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Church denies First Communion to fashion-loving girl because she wanted to wear a suit

A religious denomination is simply a group of people who have reached a consensus on how they want to worship. That freedom is a Constitutional right. And they can set up whatever rules that suit them regarding their customs and traditions. Being a Catholic means agreeing to abide by the customs and traditions of the Catholic church. If you wish to oppose that break away and start your own denomination; that's been done several times over the centuries. And you won't even get burned at the stake for it anymore; so the door is open, start your own religion or join one that allows girls to wear whatever they want at First Communion. Being a Jew means abiding by and following the traditions and customs of the branch of Judaism that one adheres to. You are also free to leave that denomination at will. You are free to forgo worshiping altogether.

I'm an atheist but often go to Catholic mass with my wife. She prefers the Latin mass, so she wears a nice dress and a head covering. I wear a suit, at least sport coat. That's the tradition. No jeans and Tee shirts. I'm not arrogant enough to demand they change their customs just because I don't like dressing up.
 
earthworm said:
NOT the right thing to do ..If any organization has unreasonable rules, that group should try to change them , NOT evict members ..
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The church didn't evict anyone....It was the parents, or to be more succinct, the mother that flew off the handle and stormed out, then went straight to the media in hopes of shaming that church into accommodating her...Now, personally I think that the Priest of that church should not have gone to the "bad parenting" aspect, but let's not fool ourselves, the is a political stunt pulled by the mother, using her own daughter to achieve it...It is not very good.
 
j-mac said:
The church didn't evict anyone....It was the parents, or to be more succinct, the mother that flew off the handle and stormed out, then went straight to the media in hopes of shaming that church into accommodating her...Now, personally I think that the Priest of that church should not have gone to the "bad parenting" aspect, but let's not fool ourselves, the is a political stunt pulled by the mother, using her own daughter to achieve it...It is not very good.
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But we don't even know what the priest really said, only what the mom said he said to her husband.
 
nota bene said:
But we don't even know what the priest really said, only what the mom said he said to her husband.
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Absolutely, which is why this is nothing more than a political stunt by the mom....Instead of going above the Priests head to the diocese, she went straight to a progressive FB site for support, and went to the media.
 
apdst said:
Jesus would say that men are men and women are women.
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That's because Jesus was educated by ignorant religious fanatics. If he were born today, he could be taught about the gender spectrum.
 
D_NATURED said:
That's because Jesus was educated by ignorant religious fanatics. If he were born today, he could be taught about the gender spectrum.
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Actually, He's God.
 
D_NATURED said:
That's because Jesus was educated by ignorant religious fanatics. If he were born today, he could be taught about the gender spectrum.
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I doubt it since he was educated by God...Jesus set the proper example by basing his teachings on God’s Word...in prayer to his heavenly Father, he said...

“Your word is truth.” John 17:17

Jesus believed the Word of God, and everything he taught harmonized with the Scriptures.

Jesus often said: “It is written.” Matthew 4:4, 7, 10
 
apdst said:
Actually, He's God.
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Then he's not all-knowing because transgendered people weren't invented recently. The whole binary gender dogma is but one of the ways the Jesus character would seem as laughably ignorant as many of his followers seem today. He had an excuse, though, because the time he lived in was not secular and science was primitive to say the least.

Religious fanatics have done a good job, over the years, of shoving people into boxes and then declaring them to be naturally box shaped. Apparently, that's easier than actually understanding the variable human condition. Alas, the depth of ignorance that the religious display is a sad testament to their apathy toward those they view through their narrow, god lens.
 
Elvira said:
I doubt it since he was educated by God...Jesus set the proper example by basing his teachings on God’s Word...in prayer to his heavenly Father, he said...

“Your word is truth.” John 17:17

Jesus believed the Word of God, and everything he taught harmonized with the Scriptures.

Jesus often said: “It is written.” Matthew 4:4, 7, 10
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Thanks for proving my point. All Jesus had to go on was religious material that we find horribly ignorant today. You realize, don't you, that scripture is a lousy source of facts?
 
The topic is Cady Mansell and her pantsuit for First Communion.
 
Elvira said:
I think it is a matter of respect for where you are and in who's presence you are in...I don't like to see women or men dress down to go to God's house...
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And see? I'm the opposite. I compete on alot of weekends and we have 'cowboy church'. Come as you are, in the outdoors, on bleachers, on your horse, in jeans and boots, dusty, whatever. And listen to and share God's Word.

As a child, my family camped alot and we attended many wonderful services outdoors. Casually dressed.

IMO your trappings have nothing to do with how you hold God in your heart. And if you are willing to commune with others and share it.
 
JANFU said:
Did Jesus have a dress code?
Should a Church prevent someone from entering based upon dress codes?
Those that have the, and I include this one mentioned in the OP, have strayed far afield from his teachings.
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I dunno but he was wearing a dress so...?

How sure are we that this young lady was wrong, despite thousands of years of inept Catholic interpretation of His Word?
 
Elvira said:
I would not consider wearing pants...I like to dress like the woman that I am...
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How nice for 'you.'

I am no less a woman in boots and jeans. If you feel less like a woman based on your dress, that's up to you.
 
JANFU said:
Missing the point.
Should communions,attending church have a dress code?
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I'll have to go with 'it's up to that church' here, whether I like it or not.

And by the same token, if this is an indication of their love and acceptance of others...rules over acceptance, then IMO the young lady would be smart to realize it and find a church more accommodating to her beliefs.
 
apdst said:
They were the only poor folks in the area?

At the church I grew up in, overalls were considered "dressed up".
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So it's only about gender roles then? You're sure God objects to women in pants?

Hmm. He sure didnt seem to object to men in dresses. He let His Son run around in them.
 
countryboy said:
She wanted to dress like one of the boys. Why?
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Wearing pants is 'wanting to dress like one of the boys?'


Or just being practical about what's comfortable? Or what about wearing what you like? Or wearing what looks nice on you?

Do you think that men in kilts 'want to dress like one of the girls?'
 
Lursa said:
And see? I'm the opposite. I compete on alot of weekends and we have 'cowboy church'. Come as you are, in the outdoors, on bleachers, on your horse, in jeans and boots, dusty, whatever. And listen to and share God's Word.

As a child, my family camped alot and we attended many wonderful services outdoors. Casually dressed.

IMO your trappings have nothing to do with how you hold God in your heart. And if you are willing to commune with others and share it.
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Indeed, so many only have outward piety when the inside is rotting.
 
D_NATURED said:
Then he's not all-knowing because transgendered people weren't invented recently. The whole binary gender dogma is but one of the ways the Jesus character would seem as laughably ignorant as many of his followers seem today. He had an excuse, though, because the time he lived in was not secular and science was primitive to say the least.

Religious fanatics have done a good job, over the years, of shoving people into boxes and then declaring them to be naturally box shaped. Apparently, that's easier than actually understanding the variable human condition. Alas, the depth of ignorance that the religious display is a sad testament to their apathy toward those they view through their narrow, god lens.
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Actually, "transgender" was invented since then, because a person is either a man, or a woman. That's a biological fact.
 
D_NATURED said:
Thanks for proving my point. All Jesus had to go on was religious material that we find horribly ignorant today. You realize, don't you, that scripture is a lousy source of facts?
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You realize, don't you, not everyone thinks like you do? there is more wisdom and knowledge within the pages of the Bible than many humans can handle, since God is the source of wisdom and knowledge...

"The fear of Jehovah is the beginning of knowledge.
Only fools despise wisdom and discipline." Proverbs 1:7

"The heavens are declaring the glory of God;
The skies above* proclaim the work of his hands.
Day after day their speech bubbles forth,
And night after night they reveal knowledge." Psalm 19:1,2

"Do you know how the clouds float?
These are the wonderful works of the One perfect in knowledge." Job 37:16
 
apdst said:
Actually, "transgender" was invented since then, because a person is either a man, or a woman. That's a biological fact.
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Again, learning biology from the bible is like learning how to fly from Mary Poppins. Saying wrong **** over and over doesn't make you right, it makes you tenaciously ignorant.

There's lots of information on the web about the subject. Quit wasting everyone's time.
 
Elvira said:
You realize, don't you, not everyone thinks like you do? there is more wisdom and knowledge within the pages of the Bible than many humans can handle, since God is the source of wisdom and knowledge...

"The fear of Jehovah is the beginning of knowledge.
Only fools despise wisdom and discipline." Proverbs 1:7

"The heavens are declaring the glory of God;
The skies above* proclaim the work of his hands.
Day after day their speech bubbles forth,
And night after night they reveal knowledge." Psalm 19:1,2

"Do you know how the clouds float?
These are the wonderful works of the One perfect in knowledge." Job 37:16
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How do clouds float? Are you ****ting me? Clouds are water vapor, not magical floating objects. I don't fear Jehova but I'm scared ****less at the level of wilful ignorance he inspires. To whom would your post not seem like obsessive religiosity?

I am left speechless at the things you consider wisdom.
 
D_NATURED said:
How do clouds float? Are you ****ting me? Clouds are water vapor, not magical floating objects. I don't fear Jehova but I'm scared ****less at the level of wilful ignorance he inspires. To whom would your post not seem like obsessive religiosity?

I am left speechless at the things you consider wisdom.
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Swish...right over your head of the point made from these scriptures...SMH...I'm speechless...
 
Sometimes inspection isn't sufficient

apdst said:
Actually, "transgender" was invented since then, because a person is either a man, or a woman. That's a biological fact.
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Well, no, it isn't. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_assignment

"In approximately 1 in 2,000 infants, there is enough variation in the appearance of the external genitalia to merit hesitation about appropriate assignment by the physician involved.[19] Typical examples would be an unusually prominent clitoris in an otherwise apparently typical girl, or complete cryptorchidism in an otherwise apparently typical boy. In most of these cases, a sex is tentatively assigned and the parents told that tests will be performed to confirm the apparent sex. Typical tests in this situation might include a pelvic ultrasound to determine the presence of a uterus, a testosterone or 17α-hydroxyprogesterone level, and/or a karyotype. In some of these cases a pediatric endocrinologist is consulted to confirm the tentative sex assignment. The expected assignment is usually confirmed within hours to a few days in these cases.

"In a much smaller proportion of cases, the process of assignment is more complex, and involves both determining what the biological aspects of sex may be and choosing the best sex assignment for the purposes of rearing the child. Approximately 1 in 20,000[citation needed] infants is born with enough ambiguity that assignment becomes a more drawn-out process of multiple tests and intensive education of the parents about sexual differentiation. In some of these cases, it is clear that the child will face physical difficulties or social stigma as he or she grows up, and deciding upon the sex of assignment involves weighing the advantages and disadvantages of either assignment."

(My emphasis - more detail @ the URL)

So the determination of gender @ birth isn't as cut & dried as one would think - @ least, not in a small number of cases. But still, that's enough to test the rule.
 
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