water? The protections are absolutely important to protect consumers from shady business practices.
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Am I currently suffering the dire consequence you predict?
 
NoParty said:
To end me paying $100 a month for internet access, when I only use $10 dollars worth, the other $90 of my bill is to subsidize the users who use more than $100 a month.
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With respect, you are paying way too much.

Do you live in the outback?
 
code1211 said:
Am I currently suffering the dire consequence you predict?
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No, namely because the internet (at least until December 4th) is protected as a utility. If you live in a area where you only have two or one ISPs to shop for you're going to get hosed by the repeal of Net Neutrality.
 
iliveonramen said:
Those comments wouldn't make a difference anyway.
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Nothing makes a difference. This is not a democracy, it is an oligarchy, a fascist state. That has never been so obvious as it is with DJT "draining the swamp". In reality he is expanding the swamp to include his sycophants and business associates.
 
CMPancake said:
No, namely because the internet (at least until December 4th) is protected as a utility. If you live in a area where you only have two or one ISPs to shop for you're going to get hosed by the repeal of Net Neutrality.
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Well, I currently live in Indianapolis, so there's all kinds of choices to love or hate.

My use of the internet is pretty mundane and not very creative. i don't make movies or that kind of thing so my experience is not so very exotic.

I have friends who live in the out back and have one option and they are at the mercy of the limitations included in that option.

IF there is only one option available, how would net Neutrality benefit or hurt?

IF there is a plethora of options from which to choose, how would net Neutrality benefit or hurt?

Every time I order anything on the web, I am presented with the option to buy real fast shipping time or accept the regular, slower cheap option. Is that what we're talking about?
 
code1211 said:
With respect, you are paying way too much.

Do you live in the outback?
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Lol, that’s not the amount of my bill. Just using easy numbers for illustration. The point was that 90% of my bill goes to pay for someone else’s internet access, aka net neutrality aka net socialism.
 
NoParty said:
Lol, that’s not the amount of my bill. Just using easy numbers for illustration. The point was that 90% of my bill goes to pay for someone else’s internet access, aka net neutrality aka net socialism.
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Ah-Ha!

I like real numbers from real life to illustrate things.

I've been bamboozled too many times.
 
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